TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #26

[erinp]

Yes, it's the guy (kind of short IMO) who runs into the store at the :27 mark. If I were to picture SP running, he would look something like this guy.

Again, the link is http://www.wfaa.com/news/crime/more-than-50-weapons-stolen-in-arlington-gun-store-burglary/124886520

i shouldn't laugh because it's a serious subject, but when I imagine SP running, I always end up with in my mind, a picture of a turtle lying on its back with its legs kicking in the air, unable to right itself.

 

[bluesneakers]

Random aside/OT: I can't remember exactly when it was discussed or if there was a conclusion reached about SP's helmet (I did some goggling and SWAT teams do use helmets like the one he/she is wearing) looking like a batter's helmet. I've been watching a Scandinavian cop show (The Bridge) and when Danish SWAT arrived on a scene they were wearing helmets that have the same ear guard. Not suggesting SP is Danish, but when I saw them I said "Just like SWAT perp's!"

 

[Deleted member 102539]

I have thought since day 1 that if SP is LE, it was not the worst idea ever b/c most of the headlines and conversations started with "a man dressed in police/swat gear" so most people assumed it was a regular person dressing up. Could be or not be but I'm not ruling it out just yet. FTR I am pro LE and come from a LE family, I am also aware that there are some bad ones there too!

IMO though

bbm

:thumb:

 

[Justice2016]

This video you linked actually shows me how different these two crimes are and highlight why I personally don't think MB was a robbery gone wrong. The video of what we know was a robbery, actually shows me what a robber would likely wear and how they would act. They are covered head to toe to avoid identification, BUT they are wearing clothing that is easy to move in. They are in what looks to be sweats and hoodies of some sort. They are also moving quickly. They are there for a reason. They come in to the building, running, and immediately get to work taking what they came for.

Great points. I think we can end the burglary debate with that. I hope so lol :kickcan:

 

[ocgrad]

Arrest made in church burglary case in Wood County!

http://www.kltv.com/story/32166790/deputies-arrest-suspect-in-etx-church-burglaries?sf28171398=1

Wonder how tall he is?

 

[Seriously?]

I am guessing there isn't a common response from someone who is LE as to how you would respond to this as everyone has different experiences, but as 1 more piece of input, my friend who is LE said they would never in a million years use a hammer - even if there were personal feelings involved. They said due to risk with close "combat" and knowing too much about how investigations work they would want quick in and out and a bit of distance. No up close and personal. They said the same of the theory of shooting her and then using the hammer. That is personal and their job allows them to be trained to leave emotion out of "the job" to accomplish the task at hand.

This question is best answered by attorney or LE, because I think interpretation of the crime fits in...........Isn't it a charging enhancement if a crime is committed while in possession of a weapon? Most folks whose particular talent is breaking/entering would probably know this. I think it's a lesser offense if weapon isn't used..............so, why risk it???

 

[MzOpinion8d]

something that has always intrigued me right from day 2 of this case, is that in the interview BB gave with fox4 news on the day after Missy's murder, he said at the 14:55 mark "to the best of my knowledge when my wife arrived there was no other vehicle in the parking lot". https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lnBJ17dtx48&feature=youtu.be

respectfully, how could he possibly know that? the police said right from the start there was no footage of outside, bar a shot where they had a car off in the distance with any details barely distinguishable.

i haven't seen anyone give any plausible explanation for how BB could have known that or even guessed at that.

IIRC, he completed that thought by saying if she had seen an unknown vehicle in the parking lot, she wouldn't have gone in the building. So it was an assumption on his part that she didn't see any other vehicles.

Unfortunately, I think he was wrong, because I think if she'd seen a vehicle parked in the lot she probably wouldn't have thought twice about it. Could be an early camper, could be someone whose car wouldn't start after church so they got a ride home, etc. I don't think Missy would have found it suspicious at all.

