UK - Constance Marten & Mark Gordon charged, Newborn (found deceased), Bolton Greater Manchester, 5 Jan 2023 #5

[Skigh]

Probably a good thing to keep those two at a bit of a distance, first chance they get, iykwim, stranger things have happened, half-kidding! speculation, imo.

On-the-run aristocrat was seen with lifeless baby in a sling, court told

Constance Marten is on trial at the Old Bailey with Mark Gordon, accused of the manslaughter of their daughter Victoria.

www.times-series.co.uk

View attachment 479598
Constance Marten and Mark Gordon seated with a dock officer at the Old Bailey (Elizabeth Cook/PA)

That picture is not from today. He was wearing a shirt and tie and she wore a floral blouse

 

[Earthwindfire]

Wouldn't the chap who stopped (and filmed the car fire) have seen or heard a cat in a box (likely crying in distress)?

I guess it was probably quite a noisy environment. I hope that's why he didn't hear.

 

[JennieM]

‘Concerned' taxi driver who Constance Marten paid £475 for three-hour trip 'thought he heard cat meowing in his cab before realising the aristocrat had a baby with her'​

Constance Marten with 'dead' baby in sling eight days before arrest

Constance Marten, 36, (pictured) was allegedly seen in a Brighton park with her lifeless baby in a sling eight days she was caught by police.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[JumpingFrog]

I guess it was probably quite a noisy environment. I hope that's why he didn't hear.

I'm hopeful that if the cat/carrier was found 'near' the car, that that means it was rescued....

 

[Nikynoo]

If I wanted to write this as a novel, I would have a plea bargain in which the aristocrat pleads guilty in return for all charges against her lover being dropped.

sMB. I wonder if this is what the ‘legal conferences’ were about?

 

[Nikynoo]

If the Peugeot was the second car fire, where was the car during the first car fire?

 

[rightsaidfred]

I can't believe they had a cat...living rough and they've got a cat! And then add a baby to the mix. This whole case beggars belief!

Do we know where they were living before 20th December 2022? I think they may have been housed, but in a location known to social services (and perhaps with neighbours who knew the history and wouldn't hesitate to call SS), hence the need to move on. SS knew where to find her when she was pregnant in May 2021, and she refused them entry.

Then they go to a holiday cottage and take their cat with them, much as people would take a dog on holiday. Then they would have planned to set up a home in a completely different area to the one they were living in before, and hope that SS didn't join the dots. They didn't expect the car fire to alert the authorities to Victoria's existence, followed by the national publicity, which suddenly made finding accommodation impossible and sleeping rough a necessity.

I'm not sure living rough with a cat is so different to doing the same with a dog. They wouldn't be the first people to do it - look at James Bowen of A Street Cat Named Bob fame. James Bowen (author) - Wikipedia

... but when they took the cat with them, they didn't expect to end up sleeping rough, IMO

 

[rightsaidfred]

If the Peugeot was the second car fire, where was the car during the first car fire?

It was a different car, a Suzuki, that merely broke down. They then replaced it with what must have been a complete banger of a Peugeot 206.

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

It was a different car, a Suzuki, that merely broke down. They then replaced it with what must have been a complete banger of a Peugeot 206.

Wonder who sold it to them and who it was registered to?

 

[Nikynoo]

I'm intrigued as to where they were living in the run up to December. Maybe they had a more permanent residence where the cat had some space?

When I lived in London, more than once I saw people on the tube with cats on leads. They had baskets too so I presume it was as they were travelling somewhere. It was very odd. I think most cats I've owned would want to literally dig their claws into me though if I tried to get a lead on them!

I was wondering where they were living also. There was that place in Greenwich, that was left in a bit of a state but no timeline as to living arrangements as far as I’m aware.

 

[dotr]

That picture is not from today. He was wearing a shirt and tie and she wore a floral blouse

Just posted that random pic.to discreetly suggest that i think if given the opportunity, they would do whatever it takes, to get pregnant again, imo, speculation.

 

[JumpingFrog]

Do we know where they were living before 20th December 2022? I think they may have been housed, but in a location known to social services (and perhaps with neighbours who knew the history and wouldn't hesitate to call SS), hence the need to move on. SS knew where to find her when she was pregnant in May 2021, and she refused them entry.

The unlikely couple cut off contact with friends and family, and led an ‘insular’ life in which police said the ‘affluent, normal, social aspects’ of Marten’s existence came to an abrupt halt.

Largely funded by a trust fund in her name, they moved from property to property.

In September 2022 they were evicted from a flat in London for non-payment of rent and switched between Airbnb properties.

