UK UK - Claudia Lawrence, 35, York University, 18 March 2009 - Chef - #1

[Quietey]

I agree this is probably because of the new focus on what happened the previous evening .

What really caught my attention is how similar the man captured in this clip (here) is to the one in the clip release in 2009 (here) showing a man walking the same route the following morning. Although the quality is fairly poor you can see he is similar in height, build and in the way he walks – even the clothes he is wearing look similar.

The man in the original clip was identified ‘almost certainly’ as one Richard Cartwright who owned two properties in Heworth Place which he was renovating so he could let them out. His presence was later explained by him checking on the security of the properties. Cartwright died suddenly just three weeks later (reportedly of a heart attack). When his name came into the investigation his main residence (round the corner in East Parade) was searched and some samples from the PM were sent for toxicology tests. However it appeared the police lost interest in him fairly quickly and it seems he was effectively eliminated from the enquiry (although they never said why).

Because of this and other coincidences I have always seen him as a ‘person of interest’ in the case, especially since the new concentration on the alleyway that ran to the back of his properties.

Having said that it would not be surprising he would be seen collecting something from one of his properties the evening before. The only odd thing is the way the man stops dead when he sees the other man passing – maybe he was in the habit of keeping his distance from other pedestrians.

I've lost the plot on this thread, there is so much on it and only so much time to read, however I think the information in this post holds something really significant. I too was struck by the similarity of the dark clad figures in the two clips. A lot of more recent posts refer (I think) to potentially more than one property, and an empty property (RC's??). We know that RC can't be the recently arrested person, but that doesn't rule him out as having been involved, or knowing something.

 

[sar2them1984]

I'm confused now. I thought CL must live in Heworth Place, which is where the person seen on the CCTV was going. But if she lives a few doors from the pub. then she lives on Heworth Road, is that right? So the alleyway runs between those two roads (at least the section where her house and the pub is), but I can't see how CCTV man would have had time to go round and along the alleyway and actually to her house. What am I missing?

She does live on Heworth Road. Heworth place runs adjacent with the alley leading off Heworth place behind the houses on Heworth Road.

The CCTV footage of the man released last week was taken around the corner of Place and Road, just above the red marker

 

[sar2them1984]

A better picture with the alleyway marked. As you say not much time in a minute to go anywhere. So interesting what the man was doing/went. Especially if he does indeed return with a bag

 

[Cherwell]

A better picture with the alleyway marked. As you say not much time in a minute to go anywhere. So interesting what the man was doing/went. Especially if he does indeed return with a bag

I doubt he had anything to do with CL. If it's the guy who was renovating a house in that little street, then he just picked up his toolbag or similar.
If it's someone else, he didn't have time to go to CL's. He might have looked for a light in her back windows, but he could have been visiting any house actually in Heworth Place. Sees no lights on, goes away again.

 

[Cherwell]

She does live on Heworth Road. Heworth place runs adjacent with the alley leading off Heworth place behind the houses on Heworth Road.

The CCTV footage of the man released last week was taken around the corner of Place and Road, just above the red marker

Yes, I know where he was, that's why I misunderstood and thought that CL lived in that street.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Cherwell, this pic might help - view from the back of Claudias house (about 3 or 4 houses up from the pub on right) , it backs on to the alleyway which you can just make out. Do we know if there is access to it through her garden? I can't see a gate, I guess you wouldn't need access to the alley for anything. Would be interesting to know how tall her back fence is.

 

[sar2them1984]

View attachment 71727

Cherwell, this pic might help - view from the back of Claudias house (about 3 or 4 houses up from the pub on right) , it backs on to the alleyway which you can just make out. Do we know if there is access to it through her garden? I can't see a gate, I guess you wouldn't need access to the alley for anything. Would be interesting to know how tall her back fence is.

I never realised until just that the alley ends direct at the bottom of Claudia garden. For some reason I assumed it carried on past her house... not very observant of me seeing as I've looked at those maps hundreds of times

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I never realised until just that the alley ends direct at the bottom of Claudia garden. For some reason I assumed it carried on past her house... not very observant of me seeing as I've looked at those maps hundreds of times

Me too! I thought it ran right behind all the Heworth Place terraces, unusual for it to be blocked off. Also, looking at the back of the pub, do you think it's possible to drive right round to H Place from there, looks like it to me.

 

[Yozzer]

I doubt he had anything to do with CL. If it's the guy who was renovating a house in that little street, then he just picked up his toolbag or similar.
If it's someone else, he didn't have time to go to CL's. He might have looked for a light in her back windows, but he could have been visiting any house actually in Heworth Place. Sees no lights on, goes away again.

I suppose it would depend on the public's response to the cctv exposure. If someone recognised/named a person who was already of interest and had claimed to have an alibi for this day/time frame, this would rightly set off alarm bells for the police.