 

[erinp]

Arrest made in church burglary case in Wood County!

http://www.kltv.com/story/32166790/deputies-arrest-suspect-in-etx-church-burglaries?sf28171398=1

From that article: "When Marks was located, he was found with stolen property that had been taken from the two churches. Officials say that property included a number of animal trophy mounts and stereo equipment. "

Must not have escaped on foot. Imagine walking down the road and explaining that to a cop who asks what you're doing "oh just taking my stuffed bear's head out for a walk."

 

[erinp]

IIRC, he completed that thought by saying if she had seen an unknown vehicle in the parking lot, she wouldn't have gone in the building. So it was an assumption on his part that she didn't see any other vehicles.

Unfortunately, I think he was wrong, because I think if she'd seen a vehicle parked in the lot she probably wouldn't have thought twice about it. Could be an early camper, could be someone whose car wouldn't start after church so they got a ride home, etc. I don't think Missy would have found it suspicious at all.

with respect to your second paragraph, i agree with you. there could be any number of reasons why a car could be there. if you have a commitment to run a fitness class that morning, you don't turn up, see an unexpected car in the parking lot and turn around and drive home because it feels unsafe. nor would you ring LE "911 what's your emergency?" "um, there's a car in the carpark and i don't know whose it is. could you send someone out?". no, it doesn't make sense. you'd rationalise it in your mind, think there is a reasonable explanation for it, and go right ahead and open the church like you have every other time for weeks.

 

[lstiff]

Both are possible yes. I'm pro LE too but aware there are some rogue cops. No doubt the arrests of local LE around the same time for gun theft/sales has put LE under the spotlight.

Has anyone answered this question definitively?: why are the ATF, FBI, Texas rangers & MPD all working on the same case? Especially ATF. Would ATF usually be called in if someone was killed with a firearm? Are they sometimes called in if no firearm is used in a murder?

That's a high degree of collaboration I wouldn't think was normal - we hear so much about territoriality issues with any LE organisation. As someone from an LE family you'd know the answer better than me.

It has not been answered directly, no. I have asked at least 3 different LEOs that I know personally who work in 3 different states and all of them told me the same thing, ATF and FBI would be involved if it involves firearms or crosses state lines (short answer) We (here) found online a couple of broader explanations for their involvement which include, murder for hire, helping out local LE due to caseloads and a few other things. I did learn about the Texas Rangers on my own https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/texasrangers/and apparently they are some really impressive guys/gals! IMO personally, I do not believe they are "helping out MPD" to be nice, I think their involvement is much bigger but that is JMO. The Arlington PD is also involved and I believe they would be the ones helping solve (a single homicide) due to the size and inexperience in murder investigations (as stated somewhere-no link, sorry) by the MPD. It's all really confusing. IMO

 

[zoeneli]

This question is best answered by attorney or LE, because I think interpretation of the crime fits in...........Isn't it a charging enhancement if a crime is committed while in possession of a weapon? Most folks whose particular talent is breaking/entering would probably know this. I think it's a lesser offense if weapon isn't used..............so, why risk it???

The charges are definitely more severe when a weapon is involved. That being said (and I "think" this may vary by state), but knives, clubs, bricks, etc can all be considered deadly weapon.

I don't have my LE friend available right now, so speaking just from my own point of view, if it was committed by LE and they are there to kill someone to cover up this gun mess, I don't think LE would be considering the charges that would be brought if they were unsuccessful in killing MB, caught, and charged. I think all of the planning and thought processes would be around making sure they were successful and not caught. That goes back to the gun to keep it quick, with lack of confrontation.

 

[moonchild7]

This video you linked actually shows me how different these two crimes are and highlight why I personally don't think MB was a robbery gone wrong. The video of what we know was a robbery, actually shows me what a robber would likely wear and how they would act. They are covered head to toe to avoid identification, BUT they are wearing clothing that is easy to move in. They are in what looks to be sweats and hoodies of some sort. They are also moving quickly. They are there for a reason. They come in to the building, running, and immediately get to work taking what they came for.

I'm just imagining that the guy at the :27 mark in the gun store video could also be the swatperp (going along with the burglary gone wrong theory).

