TX - Terri 'Missy' Bevers,45, murdered in church/person in SWAT gear,18 Apr 2016 #32

[Batbrat]

yes, yes,!!! not that complicated right? thanks for the backup.

Not complicated, no. But this means LE has additional footage of the suspect as he approaches the SW corner (presumably closer to and facing one or the other camera), or MB was not murdered/found in the SW corner of the building.

 

[Cannonball3804]

In theory, yes it's true that anyone can sue anyone over anything. But like it or not, once we get outside the classroom and into the real world, money matters, as your linked article emphasizes. That cost has to be weighed against the relative importance of the info - is it worth the financial risk to have a chance to gain it - and also against the likelihood of success in pursuing it.

In this situation, there is mild curiosity. But there's not even a compelling story at the end of the rainbow. And LE certainly has no obligation, legal or otherwise, to allow the public in general to look over its shoulder in a murder investigation and help.

There, you've had your say. The post I made was just answering another person's question about why media coverage of this case has died down. I laid out the reasons and then things that "could" happen if it goes unsolved - whether those efforts would or should succeed is another question for another day. We can debate the necessity of transparency and accountability of government in some other forum - let's get back to MB.


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[roadrunnermt]

P1 - a guess at a possible location of the perp when MB entered the halls - would be in a recessed area into the doors into the auditorium (same with P3 area). On that previous map, the kitchen area is off the map, up top.

If you're trying to connect location of body, with kitchen door exit, here's another map making it easier to visualize.

A red line shows an unseen-by-cam path from one proposed body location, to the kitchen door.
A purple line shows an unseen-by-cam path from another proposed body location, to the kitchen door.

I have added c3, in far right end of northside hall (NE corner of building), to show where the closest known cam is in that hallway. I'm theorizing it didn't detect motion that far away, and thus didn't record, when perp exited.

Thank you! Much more understandable. I was looking at P1 and P3 recessed areas as possibility of where perp attacked MB and then merely slipped through the door to the auditorium back out through the kitchen without being seen. I don't believe she was found in a bathroom but thats just my opinion. I think he/she stood in one of those recessed areas and hit her in the head from behind as she walked by. No doubt about it, this SP KNEW or researched this church and their camera system well prior to this attack. This much coincidences are not mere coincidences, which technically I believe also points to more likely a hit given its very thorough planned details.

 

[x_files]

There, you've had your say. The post I made was just answering another person's question about why media coverage of this case has died down. I laid out the reasons and then things that "could" happen if it goes unsolved - whether those efforts would or should succeed is another question for another day. We can debate the necessity of transparency and accountability of government in some other forum - let's get back to MB.


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Thanks. If LE's leads have dried up you'd think they'd want help?

 

[Camerabug]

Okay. But very briefly I believe that the SP did not think they would be seen on camera and what they were doing after leaving the door from room 12. That combined with the item in their left hand creating additional motion and bad timing on their part it was all actually caught on video. But here comes the long winded version. It is long.

The one mistake, I believe was the last piece of the long video MPD released. I don't believe that they thought they would be seen on video. And it is my belief that instead of simply smashing the glass inward on the door they were breaking they were cracking it and making a small hole and then pulling the glass back into the hall they were standing in. We saw them simply break a similar window in the main hall without getting any glass in the hall and in less time (even though MPD did slow the video at the end).

I believe that if they had not been standing left of the window they were breaking and they especially did not have that item in their left hand moving about they wouldn't have been seen on that camera because there wouldn't be enough movement to get the camera to start recording.

The way these kinds of cameras are set up is by defining the field of view to "watch" for "movement". That is usually done by having a view of the empty hall as it should normally appear when you don't expect anyone there and then drawing a rectangle across the view of what the camera sees and setting a threshold for "movement". The problem is rectangles have straight lines and right angles. There is a white line across the floor from left to right in the view of that camera just past the door the SP comes out of. If the camera was straight that line would also appear straight but as you see in the video it angles from the left "up" to the right. So if you were to take a still shot of that and bring to a drawing program and place a rectangle, or square across it you will see that the camera can "see" behind the line but only to the right of the camera and only if there is enough movement. Incidentally, that is why it appears SP moves leftward out of that door even though they are going straight across the hall.

"Movement" is detected by determining the number of pixels that have changed from some reference image of that hall and if enough of them have (perhaps as a percent) you meet the threshold to begin the process of detecting movement. After that there is a series of these comparisons to see that not only that the change from the reference meets the threshold but that the parts of the reference image that have changed are different from image to image i.e motion. Having done that it has to meet one more threshold which is some defined period of time - a few seconds - over which this occurs to have the camera decide there is "movement". Only then will it start sending frames of video over the cables in the building to the machine that records it. When the amount of movement no longer meets that threshold the camera will stop sending the frames. These cameras usually have a few seconds of stored frames that get sent to the recorder after the movement ended.

