UK UK - Corrie McKeague, 23, Bury St Edmunds, 24 September 2016 #20

[Cherwell]

And yet in this article it says

"The mother explained that in three years of living at RAF Honington, Corrie had never tried to walk home. His car had been parked in Robert Boby Way at 10pm so he could always have fallen asleep in that."

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/incoming/mother-missing-raf-serviceman-corrie-12156971

tbh I don't we can rely on something SP said less than a week after C disappeared that was later corrected. While he may have walked home from other places IMO it's not very likely that he decided to do something he's never done in 3 years when I think it's safe to assume he'd probably been out in BSE many many times

And you think that his mother in Scotland would know about his every movement down in East Anglia?
Could it be that he possibly didn't tell her everything he did?

From the SP update 11/11/16, walking home wasn't a key line of enquiry so it's surprising to me that it's being said now as a reason not to have looked at the bin possibility sooner.

Detective Superintendent Katie Elliott said; “We have to keep an open mind as there is no key line of enquiry to take us in any one direction. We can’t rule anything out and therefore we have to continue to investigate all possibilities. Despite extensive searches, CCTV viewing, media appeals and many behind the scenes enquiries we still do not have a lead which takes us forward. Many theories are being explored and work is ongoing to trace everyone who was in the area around the key time as they may have information that may help.

That was in November though, when searches had already been made along the route.
Probably more accurate to say it was no longer a key line of enquiry.

 

[Shiressleuth]

The person who is a serving police officer being less supprtive than the person who isn't?

Yes IMO.

 

[suzyjackson]

And you think that his mother in Scotland would know about his every movement down in East Anglia?
Could it be that he possibly didn't tell her everything he did?




That was in November though, when searches had already been made along the route.
Probably more accurate to say it was no longer a key line of enquiry.

Of course he didn't tell her everything, it would be stupid to think he did IMO but once he was missing don't you think she would have asked his friends about whether he might have walked home? Why would they say he didn't do it if he did unless for some reason they didn't want him to be found or they told her he did walk home and she decided to tell everyone he didn't.

Neither of those possibilities make sense to me so MOO is that there was a suggestion that C mentioned to a homeless man, maybe as a joke, we don't know, that he might be walking home and this was considered a possibility and searches were sensibly done along the route but I can't recall any suggestion before now that this was a reason for not following up on the bin weight/landfill search. Obviously I'll stand corrected if I've missed that.

If we're going to have to start questioning the accuracy of the wording of official police statements I'm going to give up :smile:

 

[Shiressleuth]

Lying is a strong word and not one I'd use.

From the SP update 11/11/16, walking home wasn't a key line of enquiry so it's surprising to me that it's being said now as a reason not to have looked at the bin possibility sooner.

Detective Superintendent Katie Elliott said; “We have to keep an open mind as there is no key line of enquiry to take us in any one direction. We can’t rule anything out and therefore we have to continue to investigate all possibilities. Despite extensive searches, CCTV viewing, media appeals and many behind the scenes enquiries we still do not have a lead which takes us forward. Many theories are being explored and work is ongoing to trace everyone who was in the area around the key time as they may have information that may help.

Wasn't the only line of enquiry but searches based on walking/getting a lift part way were still taking place in January- four months after C went missing.

 

[Cherwell]

If we're going to have to start questioning the accuracy of the wording of official police statements I'm going to give up :smile:

I wasn't questioning the accuracy of the police statement. I was questioning the accuracy of your use of it, because you took it out of context. You implied that walking home wasn't a "key line of enquiry" at the start, when the police statement in November clearly referred to the status quo several weeks later.

 

[Shiressleuth]

but once he was missing don't you think she would have asked his friends about whether he might have walked home? Why would they say he didn't do it if he did unless for some reason they didn't want him to be found or they told her he did walk home and she decided to tell everyone he didn't.

If we're going to have to start questioning the accuracy of the wording of official police statements I'm going to give up :smile:

RSBM
Once he was missing, his friends talked to no one except the police AFAIK. Remember the D notice?