A perp's actions in a gun store burglary (pre-planned with accomplices) would be quite different than a solo perp's actions in a church burglary IMO.

When I have to go to the store for one thing, I go straight to the item, pay for it and leave. When I'm at the grocery store for a major shop, I take more time, go up and down the aisles, sometimes just looking. Both are shopping - just different scenarios.

 

[Glammie]

Wonder how tall he is?

This would be hours away from Creekside, not the perp, IMO.


Sent from my iPhone

 

[Seriously?]

The charges are definitely more severe when a weapon is involved. That being said (and I "think" this may vary by state), but knives, clubs, bricks, etc can all be considered deadly weapon.

I don't have my LE friend available right now, so speaking just from my own point of view, if it was committed by LE and they are there to kill someone to cover up this gun mess, I don't think LE would be considering the charges that would be brought if they were unsuccessful in killing MB, caught, and charged. I think all of the planning and thought processes would be around making sure they were successful and not caught. That goes back to the gun to keep it quick, with lack of confrontation.

Thank you. And I was mentioning this as a an argument against burglary. Nope - don't think LE would have those thought processes, either.

 

[Kamy]

There has been a lot of to and fro on these threads about whether this was obviously a break-and-enter-for-the-purpose-of-theft-gone-wrong vs. this was obviously a break-in-and-murder-missy-and-GTFO.

The one thing that keeps me coming back to the conclusion that the purpose of this exercise was murder is this:

if someone was to break into a place with the intent to commit robbery, surely you want to be able to get around quickly and easily. you want to be able to maneuver in and out of a window, you want to not overheat, you want to be able to hear noises so you don't get caught, you want to not be weighed down by heavy clothing. sure, you'd want to be disguised in case of cameras or being spotted.

but all black clothes and a black balaclava would do that. plus sneakers to get away fast.

why would you need a big fat heavy old helmet and thick padded vest and padded pants and boots? they'd just weigh you down. why would you need POLICE on your vest?

it is for this reason i believe the person was expecting a confrontation with another person. no other explanation makes sense to me.

Exactly! These are my thoughts as well.

I think the "Police" patch was to initially trick Missy into a false sense of security and let her guard down. All it takes is a split second for her to not to
feel threatened and the perp being ready for that, to strike and catch her off guard.

Also, I am just not thinking the perp is LE. Hubs and I have personal friends who are in All branches of LE and military...officers, detectives, and military guys
who have been to Iraq, A-stan, etc etc... and none of them - are as nonchalant as SP. I've gone over and over our past
get togethers...remembering their posture, strides, mannerisms etc.. None of them - if they were on a "mission/job" or "on" would ever go into a
situation like this...without that training that is always in the back of their minds. Even DEA and swat guys, I've seen them in uniform and out, and
while there IS a difference, once they get in gear and ready to go to work...their posture and mindset change, you can see it.
The closest I'd say it "could" be LE is...SP is retired and for me, thats a stretch.

Another thing I thought about is the way the SP's neck looks, that turtle neck effect....that "could" be due to the vest he/she has on.
When LE wears a BP vest, it distorts their overall size, especially the chest area and the back of the neck. That can look like a turtle
neck from behind so SP may not have that protruding frontal posture IRL..

The helmet, over dressing, and nonchalance all add up to a wanna be mental person on a specific mission, not burglary. JMO~

Disclaimer: I'm perfectly ready to eat crow if I have to...this is just my observations and experiences...in the real world, ya just never know. :thinking:

 

[lstiff]

Exactly! These are my thoughts as well.

I think the "Police" patch was to initially trick Missy into a false sense of security and let her guard down. All it takes is a split second for her to not to
feel threatened and the perp being ready for that, to strike and catch her off guard.

