Tylenol / Paracetamol / Calpol - Overdose?

[OllieT]

Hi all.

I'm new here, I hope I'm not breaking any rules for posting this.

I've been researching the McCann case for years now and have read so much information on the case, so much so it's hard to keep track of the info and sources and what's reliable and what's not.

If I recall correctly, wasn't the first person to come out and say the the McCann's gave medication to help the children sleep, Kate's/Gerry's own parents? If not, it may have been a friend, I can't recall now, sure it was Kate's dad and they later back tracked on this.

Either way, one of the things that keeps popping its head up time and time again is the rumour that it was Calpol/Paracetamol/Tylenol that they have the kids to sedate them, there's only one problem with this though, Paracetamol does not cause sedation or induce sleep, in fact, it's only in very severe overdose risk of unconsciousness occurs. The only way I can see it helping the children sleep is if they had a fever that was preventing them sleeping in the first place.

Not to mention both parents were doctors, there's dozens of drugs they could have used to induce sleep/sedation that would do a far better job and still pose little risk/danger. I'm not a doctor and know that an over the counter antihistamine would probably do the trick and work well.

It just doesn't make much sense to me.

Don't get me wrong, I don't subscribe to the idea the parents were innocent, if I were a betting man, I'd say they had involvement. That being said, this medication argument, especially paracetamol keep getting brought up, well it's probably the weakest argument going of their guilt, it makes zero sense.

 

[Laughing]

This idea makes sense -- sort of explains why the parents were willing to just lock their children in the hotel room & go to dinner. They were certain the kids would just sleep!

But this time, one child reacted to the dose....

JMHO YMMV

 

[OllieT]

This idea makes sense -- sort of explains why the parents were willing to just lock their children in the hotel room & go to dinner. They were certain the kids would just sleep!

But this time, one child reacted to the dose....

JMHO YMMV

I'm not arguing with the fact the theory makes sense but a theory is just that a theory and we need facts to make it a fact.

The issue is, people who are saying that it was any paracetamol based drug they used, which seems to be the general consensus, are just wrong. Paracetamol based drugs have no sedative effects. Now if people were claiming that (insert X drug here) that would be a different matter, but they're not, everyone seems to be claiming it was Calpol/Tylenol etc etc like it's a fact, if this were the case it would make ZERO sense.

As I said, I think it was Kate's dad who originally mentioned giving Calpol to help the kids sleep in the past, unless the children had a fever that was keeping them awake, no paracetamol based drug would help or keep a child asleep.

 

[ArmchairSherlock]

Just 1 Extra Strength Tylenol makes me sleepy after about 15-20 minutes, and I am an adult. Perhaps they gave something similar. On the other hand, if they really wanted to sedate the kids, you'd think they would have actually used a sedative---particularly since the mom is a physician.

 

[cds0902]

I'm not arguing with the fact the theory makes sense but a theory is just that a theory and we need facts to make it a fact.

The issue is, people who are saying that it was any paracetamol based drug they used, which seems to be the general consensus, are just wrong. Paracetamol based drugs have no sedative effects. Now if people were claiming that (insert X drug here) that would be a different matter, but they're not, everyone seems to be claiming it was Calpol/Tylenol etc etc like it's a fact, if this were the case it would make ZERO sense.

As I said, I think it was Kate's dad who originally mentioned giving Calpol to help the kids sleep in the past, unless the children had a fever that was keeping them awake, no paracetamol based drug would help or keep a child asleep.

Just an fyi a fever will make you sleepy. It's natural for your body to want sleep if you are sick.

 

[cherrymeg]

Could she have possibly taken children's Tylenol or something with acetaminophen in it on her own? Kids can be surprisingly good at getting into things. Medications for kids are usually flavored and something that's easy to get them to take. I was so paranoid about tylenol and vitamins with iron in them when my son was that age.

 

[Sallyla]

I think the medicine reputed to be involved is Phernagen. It’s an antihistamine but also an extremely strong sleeping drug at the right dose. A lot of parents use it to keep their children quiet on plane flights. I’m sure if you look on Mumsnet you can find discussion about it.

 

[Sallyla]

Calpol used to have something sedative in it, but some parents were abusing it because of that, and as it also contains paracetamol, which is incredibly easy to overdose on, there was concern and a safety alert. It was taken off shelves for a few months and came back without the sedative ingredient. I think that was about 2003/4

 

[shinimeggie]

Calpol used to have something sedative in it, but some parents were abusing it because of that, and as it also contains paracetamol, which is incredibly easy to overdose on, there was concern and a safety alert. It was taken off shelves for a few months and came back without the sedative ingredient. I think that was about 2003/4

Just did some brief research but I think Calpol didn't even have a sedative element until Calpol Night, later in 2007 (possibly September, there is a date floating around out there) than MM disappeared, and that was its own product separate from Calpol itself (rather than replacing it).

Calpol Night was taken off sale in 2009 because, y'know, it's a bad idea to give parents a magic potion to cause sleep -- though we used to use opium and gin on even the tiniest of babies, so I suppose there's worse things!

