UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 Sep 2016 #24

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Officer Dibble said:
The uncle who was a special something or other (forget what now) proved at the time with a lot of research, that it was possible Corrie was missed by the cameras and he got out of the area.
Click to expand...

It's incredible foresight though, or massive coincidence. He'd either have to have reccied the area extensively at some point previously and the entire night was leading to him pulling this, or he's decided to go AWOL that night and just managed to completely fluke walking a perfect route. There doesn't seem to be anything else to support it like large cash withdrawals, he had a kid on the way etc..

I don't think this would even really be a debate if it wasn't for the mess up with the bin weights. It just seems quite a clear cut case of Occam's razor to me.
 
infinit said:
It's incredible foresight though, or massive coincidence. He'd either have to have reccied the area extensively at some point previously and the entire night was leading to him pulling this, or he's decided to go AWOL that night and just managed to completely fluke walking a perfect route. There doesn't seem to be anything else to support it like large cash withdrawals, he had a kid on the way etc..
Click to expand...

Agree. I've never heard of a case of AWOL like this; people are usually found hiding out with family or friends (or on their way to the Ukraine, as per recent developments!).

It's also telling that for all Corrie was an administrative nightmare for the RAF, they didn't consider him sufficiently unreliable to report him AWOL. He was transparent about his drinking and financial issues, so you would have thought if there were other problems, they would have come to light. He'd already suffered with his MH, so that could have been used for a reason to leave the Forces still with access to bank account, ID, all his personal belongings...
 
Officer Dibble said:
The uncle who was a special something or other (forget what now) proved at the time with a lot of research, that it was possible Corrie was missed by the cameras and he got out of the area.
Click to expand...

infinit said:
It's incredible foresight though, or massive coincidence. He'd either have to have reccied the area extensively at some point previously and the entire night was leading to him pulling this, or he's decided to go AWOL that night and just managed to completely fluke walking a perfect route. There doesn't seem to be anything else to support it like large cash withdrawals, he had a kid on the way etc..
Click to expand...

But that's assuming a deliberate disappearance. I agree that there's nothing to support that. However, it's quite feasible that he just walked away while the camera was pointing in another direction. He would be heading in the right direction for his base, but he could have got into a vehicle at any point after leaving the horseshoe area. Something happened to him, but elsewhere.
 
Kaykedi said:
Cherwell,
If Corrie did walk away from the horse shoe area, how did he not appear on any cctv afterwards?
Click to expand...

There was a way out without being seen...

wayout.jpg


Cam 9 is the footage we've seen and know the camera looks at the bins once every 2 mins or so, for 30 seconds.

Cam 10 cannot see Short Brackland or Cannon St. It appears to be a camera that turns.

Cam 31 is in an estate and cannot see the roundabout at the top of Canon St.

From here, the bypass can be reached. All cams clueless.

Cam 36 cannot see over station hill nor over buildings toward the roundabout (and in current street view, it appears to have been broken/dismantled).

The only other one is Camera 2 at the top of Station Hill. It can see the road with blue dots, providing it's looking in that direction (as it appears to be the same type as the others, probably on a timer).

But as we now already know, why go up that country road when you can get onto the dual carriageway easily enough and undetected. And if you do go up that road (I think the moving mobile phone went that way?) then like the horseshoe, you have a potential 2 minute avoidance of the road marked with blue dots. I believe Cam 2 has been sorely neglected. I think if any cam has Corrie on it, a perps car, it's probably this one. It should at least have the bin lorry? Maybe not. But I never heard them talk about this particular cam, did you?

Therefore, leaving in a vehicle is perfectly plausible. Certainly, there are doorbell cams to consider, but the main CCTV system, that Bury council are so proud of? It has a serious flaw...

Once cam 9 looks away from the horshoe, it's clean sailing up Short Brackland to the dual carriageway. A direct, undetectable route in and out of the town center.

Any car waiting to pick him up or any person waiting to speak to him would have been spotted on the camera there.
Click to expand...

Negative. A car parked in Short Brackland may never be seen. It would have to cross the threshold into the Horseshoe (as would a person) to be picked up on Cam 9. The above notes explain the perfectly camera free route out from Short Brackland. But yes, it HAS to be Short Brackland. Any other route in/out of the Horseshoe and the chance of being on a camera is very high (we saw one from inside the shop just opposite the bins, even). It kind of baffles the mind...

The CCTV cam system (source): https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/319850/response/802518/attach/5/Bury St Edmunds.pdf

Ive always been interested in th security guards stood outside of the pub on the corner.
Click to expand...

Not sure if you folks ever discussed it, but I feel this holds some weight, just not the night-time door staff.

Did you know that security in say, New Look and Debenhams, and the guys monitoring car parks and such - they are all able to communicate with each other? This is how, if a shoplifter is reported in one shop, they do not need to be chased and instead can be caught in another shop.

