TX - Juliet & Cavanaugh Ramirez, die in hot car, Weatherford, 26 May 2017 *Arrest*

[MzOpinion8d]

I agree with all you said, except your point #6. AFAIK the air temperature that is reported in weather news and on weather sites etc is always measured in sun and wind shade. So if the car was under trees/in the shade it would still have been 96 degrees outside temperature.

I might be wrong, or it is done differently in the States as I know it from Europe.

I think, mom was probably distracted. Maybe she was on (another) phone or online device, or she fell asleep, or something. Now she is trying to cover up her lack of attention. imo

96 degrees is still 96 degrees in sun or shade, but the difference is in how much the temperature increases inside the car in sun vs shade. It will heat up more quickly in direct sunlight.

 

[katydid23]

http://www.nbcdfw.com/news/local/Tw...nd-in-Hot-Car-in-Parker-County-424686924.html

This link says there will be a "lengthy investigation".

The home looks nice, the car is a nice newer car.

I think the girl could have helped the boy climb into the car. If they did have they keys, they probably pushed the buttons on the key fob and locked the doors.

The main issue is that they were clearly unsupervised for a long period of time. They had to get out of the house, to the car, in the car, and be in the car long enough to be deceased. Mom had to have been asleep or impaired in some way.

Given the time of day, they could have all been having an afternoon nap but the kids woke up first.

I'm interested in the outcome of the investigation. I feel so bad for their families.

BBM
That's what I am thinking too. Those babies are only 10 months apart. If she gave birth to both of them, she must be exhausted. She only had a month between pregnancies.

At first I thought she may have been drunk or on opiates. But if so, she would have been arrested by now, I believe.

I used to nap when my 2nd baby was an infant still. I was so tired by the time I picked the 4 yr old up from preschool, we'd all 3 take a nice nap. The baby was in her crib so no problem ---but sometimes my son did wake up before me. But the house was locked down tight---and he was never a wanderer or adventurer. He'd quietly play until I woke up.

But 27 months and 16 months---very young and very vulnerable ---I suppose they could have taken the cell and the keys and gone into the car while mom was still asleep...

BUT if they knew how to use the key fob to lock/unlock, why didn't they get out when they began getting hot?

 

[TiffanyL_AS]

My 18 month old has climbed into our Nissan Maxima and Subaru Outback with alarming ease. He also loves to play with my keys. So far he has only locked the vehicle repeatedly and not unlocked it. So, while I find some of this early reporting suspicious, i could also see a baby locking themselves inside without understanding how to get out.

My baby can't open the car door himself...yet, however. All children are different and have different skills though.

I'm so sad for these babies. I hope it wasn't murder.


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[perfectingpink]

I am wondering why the car wasn't reported to be in the driveway but was said to be on the property. That bothers me.

 

[perfectingpink]

Here is aerial footage of the scene. Nothing of great interest that I have seem so far but it shows what the area looks like.
https://www.facebook.com/arizonasfamily/videos/10154557193382014/

 

[Laughing]

No matter the outcome of the investigation, Mom and Dad will never be the same....

RIP Juliet and Cavanaugh; peace & rest for your family & all who love you!

 

[policyoftruth501]

I found an article saying she had turned 2 in February, so 27 months?

Wow. If that's the case those children are exactly 9 months apart. That's a real handful with no break or rest at all. It certainly takes a person with a LOT of patience. I keep getting the feeling that one of three things happened:

1. The mom went somewhere with the kids and the kids were accidentally left in the car when they got back home.

2. The mother was asleep, on the phone, or somehow distracted for a very long time (an hour or more). I don't think it was drugs or alcohol or the cops would have picked up on that when they showed up. I also don't think this scenario seems very likely. It just seems really far fetched for both kids. If they were a little older (4-6 age range or older) I would be more convinced, but 2 and 1/2 and 16 months just seems really off. And it still doesn't explain why the kids wouldn't just get out of the car if they got themselves in the car.

3. The mother intentionally left the kids in the car.


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[Wyle_E_Coyote]

My youngest could open up the front doors on our mini van when he was 20 months old or so. (This is the wild child I have tons of stories about.) He was even determined enough to figure out what key went into the ignition. How do I know? My husband was working under the hood of the van with several people around and baby boy opened the door and got in the driver's seat. No big deal as he was contained and easily seen. My husband took my keys out and let him play drive. What he didn't know is I had the spare keys in the van and that little stinker found the right key, put it in the ignition and turned it to accessory and put it in reverse. HORRIFYING!! Here is what ended up happening.
View attachment 117467
We sold the van, got one with shift lock and added never letting a child play in a vehicle no matter what to our ever growing list of things we needed to do to keep this child alive. So, I can understand how these 2 could get into the vehicle on their own. The story may not turn out to be what happened, but I do wholeheartedly believe it is plausible and I am assuming mom spent the 15 minutes looking for them. Yes, I would have called LE before then, but it sounds like the children were mimicking what they see by getting in the vehicle with the keys and phone. (I want this to be what happened because my heart cannot take another parent intentionally harming their children.)

Love this story and the caption!

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[mdeweese24]

Mom said that the kids were found with her car keys and phone in their hands. I find it hard to believe, among other things, that the kids would just sit down in a car seat and die. When they got hot, they would be crying and I would be shocked if they kept a hold of keys and phone. Very suspicious


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[skibaboo]

I'd like to know exactly where on the property the car was.