It's a long-standing belief that all Calpol has some sort of sedative because of the belief it helps babies and children drift off to sleep, but really it's more likely Calpol (which is just paracetamol hidden in some colouring and sweeteners) addresses the problems a child is grizzling about, like fever, pain, or discomforting cold symptoms, and helps them sleep merely because they're physically comfortable enough to.

I personally don't believe any drugs were involved in this case, but I wanted to step in with what my little bit of research had found. Others can dig deeper to find particular dates if they'd like =)

 

[samwilzrhcp]

Was there at all any hard concrete proof that the McCanns used to give their children something to help them sleep other than Calpol or Nurofen?
I have two little girls, one 2 week old & the other 18 month old, the 18 month old is teething so naturally we give her calpol before bed, it helps, and I’m sure millions of parents around the world do the same, and have done for years.

 

[shinimeggie]

Was there at all any hard concrete proof that the McCanns used to give their children something to help them sleep other than Calpol or Nurofen?
I have two little girls, one 2 week old & the other 18 month old, the 18 month old is teething so naturally we give her calpol before bed, it helps, and I’m sure millions of parents around the world do the same, and have done for years.

As far as I'm aware, no -- no sedatives (suitable for kids or otherwise, over the counter or prescription) or evidence of them have been found. The twins had their hair tested, which would show long term sedative/benzo use, and it was clean. I can't say I've read every single article, but I believe that's where we are at this point, with no evidence indicating it.

I think people wouldn't have thought at all about the medication thing if the parents hadn't been doctors, or at least not clutched onto it so persistently. It did get to a point of the blame game where it would imply every single parent who's a doctor would drug their kids, because if these doctor-parents did it, why not all doctor-parents?

(also o/t but congrats on the new addition! take things slow and be sure to take time for yourself as well =) )

 

[Pisces Cloud]

I think all this stemmed from one of the grandfathers innocently mentioning Calpol at some point, then it all snowballed from there. There's no proof at all that the children were given sleep medication during the holiday.

 

[ChatteringBirds]

I feel it's possible they used the equivalent to children's Benedryl (whatever that is in the UK) or similar, because how else did they and their friends get all of their children asleep early every night? Kids don't typically sleep well when excited and on vacation, in my opinion. ETA: But then again, maybe their children were simply "good sleepers."

But I don't think Madeleine overdosed. I think they didn't want to admit to giving the children a sleep aid (maybe) and going to dinner and leaving the room unsecured, and that's why they acted suspicious - a combination of shock, shame, guilt, fear, and self/family preservation. Especially since the police probably made their tunnel-vision clear from the start.

Maybe the talk about paracetamol or Calpol is just people suggesting the wrong medicine names.

ETA: I personally think this will turn out to be a kidnapping.

My thoughts only.

 

[samwilzrhcp]

As far as I'm aware, no -- no sedatives (suitable for kids or otherwise, over the counter or prescription) or evidence of them have been found. The twins had their hair tested, which would show long term sedative/benzo use, and it was clean. I can't say I've read every single article, but I believe that's where we are at this point, with no evidence indicating it.

I think people wouldn't have thought at all about the medication thing if the parents hadn't been doctors, or at least not clutched onto it so persistently. It did get to a point of the blame game where it would imply every single parent who's a doctor would drug their kids, because if these doctor-parents did it, why not all doctor-parents?

(also o/t but congrats on the new addition! take things slow and be sure to take time for yourself as well =) )

That's what i thought, but for some reason it seems to be the main theory according to the folk who blindly think the McCann's had something to do with it (beyond leaving the kids unattended).
Unfortunately the McCann's made a huge error of judgement with their actions, and unfortunately it lead to a botched investigation by the Portuguese police, fronted by that shady character Amaral. Hopefully the damage can be undone and with these latest developments the truth is finally revealed.

Thank you! We have no choice to take things slowly with all the Covid stuff thankfully, i'm off work for the foreseeable, so spending more time with family than anticipated.

 

[elendast]

These are two doctors. How likely is it that they would overdose one of their kids?

 

[Sallyla]

They were tested but 5 months later and they arranged it and it’s never been independently verified AFAIK. There could be questions around what was tested for, hair lengths etc which haven’t been precisely answered and could be problematic. Even if someone took MM, I’m fairly sure the children were sedated. I have an elder child and younger twins with the same gap. I could not, for a moment, have considered leaving them alone at that age. Purely because of the eldest. A toddler on their own may wake and cry for a few minutes, but if two toddlers wake and an elder child is there it’s really distressing for all of them. The older child tries to soothe the younger ones, but it’s hard enough for an adult to deal with two crying twins, not a toddler. All 3 would become very distressed, very quickly. I do not know a single twin parent (and I know a lot) who would do that.

If they were sedated, I don’t think that necessarily rules out abduction. The McCann’s have said that they believed the abductor had been in their apartment at least once before the abduction. If that was the case he may have realised there were 3 sedated children left all alone in an unlocked apartment - that would have been a dream scenario for a would be abductor.

The sedation scenario one was never one of an overdose with the police IIRC. The theory was she’d heard her father’s voice outside, gone to the window in a semi conscious fugue state and fallen of the back of the sofa, causing injuries which were fatal.