If these daytime security folk and certain council workers saw a pissed up Corrie walking around then it would only have taken one person with a radio to mention it, and the entire network would know he's out there and to look out for him. Security guards are dilligent, they'll spot you even if you're in a hood. But Corrie was in bright pink. Not exactly a "hard target".

This has happened to me before...nothing malicious, and I wasn't wearing pink, but my actions in one place of the city and later on the other side, someone already knew what I was up to and expecting me. It is the damndest thing...! And this happened to me 10 years before Corrie, so I can only imagine how interconnected that network was in 2016, and today. I'm sure anyone who works in retail (with a security guard, cctv room or dept.) is aware of this phenomena. When a shop security guard talks into his shoulder mic, he's talking to all the security in all the shops, and from my experience, workers in the car parks too...

Now, who else do you think this daytime network of security guards and car park people will have a direct line too? That's right, the CCTV mainframe. Oncfe a shoplifter is out of the shop's area, they will then be tracked by the bigger system. So now a picture emerges. Someone can spot Corrie, mention him on radio, and then he can be tracked, essentially - watched, like a hawk, until he goes out of sight, which he never does, UNTIL he reaches the horseshoe/Short Brackland.

And someone in that network can absolutely know the blind spots, can absolutely co-ordinate someone else or other people when to move into the blind-spot...argh I suppose I shouldn't write conspiracy theories.

It's just that absolutely none of this sort of thing is/was even mentioned or seemingly considered by this investigation. Not even in the equation. And lets not forget the attacks on us, for asking questions. That happened. And it's 2021 now we've learned thats usually for the purposes of obfuscation.

There are just so many holes and their explanations simply aren't good enough. But that's just my opinion and, sigh, fruitless research... What we really need is someone on the day security crew and whether any report came in over the radio in the earlier hours (4-6pm, when shops were still open) about a guy in pink being drunk or anything. In my view, that's the missing link, because from there, you can absolutely execute an abduction. And security and CCTV mainframe undoubtedly knew or know there is an escape route via Short Brackland, I have no doubt they've lost other perps down there too.
 
Last edited:
Thank you, Jen, that is fascinating and good to have some informed local detail.

This is what I've been saying from the start - that there was a very good chance of Corrie leaving the horseshoe via Short Brackland without being seen on camera. From what you say, it's three times as likely that he would NOT be seen. Why was this possibility dismissed?

I'm not saying there was a planned abduction, but what you say about the communications network certainly adds another possibility.
 
Time Traveller said:
This is interesting. Where you mention the country road would that be the A1101?
Click to expand...

Yes, that's the A1101.

Thanks Cherwell, not a local though - just an internet sleuth like you! But you're right, that word I used was a bit strong, I think (though cannot change it) it would be better to have simply said "an intervention".

And absolutely, I have not bought the "slept in a bin" thing since the day it was first postulated which has driven me to look at as many other angles as possible. But also recognize this is not a conspiracy forum, so my thoughts on a shady ring of elite class child/sex traffickers operating out of most UK cities is best left at the doorstep...! But I remain convinced he fell foul to something that was NOT due to his own actions.
 
Ah right, I thought it sounded as though you'd personally inspected every camera!

As for "falling foul of something that was NOT due to his own actions", I wouldn't be so sure. Everyone describes him as a lovely friendly sociable chap, and I'm sure he was, but outgoing characters like this can piss people off. Barging in uninvited on groups of people and interrupting conversations isn't always welcomed, and he might easily have annoyed someone - not necessarily that evening.
 
Thank you Jen Sen. Until the inquest brought up the evidence of the weight of the bin etc I had wondered if Corrie could have slipped out of the horseshoe and somehow got on to the A1101 perhaps in a taxi or by having a lift. There was talk of him possibly mentioning going on to a party near a golf club. There are two golf clubs close by, the Bury St Edmunds Golf Club, but this is in the wrong direction for his phone to ping the mast, and there’s the Suffolk Golf Club a few miles north-west of BSE. Can’t remember if the A1101 was the actual route the bin lorry took. If there had been a party somewhere in that vicinity, perhaps it was at a private house.
 
Jen Sen said:
There was a way out without being seen...

wayout.jpg


Cam 9 is the footage we've seen and know the camera looks at the bins once every 2 mins or so, for 30 seconds.

Cam 10 cannot see Short Brackland or Cannon St. It appears to be a camera that turns.

Cam 31 is in an estate and cannot see the roundabout at the top of Canon St.

From here, the bypass can be reached. All cams clueless.

Cam 36 cannot see over station hill nor over buildings toward the roundabout (and in current street view, it appears to have been broken/dismantled).

The only other one is Camera 2 at the top of Station Hill. It can see the road with blue dots, providing it's looking in that direction (as it appears to be the same type as the others, probably on a timer).