The kids having the keys and moms phone. Was she heading somewhere with the kids but forgot something and went back into the house taking a lot longer than expected?

Is hide and seek a cover story? She says they 'took off' To say that it implies they were seen leaving. Several red flags here, I have so many questions.

 

[FlossyMay]

I might be able to believe a 2 year old opened a car door and got inside, but how would they close the door? I have to reach out to close my car door and I have an adult arm. I can't see how this is possible. The phone and the keys bother me as well. I know I've seen many times in waiting rooms and parking lots, parents give these items to little kids to keep them entertained while they're waiting. This is very disturbing.

 

[skibaboo]

When I read the first few posts and quotes from the media I actually thought they were saying the kids got the keys and took off in the car and by the time mom caught up with the car they had died from the heat. That is how I read it. As I read on I understood that was not the case. "Took off" is really bothering me here, along with other statements.

 

[SCHMAE]

We were scorching yesterday all over the area. Actual temps between 95 and 100 but head index put the temps at 105 to 110.
FWIW I had a friend whose child did ' this' ( assuming this is fact) some years ago. She was closer to 3 1/2 or maybe 4 at the time. She was found quickly, long before she was ' too hot' or unresponsive. She had climbed in the car to play but was found quickly. So it can be done but I'm not sure about at age 2. How they can reach out and close a door without falling out is curious......to say the least. I think we will find the timeline is all off and they were ' out of sight' much longer than what's being reported. They had to have been.

 

[SCHMAE]

Was mom the only adult at the house at that time ? Or in the hours prior to that time?

 

[cuffem]

Has it been stated where she found the children in the car,front or back? If she accidentally left them they would have been in their car seats and a ME would be able to tell from blood pooling in the lower parts of their bodies.Maybe I watch to many forensic/crime shows.Plus a cadaver dog making a hit on seats.
I can not see a 2 y/o carrying keys and a phone in their hands and opening car door then helping a 16 month old into car.

 

[AC's Grandma]

I hope it isn't a tale the mom is telling. I know when I was almost 6 that my sister and brother, 3 1/2 and 2 climbed into my mom's station wagon had matches and lit the car on fire with them locked inside. The neighbors saw it happen and they got out. This was in 1971 so there were no cell phones and cars didn't have the security measures they do now. My mom had been in the kitchen making dinner. We lived in a 6 family apartment building. They had been playing in the yard. I don't know if the matches were the car or they had grabbed them off a table in the house. Both my parents were smokers so matches were easily accessible. Thankfully they weren't harmed but my parents' car was a loss. I can believe young children can do some things that we would never think possible.

 

[ninij9]

This is so sad!! Those poor babies.
I am also thinking cover up, like mom fell asleep or forgot them in the car. The story just doesn't add up.
Also here to attest to Houdini kids. I got one. My first 2 were angels in comparison! This one is a little monster. And I say that with love, haha. He climbs anything and everything. And now at 33 months can definitely get himself in the car and shut the door. He loads himself in thru the front seat and climbs to his carseat in the back. I do not take my eyes off him for more than a minute.
This is him 2 weeks before his 2nd birthday. I turned around for a second and he scaled it.

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Hilarious! My son was just the same. He's 17 now. As for operating key buttons, etc all my cousins toddlers have their own iPads in chunky cases and we're literally born playing with keys and what not. I've no doubt my now grown lil monster could have, unlocked, entered, relocked and hid in any car if he had wanted to. I ran my feet raw trying to keep him safe, slept on his floor from 7 months (he would climb out) he was walking (stumbling) at 9 mos swear to gosh, he was the best birth control on the market, lol.

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[bluesneakers]

This is so sad!! Those poor babies.
I am also thinking cover up, like mom fell asleep or forgot them in the car. The story just doesn't add up.
Also here to attest to Houdini kids. I got one. My first 2 were angels in comparison! This one is a little monster. And I say that with love, haha. He climbs anything and everything. And now at 33 months can definitely get himself in the car and shut the door. He loads himself in thru the front seat and climbs to his carseat in the back. I do not take my eyes off him for more than a minute.
This is him 2 weeks before his 2nd birthday. I turned around for a second and he scaled it.

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OMG your little guy is adorable. Even with his face hidden.

 

[shadowdancer]

I can easily believe that the 2 year old could open the car, and I wouldn't be surprised at all by the 16 month old being able to climb in. Remember that a child that age wouldn't step in, they would use their arms to pull themselves up and sort of crawl into the car floor.

One of my kids once climbed onto a chair and from there, onto the dining table. I had only left the room for a few mins to get a cup of tea and I came back to find him sitting on the table, happily eating grapes from the fruit bowl. He was 18 months, and that was a far bigger climb then climbing into a car.

Its the length of time they were alone that makes me suspicious. Maybe she had taken drugs and passed out or something and the kids were left to roam around the property by themselves. That might even explain why they went into the car - perhaps they wanted to get help for their mother.

 

[policyoftruth501]

I'm having a lot of trouble accepting the statement, "they took off". Kids that age can't run fast enough to outrun a grownup - not to the point that they can't be found. In this particular case, stopping to get the car unlocked, get the car door open, both kids climb inside, and then close the car door should have given the mom the advantage she needed to catch up to them if they got away from her. And, btw, wouldn't she hear the car door close if she was hot on their trail?! If she couldn't catch both of them she, at the very least, should have been able to catch one of them. To me, that one statement trips up her whole story. That statement makes it sound as though this all happened within a matter of a couple of minutes, which clearly could not have been the case.


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