 

[Iona_km]

Hi all - long time lurker but getting quite fascinated by this case. So want it solved.

Has anyone seen this link before? A pyschic who says Claudia is hidden in a bakery near a railway bridge. Why don't the police at least investigate these things. Imagine she was right!

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/real-life/the-scots-psychic-helping-hollywood-stars-1069924

 

[Woollybear]

Interesting, Iona.

Like many people, I suspect, I am doubtful about psychic visions and "remote viewing". But on the other hand, there is a theory that says that much of what we regard as "parapsychology" and "psychobabble" is actually just science that we haven't discovered yet.

Imagine in the 17th century if you had said there will be a machine that will send a copy of a written page to the other side of the world in seconds. You would have been burnt at the stake. Yet what was being described was the fax machine, and it's now so "old hat" that you can't buy fax rolls!

I try to keep an open mind on these things. The more I read of modern particle physics, the more I think that past, present and future are relatively artificial constructs and that some people maybe do have the ability to zero in on something and "see" what they haven't actually "seen", somehow.

Worth a punt, I'd say. Are there any disused bakeries near to railway lines in York?

 

[Woollybear]

Interesting, Iona.

Like many people, I suspect, I am doubtful about psychic visions and "remote viewing". But on the other hand, there is a theory that says that much of what we regard as "parapsychology" and "psychobabble" is actually just science that we haven't discovered yet.

Imagine in the 17th century if you had said there will be a machine that will send a copy of a written page to the other side of the world in seconds. You would have been burnt at the stake. Yet what was being described was the fax machine, and it's now so "old hat" that you can't buy fax rolls!

I try to keep an open mind on these things. The more I read of modern particle physics, the more I think that past, present and future are relatively artificial constructs and that some people maybe do have the ability to zero in on something and "see" what they haven't actually "seen", somehow.

Worth a punt, I'd say. Are there any disused bakeries near to railway lines in York?

 

[Iona_km]

I'm not too sure what to believe regarding psychics etc. However am I right in saying police in America often use them to help with investigations? This woman doesn't seem to attention seeking regarding this as it's the first time I had heard of it. So would be interesting if the police checked it out anyway.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

R.I.P. :heartbeat:

 

[HydraMan]

I can't see a gate, I guess you wouldn't need access to the alley for anything. Would be interesting to know how tall her back fence is.

Most of the houses on Heworth Road do not have access to the alleyway including Claudia's. Their back gardens are accessed by going through the neighbouring gardens via a series of gates nearer to the houses which lead to the alleyway next to the Nag's Head.

When I found this out I thought it lowered the probability of extracting a body via the alleyway behind the house, however it does not rule it out - e.g. using a upturned dustbin as a step to get over the fence.

It seems the last three houses in Heworth Place (Nos. 15, 17 & 19) have extended their gardens over the original alleyway - you can see the lawn behind No. 15 in the foreground of the photo.

 

[Dizzie]

This is a picture of Claudia's back garden, seems like it was taken from the alley? From that Flickr stream previously linked.

 

[sar2them1984]

This is a picture of Claudia's back garden, seems like it was taken from the alley? From that Flickr stream previously linked.

View attachment 71754

I thought this picture was taken right from the very back of the garden. There is space between the shed and fence. I guess it could have been taken from the alley if the fence was short enough. How tall is the back fence I wonder?

 

[Jennibee]

R.I.P. :heartbeat:

Why?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[Yozzer]

I thought this picture was taken right from the very back of the garden. There is space between the shed and fence. I guess it could have been taken from the alley if the fence was short enough. How tall is the back fence I wonder?

If you zoom in on the long range photo posted on the previous page, it appears that the back fence was built at the same time as the one seen on the right side of the garden. It's top reaches to about a foot below the lowest point of the shed roof so I'd guess it to be no more than 4 and a half feet in height, maybe 4 feet.

 

[sar2them1984]

If you zoom in on the long range photo posted on the previous page, it appears that the back fence was built at the same time as the one seen on the right side of the garden. It's top reaches to about a foot below the lowest point of the shed roof so I'd guess it to be no more than 4 and a half feet in height, maybe 4 feet.

Thanks. I had looked at that but to me it wasn't clear if the back fence was the same height as the side fence. The joint looks a bit "wonky" as if they were slightly differing heights

Also the fences in the two pictures (right hand fences) look different. In the close up picture with the shed, the fence is a blue colour matching the shed and is in a state of disrepair. Looking at the birds eye map view, the fence looks to be a different colour to the shed (which can still be seen as blue) almost weathered moss covered, and looks to be fully intact. So I'm guessing the photos were taken at completely different times and possibly different fencing? Moot point I know. .