TOM RAWSTORNE: Chance spotting of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon

TOM RAWSTORNE: The massive police hunt ended in the way it had begun - with two people, not three. From the beginning of the investigation, the welfare of the child was the main focus of police.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[JennieM]

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon trial: Taxi driver was 'suspicious' of on-the-run couple with baby​

Constance Marten and Mark Gordon trial: Taxi driver was 'suspicious' of on-the-run couple with baby

The pair spent hundreds of pounds on taxi journeys across England, including a three-hour trip from north London to East Sussex, in a bid to keep the infant, a court heard.

news.sky.com

 

[charminglane]

Just posted that random pic.to discreetly suggest that i think if given the opportunity, they would do whatever it takes, to get pregnant again, imo, speculation.

Absolutely.

 

[Lucy6226]

They weren't living rough at that point though, were they? Presumably they were en route to the ferry port, intending to go to Ireland and remain there. Quite natural if they had a pet that they would take it with them.

They were no fixed abode though. Homeless doesn't mean sleeping rough. Moo

 

[Earthwindfire]

Totally agree with this. It’s as if they are making a mockery of this trial and what about them whispering to each other? Surely it could adversely affect the trial? They could be concocting more alibis… not that they have any but you catch my drift!

In many cases defendants would be released on bail with no restrictions on communicating with each other. I guess

The unlikely couple cut off contact with friends and family, and led an ‘insular’ life in which police said the ‘affluent, normal, social aspects’ of Marten’s existence came to an abrupt halt.

Largely funded by a trust fund in her name, they moved from property to property.

In September 2022 they were evicted from a flat in London for non-payment of rent and switched between Airbnb properties.

TOM RAWSTORNE: Chance spotting of Constance Marten and Mark Gordon

TOM RAWSTORNE: The massive police hunt ended in the way it had begun - with two people, not three. From the beginning of the investigation, the welfare of the child was the main focus of police.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Living in Air B N B’s in London would have meant they were still enjoying the trappings of her affluent life! Holiday homes are not a cheap way to live day to day.

 

[JennieM]

Going back to the autopsy that CM said she wanted for Victoria.

Firstly, why did she want one? To prove they didn’t kill her?

Secondly, if that’s what she really wanted, then why did she not take her poor body and leave it outside a GP, a hospital, anywhere with a note?

Why were they carrying her body around?

In everything they did and do, Victoria is at the back of their mind. First and foremost are their needs and what is easy for them.

Talking / whispering during the trial does show contempt. It is rude and shows a level of disinterest in what is being said. I guess they are past the point of making good impressions.

 

[JumpingFrog]

Do we know where they were living before 20th December 2022? I think they may have been housed, but in a location known to social services (and perhaps with neighbours who knew the history and wouldn't hesitate to call SS), hence the need to move on. SS knew where to find her when she was pregnant in May 2021, and she refused them entry.

Also:

"It is unclear how he and Marten met, but it is reported that they moved into a small, terraced house in Ilford, East London. The couple were “mysterious”, a neighbour told The Sunday Times...

...Gordon and Marten were reportedly evicted from their home in Ilford. Where they went next is unclear, though by August 2020 they were living on the Coldharbour Estate in Greenwich. Neighbours told the Evening Standard that shouting was sometimes heard from the flat and that Marten and Gordon would spend long periods of time elsewhere. The tenancy agreement was in Marten’s name, but the couple were not paying rent. They were evicted in August last year, and are reported to have left smoke damage and a partially collapsed ceiling, with the damage amounting to thousands of pounds’ worth of repairs.

Where they then went remains unclear. Gordon’s mother Sylvia, who lives in Florida, told the Daily Mail she believed the pair had secretly married “some time ago”."

Constance Marten: The missing aristocrat, her rapist partner and the family rift

Her upbringing had all the trappings of high society, so how did Constance Marten come to be on the run for weeks on end with a sex offender 13 years her senior? Tom Ough reports

www.independent.co.uk

 

[rightsaidfred]

I was wondering where they were living also. There was that place in Greenwich, that was left in a bit of a state but no timeline as to living arrangements as far as I’m aware.

Ah yes, you are right, they were living in Eltham until Sept 2022 (when she began to show, I imagine) and then led a 'nomadic lifestyle', having withdrawn £15k cash

Constance & partner seen at food bank without baby days before arrest

RUNAWAY aristocrat Constance Marten and her rapist lover used a foodbank days before their arrest – but did not ask for nappies which were available. Volunteers at the site screamed in …

www.thesun.co.uk

 

[JennieM]

Constance Marten: Taxi driver recalls 'uneasy feeling' about couple​

Constance Marten: Taxi driver recalls 'uneasy feeling' about couple

Baby Victoria's mother is at the Old Bailey with Mark Gordon for the first time since the trial began.

www.bbc.co.uk