And I have already said that his brother, in the police press conference, indicated he hadn't walked "all the way". Was that not true then?

 

[Northern Light]

Thanks for confirming that. It is such an obvious lead that I cannot understand why anyone would think the police hadn't explored it.
.

It was January before sniffer dogs were used in buildings in SB. With regard to F12. Nicola also spoke to two people who were in F12, who had access to it, and were not supposed to be there, while she was outside, one evening. They pleaded with her not to report them. I personally have supported SP while thinking there was a lot more going on behind the scenes. However I believe that Nicola has driven this investigation and social media has been a political force in ensuring SP continued with the level of investigation in terms of manpower and costs. JMO

http://www.itv.com/news/anglia/upda...being-used-to-look-for-corrie-in-town-centre/

 

[Aye]

I disagree that they did not follow the phone or bin data. They had the info early on but followed the walking home line that they had info about. They could not justify searching landfill when no evidence at that time existed that his body was there. Not until other leads had been pursued did they look at the lanndfill search. MM has been fully supportive of the police actions.

If they followed the phone they would have it and possible further lines from it, if they followed and checked the bin data correctly well 5 months would not have passed. As I said I fully expect the family will iPCC down the line, even a lack of resources and budgets would have meant if the correct actions was taken when needed the justification of all the money spent to date would be less as would a families heartbreak . Since C whereabouts is unknown and he can not speak up for himself it was imperative all the available data was traced and accurately checked and rechecked asap, neither mobile or bin data was for months and months later. Within weeks it would have been easy to prioritise what leads were solid and what were not, seems NONE of the seniors, not one of them on this case made a good professional decision - I have seen housing benefit fraud investigators at councils with much less experience & resources than SP make better decisions by prioritising leads without even having to speak to senior dept staff. Follow the main evidence/lines you have not chase possible ones that may not be there at the expense of the mains.

 

[suzyjackson]

I wasn't questioning the accuracy of the police statement. I was questioning the accuracy of your use of it, because you took it out of context. You implied that walking home wasn't a "key line of enquiry" at the start, when the police statement in November clearly referred to the status quo several weeks later.

Sorry if I misunderstood you.

I can't find a reference to walking home being a key line of enquiry, admittedly I'll only re-read quickly the SP statements but I can't find where they actually say that anything was a key line of enquiry, They seem to have been careful not to say that any one theory was stronger than the others and make general comments rather than specific ones.

Maybe that's their standard approach, I'm not familiar with any other SP cases

 

[suzyjackson]

RSBM
Once he was missing, his friends talked to no one except the police AFAIK. Remember the D notice?

And I have already said that his brother, in the police press conference, indicated he hadn't walked "all the way". Was that not true then?

Do you mean the D notice that MM aked the police about and they told him there hadn't been one?

No link but google is your friend

It's true that the brother said that in a press conference but I don't think we can be sure either way of whether it was accurate.

We're obviousy not going to agree on this and we're very unlikely to know whether C ever tried to walk home so shall we agree to differ?

 

[Aye]

The person who is a serving police officer being less supprtive than the person who isn't?

N knows professional procedure, C dad doesn't - so actually N is more informed and objective. Obviously if C was one of SP staff children standards rise, its the sad fact of any public servant that most do everything they can when it effects one of their own otherwise its just a job to pay the mortgage. Professionalism - under par, acceptable, excels - we all fit into one of the three main or around about them, most fall in the middle from the Tesco shelf filler to the Prime Minister, its human behaviour, one should always try to EXCEL themselves or find a job they love and commit to where they can it makes a happier person and society. For me I LOVE doing voluntary work, it is not about financial/material gain, I excel there - most servicemen do to, they LOVE the job.

I fully support N, she knows lacklustre police performance & in the circumstances has remained objective to a higher degree than most people would in the same position.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Do you mean the D notice that MM aked the police about and they told him there hadn't been one?

No link but google is your friend

It's true that the brother said that in a press conference but I don't think we can be sure either way of whether it was accurate.

We're obviousy not going to agree on this and we're very unlikely to know whether C ever tried to walk home so shall we agree to differ?