Also, I am just not thinking the perp is LE. Hubs and I have personal friends who are in All branches of LE and military...officers, detectives, and military guys
who have been to Iraq, A-stan, etc etc... and none of them - are as nonchalant as SP. I've gone over and over our past
get togethers...remembering their posture, strides, mannerisms etc.. None of them - if they were on a "mission/job" or "on" would ever go into a
situation like this...without that training that is always in the back of their minds. Even DEA and swat guys, I've seen them in uniform and out, and
while there IS a difference, once they get in gear and ready to go to work...their posture and mindset change, you can see it.
The closest I'd say it "could" be LE is...SP is retired and for me, thats a stretch.

Another thing I thought about is the way the SP's neck looks, that turtle neck effect....that "could" be due to the vest he/she has on.
When LE wears a BP vest, it distorts their overall size, especially the chest area and the back of the neck. That can look like a turtle
neck from behind so SP may not have that protruding frontal posture IRL..

The helmet, over dressing, and nonchalance all add up to a wanna be mental person on a specific mission, not burglary. JMO~

Disclaimer: I'm perfectly ready to eat crow if I have to...this is just my observations and experiences...in the real world, ya just never know. :thinking:

Great post! My SP profile is more twisted than a rollercoaster at this point so I really am not sure who is under that get up. I don't believe it is a current LEO but I have been wrong in the past. I think at most, it could be someone who was previously LE, wanted to be LE or tried and failed to be LE. Possibly someone with military experience.

JMO

 

[Sparky]

Let's stop with the sarcasm please.

This thread is for Missy, not to make jokes.

Thanks!

 

[ocgrad]

It has not been answered directly, no. I have asked at least 3 different LEOs that I know personally who work in 3 different states and all of them told me the same thing, ATF and FBI would be involved if it involves firearms or crosses state lines (short answer) We (here) found online a couple of broader explanations for their involvement which include, murder for hire, helping out local LE due to caseloads and a few other things. I did learn about the Texas Rangers on my own https://www.txdps.state.tx.us/texasrangers/and apparently they are some really impressive guys/gals! IMO personally, I do not believe they are "helping out MPD" to be nice, I think their involvement is much bigger but that is JMO. The Arlington PD is also involved and I believe they would be the ones helping solve (a single homicide) due to the size and inexperience in murder investigations (as stated somewhere-no link, sorry) by the MPD. It's all really confusing. IMO

From the ATF website: ATF's Comprehensive Crime Gun Tracing Initiative is the largest operation of its kind in the world. In FY07, ATF's National Tracing Center processed over 285,000 trace requests on guns for over 6,000 law enforcement agencies in 50 countries. ATF uses a Web-based system, known as eTrace, that provides law enforcement agencies with the capability to securely and electronically send trace requests, receive trace results, and conduct basic trace analysis in real time.
And this: ATF provides investigative support to its partners through the National Integrated Ballistic Information Network (NIBIN), which allows federal, state, and local law enforcement agencies to image and compare crime gun evidence. NIBIN currently has 203 sites. In FY07, NIBIN's 174 partner agencies imaged more than 183,000 bullets and casings into the database, resulting in over 5,200 matches that provided investigative leads.

So ATF could have been called in to trace a gun found at the scene, (certainly if that gun were already part of an illegal gun trafficking investigation). Or they could have identified a bullet to be matched with a gun. This serial # could have come from a gun recovered at the scene or a gun later found with a SW of a POI. Perhaps they had to bring in a dog to locate a bullet that was shot through a glass window.
And another note re ATF officers could have already been in Ellis County working on the stolen gun case.

 

[liloleme]

I would say you were right...IF....you weren't walking into holy ground and had a false sense of security. It is a church after all. You do not associate a single ounce of evil with a place like that. Advantage killer.

As someone who carries, it's just about impossible to conceal while exercising. Not to mention very few options for conceal carry exercise wear (yes there are conceal carry leggings, just not common).

So, even if she was wearing a conceal carry pair of leggings, what's she going to do with the gun during the class in order to secure it?

 

[No it's not]

Does anyone have a link where it says the workout that Monday morning was the last one at Creekside church and that they would change location?

Thanks!

-Nin