So, when we see SP in the opening sequence of the long MPD video they are last seen at a kitchen door - in my opinion attempting to enter it. However, we only see that because it was part of the few seconds after last movement was detected. That is, somewhere before that SP was out of range. When they are in the south hall and go to the door after the dutch double doors recording stops after a few seconds because the open dutch doors (that are no longer moving) are effectively blocking the movement detection. We know that camera "sees" farther because when they appear coming back down the hall they are about 10 feet or so further down the hall than the location of the door they previously were at.

At the ending sequence we notice that the camera already is recording before the SP comes out of the door. How can that be? Well, only if there had been prior movement and it was long enough for the camera to determine it should record but that when it did all it saw was an empty hall - it was already just sending the last few seconds stored - until SP came out of room 12. If SP had been probably 2 seconds or so later opening the door of room 12 into the hall the camera would have already stopped recording and already have sent the last few seconds and the camera would have had to start the process all over again.

I know, long winded, but almost done. Since I believe that the burglary gone wrong scenario was staged, SP needed to have MPD believe that they broke through the door (at the end of the long MPD video) heading out after the murder - not before it. Seeing the SP breaking into that door, and making sure the glass was in the hall rather than inside the room behind that door allows MPD to know it was staged to look that way. The outer doors of the Northeast rear vestibule were smashed - all of them to one degree or another since they were all boarded up. No way to know where the glass was unless MPD tells us but my expectation is that it was mostly outside on the concrete.

We never see SP come towards the camera we see in the opening sequence - the vestibule doors smashed are right behind that camera. Nor do we see them come toward the camera we see at the end of the video - the vestibule doors are right around the corner to the right. So, when did those doors get smashed? I believe that was the point of entry and the point of exit. I base that on the fact that at the end opening sequence we see SP starting to enter a kitchen door. If they had entered through the kitchen in the first place, why go back there? MPD stated that the SP spent some time in the kitchen. That must be based on how long it was from when they entered the kitchen until we see them again in the main hall. Otherwise, how would they know? I truly don't believe that we are seeing the video out of sequence.

Yes! I completely agree about the doors being left open to hide movement!

 

[Razz]

Not complicated, no. But this means LE has additional footage of the suspect as he approaches the SW corner (presumably closer to and facing one or the other camera), or MB was not murdered/found in the SW corner of the building.

or......MB really did come through the front entrance and........

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[roadrunnermt]

Great thorough post but leaves my questioning....why on earth would someone go to this much effort and trouble to murder someone? Could one individual technically cover almost every detail and every basis of this crime without error? Why at the church? Was it a challenge they wanted to tackle to outsmart the church and LE? We are all familiar with ways crime and murders have happened with quite a bit much, much less difficulty and effort as this one so why? I can't phantom those answers.

Okay. But very briefly I believe that the SP did not think they would be seen on camera and what they were doing after leaving the door from room 12. That combined with the item in their left hand creating additional motion and bad timing on their part it was all actually caught on video. But here comes the long winded version. It is long.

The one mistake, I believe was the last piece of the long video MPD released. I don't believe that they thought they would be seen on video. And it is my belief that instead of simply smashing the glass inward on the door they were breaking they were cracking it and making a small hole and then pulling the glass back into the hall they were standing in. We saw them simply break a similar window in the main hall without getting any glass in the hall and in less time (even though MPD did slow the video at the end).

I believe that if they had not been standing left of the window they were breaking and they especially did not have that item in their left hand moving about they wouldn't have been seen on that camera because there wouldn't be enough movement to get the camera to start recording.

The way these kinds of cameras are set up is by defining the field of view to "watch" for "movement". That is usually done by having a view of the empty hall as it should normally appear when you don't expect anyone there and then drawing a rectangle across the view of what the camera sees and setting a threshold for "movement". The problem is rectangles have straight lines and right angles. There is a white line across the floor from left to right in the view of that camera just past the door the SP comes out of. If the camera was straight that line would also appear straight but as you see in the video it angles from the left "up" to the right. So if you were to take a still shot of that and bring to a drawing program and place a rectangle, or square across it you will see that the camera can "see" behind the line but only to the right of the camera and only if there is enough movement. Incidentally, that is why it appears SP moves leftward out of that door even though they are going straight across the hall.