But as we now already know, why go up that country road when you can get onto the dual carriageway easily enough and undetected. And if you do go up that road (I think the moving mobile phone went that way?) then like the horseshoe, you have a potential 2 minute avoidance of the road marked with blue dots. I believe Cam 2 has been sorely neglected. I think if any cam has Corrie on it, a perps car, it's probably this one. It should at least have the bin lorry? Maybe not. But I never heard them talk about this particular cam, did you?

Therefore, leaving in a vehicle is perfectly plausible. Certainly, there are doorbell cams to consider, but the main CCTV system, that Bury council are so proud of? It has a serious flaw...

Once cam 9 looks away from the horshoe, it's clean sailing up Short Brackland to the dual carriageway. A direct, undetectable route in and out of the town center.



Negative. A car parked in Short Brackland may never be seen. It would have to cross the threshold into the Horseshoe (as would a person) to be picked up on Cam 9. The above notes explain the perfectly camera free route out from Short Brackland. But yes, it HAS to be Short Brackland. Any other route in/out of the Horseshoe and the chance of being on a camera is very high (we saw one from inside the shop just opposite the bins, even). It kind of baffles the mind...

The CCTV cam system (source): https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/319850/response/802518/attach/5/Bury St Edmunds.pdf



Not sure if you folks ever discussed it, but I feel this holds some weight, just not the night-time door staff.

Did you know that security in say, New Look and Debenhams, and the guys monitoring car parks and such - they are all able to communicate with each other? This is how, if a shoplifter is reported in one shop, they do not need to be chased and instead can be caught in another shop.

If these daytime security folk and certain council workers saw a pissed up Corrie walking around then it would only have taken one person with a radio to mention it, and the entire network would know he's out there and to look out for him. Security guards are dilligent, they'll spot you even if you're in a hood. But Corrie was in bright pink. Not exactly a "hard target".

This has happened to me before...nothing malicious, and I wasn't wearing pink, but my actions in one place of the city and later on the other side, someone already knew what I was up to and expecting me. It is the damndest thing...! And this happened to me 10 years before Corrie, so I can only imagine how interconnected that network was in 2016, and today. I'm sure anyone who works in retail (with a security guard, cctv room or dept.) is aware of this phenomena. When a shop security guard talks into his shoulder mic, he's talking to all the security in all the shops, and from my experience, workers in the car parks too...

Now, who else do you think this daytime network of security guards and car park people will have a direct line too? That's right, the CCTV mainframe. Oncfe a shoplifter is out of the shop's area, they will then be tracked by the bigger system. So now a picture emerges. Someone can spot Corrie, mention him on radio, and then he can be tracked, essentially - watched, like a hawk, until he goes out of sight, which he never does, UNTIL he reaches the horseshoe/Short Brackland.

And someone in that network can absolutely know the blind spots, can absolutely co-ordinate someone else or other people when to move into the blind-spot...argh I suppose I shouldn't write conspiracy theories.

It's just that absolutely none of this sort of thing is/was even mentioned or seemingly considered by this investigation. Not even in the equation. And lets not forget the attacks on us, for asking questions. That happened. And it's 2021 now we've learned thats usually for the purposes of obfuscation.

There are just so many holes and their explanations simply aren't good enough. But that's just my opinion and, sigh, fruitless research... What we really need is someone on the day security crew and whether any report came in over the radio in the earlier hours (4-6pm, when shops were still open) about a guy in pink being drunk or anything. In my view, that's the missing link, because from there, you can absolutely execute an abduction. And security and CCTV mainframe undoubtedly knew or know there is an escape route via Short Brackland, I have no doubt they've lost other perps down there too.
Click to expand...
Jen Sen said:
There was a way out without being seen...

wayout.jpg


Cam 9 is the footage we've seen and know the camera looks at the bins once every 2 mins or so, for 30 seconds.

Cam 10 cannot see Short Brackland or Cannon St. It appears to be a camera that turns.

Cam 31 is in an estate and cannot see the roundabout at the top of Canon St.

From here, the bypass can be reached. All cams clueless.

Cam 36 cannot see over station hill nor over buildings toward the roundabout (and in current street view, it appears to have been broken/dismantled).

The only other one is Camera 2 at the top of Station Hill. It can see the road with blue dots, providing it's looking in that direction (as it appears to be the same type as the others, probably on a timer).

But as we now already know, why go up that country road when you can get onto the dual carriageway easily enough and undetected. And if you do go up that road (I think the moving mobile phone went that way?) then like the horseshoe, you have a potential 2 minute avoidance of the road marked with blue dots. I believe Cam 2 has been sorely neglected. I think if any cam has Corrie on it, a perps car, it's probably this one. It should at least have the bin lorry? Maybe not. But I never heard them talk about this particular cam, did you?

Therefore, leaving in a vehicle is perfectly plausible. Certainly, there are doorbell cams to consider, but the main CCTV system, that Bury council are so proud of? It has a serious flaw...

Once cam 9 looks away from the horshoe, it's clean sailing up Short Brackland to the dual carriageway. A direct, undetectable route in and out of the town center.



Negative. A car parked in Short Brackland may never be seen. It would have to cross the threshold into the Horseshoe (as would a person) to be picked up on Cam 9. The above notes explain the perfectly camera free route out from Short Brackland. But yes, it HAS to be Short Brackland. Any other route in/out of the Horseshoe and the chance of being on a camera is very high (we saw one from inside the shop just opposite the bins, even). It kind of baffles the mind...

The CCTV cam system (source): https://www.whatdotheyknow.com/request/319850/response/802518/attach/5/Bury St Edmunds.pdf



Not sure if you folks ever discussed it, but I feel this holds some weight, just not the night-time door staff.

Did you know that security in say, New Look and Debenhams, and the guys monitoring car parks and such - they are all able to communicate with each other? This is how, if a shoplifter is reported in one shop, they do not need to be chased and instead can be caught in another shop.

If these daytime security folk and certain council workers saw a pissed up Corrie walking around then it would only have taken one person with a radio to mention it, and the entire network would know he's out there and to look out for him. Security guards are dilligent, they'll spot you even if you're in a hood. But Corrie was in bright pink. Not exactly a "hard target".

This has happened to me before...nothing malicious, and I wasn't wearing pink, but my actions in one place of the city and later on the other side, someone already knew what I was up to and expecting me. It is the damndest thing...! And this happened to me 10 years before Corrie, so I can only imagine how interconnected that network was in 2016, and today. I'm sure anyone who works in retail (with a security guard, cctv room or dept.) is aware of this phenomena. When a shop security guard talks into his shoulder mic, he's talking to all the security in all the shops, and from my experience, workers in the car parks too...

Now, who else do you think this daytime network of security guards and car park people will have a direct line too? That's right, the CCTV mainframe. Oncfe a shoplifter is out of the shop's area, they will then be tracked by the bigger system. So now a picture emerges. Someone can spot Corrie, mention him on radio, and then he can be tracked, essentially - watched, like a hawk, until he goes out of sight, which he never does, UNTIL he reaches the horseshoe/Short Brackland.

And someone in that network can absolutely know the blind spots, can absolutely co-ordinate someone else or other people when to move into the blind-spot...argh I suppose I shouldn't write conspiracy theories.

It's just that absolutely none of this sort of thing is/was even mentioned or seemingly considered by this investigation. Not even in the equation. And lets not forget the attacks on us, for asking questions. That happened. And it's 2021 now we've learned thats usually for the purposes of obfuscation.

There are just so many holes and their explanations simply aren't good enough. But that's just my opinion and, sigh, fruitless research... What we really need is someone on the day security crew and whether any report came in over the radio in the earlier hours (4-6pm, when shops were still open) about a guy in pink being drunk or anything. In my view, that's the missing link, because from there, you can absolutely execute an abduction. And security and CCTV mainframe undoubtedly knew or know there is an escape route via Short Brackland, I have no doubt they've lost other perps down there too.
Click to expand...
Thank you very much Jen Sen
 
His mother has said in the "Find Corrie" Facebook group that she will explain in due course why she has accepted the bin verdict. So possibly she may disclose information revealed at the inquest that wasn't reported. Until then I remain unconvinced of the bin theory, mainly because he could so easily have left the area unseen. I certainly don't think it was a voluntary disappearance, but I am not ruling out foul play. But he had had a lot to drink, and that would have affected his perceptions and judgement, so he could simply have had an accident and be lying somewhere undiscovered.
 
KarenUK said:
"The inquest had heard evidence from a Biffa representative that over a period of six years there were 740 incidents of people in bins."
Click to expand...
That's more than two a week. They don't say where. In the UK? Worldwide?
 
740 people found by Biffa staff in the UK over a period of 7 years

Rough sleeping in bins falls but campaigners call for ‘constant vigilance’ - The Big Issue

Here’s this link again too:

People in Bins - Biffa

“Biffa has recorded 740 incidents relating to people being found in and around bins in the last seven years. A report completed by The Open University and sponsored by Biffa, alongside CIWM, St Mungos and StreetLink, has shown a 14% rise in reported incidents of people sleeping in and around bins between 2014 and 2019. This is coupled with a 70% increase in the number of people reported to be sleeping rough in the same timeframe. As COVID-19 restrictions start to ease and hotel accommodation for homeless people is suspended we expect to see a rise in those seeking shelter in waste containers. People in and around bins isn't exclusively focused on the risk to the homeless, with people also being found after seeking shelter following a night out.”
 
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