"Movement" is detected by determining the number of pixels that have changed from some reference image of that hall and if enough of them have (perhaps as a percent) you meet the threshold to begin the process of detecting movement. After that there is a series of these comparisons to see that not only that the change from the reference meets the threshold but that the parts of the reference image that have changed are different from image to image i.e motion. Having done that it has to meet one more threshold which is some defined period of time - a few seconds - over which this occurs to have the camera decide there is "movement". Only then will it start sending frames of video over the cables in the building to the machine that records it. When the amount of movement no longer meets that threshold the camera will stop sending the frames. These cameras usually have a few seconds of stored frames that get sent to the recorder after the movement ended.

So, when we see SP in the opening sequence of the long MPD video they are last seen at a kitchen door - in my opinion attempting to enter it. However, we only see that because it was part of the few seconds after last movement was detected. That is, somewhere before that SP was out of range. When they are in the south hall and go to the door after the dutch double doors recording stops after a few seconds because the open dutch doors (that are no longer moving) are effectively blocking the movement detection. We know that camera "sees" farther because when they appear coming back down the hall they are about 10 feet or so further down the hall than the location of the door they previously were at.

At the ending sequence we notice that the camera already is recording before the SP comes out of the door. How can that be? Well, only if there had been prior movement and it was long enough for the camera to determine it should record but that when it did all it saw was an empty hall - it was already just sending the last few seconds stored - until SP came out of room 12. If SP had been probably 2 seconds or so later opening the door of room 12 into the hall the camera would have already stopped recording and already have sent the last few seconds and the camera would have had to start the process all over again.

I know, long winded, but almost done. Since I believe that the burglary gone wrong scenario was staged, SP needed to have MPD believe that they broke through the door (at the end of the long MPD video) heading out after the murder - not before it. Seeing the SP breaking into that door, and making sure the glass was in the hall rather than inside the room behind that door allows MPD to know it was staged to look that way. The outer doors of the Northeast rear vestibule were smashed - all of them to one degree or another since they were all boarded up. No way to know where the glass was unless MPD tells us but my expectation is that it was mostly outside on the concrete.

We never see SP come towards the camera we see in the opening sequence - the vestibule doors smashed are right behind that camera. Nor do we see them come toward the camera we see at the end of the video - the vestibule doors are right around the corner to the right. So, when did those doors get smashed? I believe that was the point of entry and the point of exit. I base that on the fact that at the end opening sequence we see SP starting to enter a kitchen door. If they had entered through the kitchen in the first place, why go back there? MPD stated that the SP spent some time in the kitchen. That must be based on how long it was from when they entered the kitchen until we see them again in the main hall. Otherwise, how would they know? I truly don't believe that we are seeing the video out of sequence.

 

[SteveS]

Roadrunner, I tend to agree. After a sequence is over, and we look at it after the fact, we think "How difficult it was for the person to do all of this in exactly this way, in this order, in this time" etc. But that only says that it would be hard to duplicate all of that exactly.

But to do all that the first time, randomly, is easy. It could have just happened as it happened, with not much plan in the sequence and specific actions, and later we give each point in time and action too much weight of being planned. We all see this often, it's human nature to see planning where there was little or none.

I see intention in this murder, given the costume and location and time of day. And I see evidence that he had a good idea of when MB would arrive, more or less. But not sure I see anything complex in the wandering around the building and trying to open doors, the choice of tools, the smashing things randomly, and so on, while he awaited her arrival.

 

[WannaBDetective]

Does seem to be a lack of journalism nowadays! If I was local I'd be covering this on a blog. I've been searching for any locals blogging about it and it seems no one is discussing it anymore.
Nancy Grace of all people you'd think press for the scoop.

The only recent brew-ha-ha that I saw was that MT (BB's mom) allegedly requested permission to join one of the local closed SMS. They discussed it and had an information-gathering vote, so to speak (that was pretty well 50/50).

In the beginning, there was a ton of chatter going around (some accurate, some distorted, and some with little basis). First Responders, friends, relatives. WS shut much of that out. Which I understand the why. Now we are starving for even the smallest morsel; it is kind of your the "eating your cake and having it too." By shutting down all the local chatter, the information stayed very clean; we just don't have a lot of it. Mainstream media is operating on a shoe string budget (and continue to drop like flies).

 

[cady]

So, did the group allow MT to join? JMO

 

[finine]

The only recent brew-ha-ha that I saw was that MT (BB's mom) allegedly requested permission to join one of the local closed SMS. They discussed it and had an information-gathering vote, so to speak (that was pretty well 50/50).

In the beginning, there was a ton of chatter going around (some accurate, some distorted, and some with little basis). First Responders, friends, relatives. WS shut much of that out. Which I understand the why. Now we are starving for even the smallest morsel; it is kind of your the "eating your cake and having it too." By shutting down all the local chatter, the information stayed very clean; we just don't have a lot of it. Mainstream media is operating on a shoe string budget (and continue to drop like flies).

What's an SMS?


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[cady]

What's an SMS?


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Probably a FB group site. I re read wannas post...............ok. So the group shut down. JMO

 

[rodee34]

Here is the Inside Edition video.. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GEcE...ature=youtu.be

 

[x_files]

Great thorough post but leaves my questioning....why on earth would someone go to this much effort and trouble to murder someone? Could one individual technically cover almost every detail and every basis of this crime without error? Why at the church? Was it a challenge they wanted to tackle to outsmart the church and LE? We are all familiar with ways crime and murders have happened with quite a bit much, much less difficulty and effort as this one so why? I can't phantom those answers.

Is the Church is another town? County? Smaller police force?
If so there may lay an answer, secluded, empty, dark no neighbors close by and little to no cameras and away from the children who could interfere or call police.

 

[SteveS]

I am seriously considering an additional small hallway right here ( I respectfully cropped Jethro4WS's excellent layout (It's not mine) to show my point):

It is possible MB was killed in room #2, then moved into one of the bathrooms via small hallway (lime green/ red), then perp fled through porch door (lime green) to the outside. Or- she was killed in the bathroom, then moved into #2. In any scenario, this is the only way I can come up with the attack not being captured on camera, the victim being seen moving towards the location of the assailant, an opportunity of cleaning up the crimescene (?) without being seen on camera, and with a quick getaway and not being seen on camera. Unless - the perp was seen moving back towards the kitchen area. That point is still muddy to me. Again, if someone knows about any hallway in the back there, enlighten us please.

-Nin

1 There are no additional doors from the SW porch, just the ones into the main hallway.
2 I believe that a body found in Room 2 would generally fall within the description "southwest corner of the interior of the building." (Alternately, I can see the auditorium itself being described as the "interior" and therefore its SW corner being the place mentioned.)

 

[zoeneli]

Thank you! Much more understandable. I was looking at P1 and P3 recessed areas as possibility of where perp attacked MB and then merely slipped through the door to the auditorium back out through the kitchen without being seen. I don't believe she was found in a bathroom but thats just my opinion. I think he/she stood in one of those recessed areas and hit her in the head from behind as she walked by. No doubt about it, this SP KNEW or researched this church and their camera system well prior to this attack. This much coincidences are not mere coincidences, which technically I believe also points to more likely a hit given its very thorough planned details.

Would it be possible to hide at P1 or P3 and hit her as she walked by without it being caught on camera? Not that I necessarily believe LE at this point that none of the murder was recorded....

 

[x_files]

The only recent brew-ha-ha that I saw was that MT (BB's mom) allegedly requested permission to join one of the local closed SMS. They discussed it and had an information-gathering vote, so to speak (that was pretty well 50/50).

In the beginning, there was a ton of chatter going around (some accurate, some distorted, and some with little basis). First Responders, friends, relatives. WS shut much of that out. Which I understand the why. Now we are starving for even the smallest morsel; it is kind of your the "eating your cake and having it too." By shutting down all the local chatter, the information stayed very clean; we just don't have a lot of it. Mainstream media is operating on a shoe string budget (and continue to drop like flies).

SMS=Social Media Sites?

 

[SteveS]

Would it be possible to hide at P1 or P3 and hit her as she walked by without it being caught on camera? Not that I necessarily believe LE at this point that none of the murder was recorded....

I would guess yes. Especially P3. And P2 as well. That cam view from c2 doesn't seem to extend far, with the lights off, and perhaps some doors open and obstructing the view as well. We do have to recognize that this is indeed where she went, starting at SW corner doors and moving northward up that main hallway, and perp was somewhere up there per LE. Maybe she was hit or grabbed and taken out of hallway, as well.

PS - Since LE swore under oath "The video shows Terri Bevers walking toward where the suspects location. Neither the suspect nor victim, were seen again on video", then we can trust they don't have any video of the actual killing. A lie would jeopardize the case and subject someone to a perjury charge.

 

[SleutherySea]

1 There are no additional doors from the SW porch, just the ones into the main hallway.
2 I believe that a body found in Room 2 would generally fall within the description "southwest corner of the interior of the building." (Alternately, I can see the auditorium itself being described as the "interior" and therefore its SW corner being the place mentioned.)

BBM: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought someone a few pages back, had posted a photo of the porch (in pink) where there was a single door to the far left. Does someone recall that?

 

[SleutherySea]

BBM: Correct me if I'm wrong, but I thought someone a few pages back, had posted a photo of the porch (in pink) where there was a single door to the far left. Does someone recall that?

Sorry, just jumping off my own post; come to think of it, if there were a door there then wouldn't that be about the location of the restrooms in the SW corner of the building?