Of course we can. But I would appreciate less SP bashing especially while this horrendous search is ongoing.

 

[Justlookingme]

Sorry it doesn't wash with me and i quite simply think if CM was in a bin it was for one of two reasons.
1,. To hide
2. put there

I still don't actually think he was in a bin but that is just my opinion

Ditto


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[suzyjackson]

If they followed the phone they would have it and possible further lines from it, if they followed and checked the bin data correctly well 5 months would not have passed. As I said I fully expect the family will iPCC down the line, even a lack of resources and budgets would have meant if the correct actions was taken when needed the justification of all the money spent to date would be less as would a families heartbreak . Since C whereabouts is unknown and he can not speak up for himself it was imperative all the available data was traced and accurately checked and rechecked asap, neither mobile or bin data was for months and months later. Within weeks it would have been easy to prioritise what leads were solid and what were not, seems NONE of the seniors, not one of them on this case made a good professional decision - I have seen housing benefit fraud investigators at councils with much less experience & resources than SP make better decisions by prioritising leads without even having to speak to senior dept staff. Follow the main evidence/lines you have not chase possible ones that may not be there at the expense of the mains.

Even with the benefit of hindsight I'm not sure I totally agree with you.

Yes, there were very strong indications from the start that the phone was most likley in the bin lorry but searching the LF for a crushed phone is a massive task and tbh I can't say that I think it should have been done when there were other things to check first and the only extra info would have been secure messages that might not even have been accessible depending on how damaged the phone was.

Once it became clear that there was no way out without being seen on CCTV and that only 4 vehicles were in the area (so a very managable investigation IMO) then maybe the bin weights should have been revisited unless by coincidence the occupants of one of the other vehicles were in some way under suspicion and could have been involved in some kidnap or other altercation.

As you say if there is an IPCC investigation the results will be very interesting

JMO

 

[Shiressleuth]

N knows professional procedure, C dad doesn't - so actually N is more informed and objective. Obviously if C was one of SP staff children standards rise, its the sad fact of any public servant that most do everything they can when it effects one of their own otherwise its just a job to pay the mortgage. Professionalism - under par, acceptable, excels - we all fit into one of the three main or around about them, most fall in the middle from the Tesco shelf filler to the Prime Minister, its human behaviour, one should always try to EXCEL themselves or find a job they love and commit to where they can it makes a happier person and society. For me I LOVE doing voluntary work, it is not about financial/material gain, I excel there - most servicemen do to, they LOVE the job.

I fully support N, she knows lacklustre police performance & in the circumstances has remained objective to a higher degree than most people would in the same position.

Do you have evidence or a link for any of this criticism? I think it is BS JMO of course.

 

[Aye]

Thanks for confirming that. It is such an obvious lead that I cannot understand why anyone would think the police hadn't explored it.



Exactly.

Probably because it took over two months to send dogs to the HS


it is a process of elimination, not assumption (which would sum up the whole we know of SP investigation)

 

[Taskforce88]

DSMA-notices (formerly D and DA-notices) - when was this mentioned?

 

[Shiressleuth]

Probably because it took over two months to send dogs to the HS


it is a process of elimination, not assumption (which would sum up the whole we know of SP investigation)

Have you a link for the dogs? Tracker dogs were sent in early on and used from HS to Tesco weren't they?

 

[suzyjackson]

Have you a link for the dogs? Tracker dogs were sent in early on and used from HS to Tesco weren't they?

Not definite date but this from 15th Jan suggests that the dog search of the HS was about to start.

There was talk of an earlier dog search but I think it was referenced in a family Q & A that there'd been some confusion and the dogs had followed the wrong scent, does anyone remember that?

JMO


http://www.itv.com/news/anglia/upda...being-used-to-look-for-corrie-in-town-centre/

 

[Aye]

From the outset SP made a major mistake, it made a missing persons assumption, with the attacks on servicemen in recent years it was imperative to deal with C as a high priority as possible with the lowest assumption possible kidnap or higher because then finding the main lead would have pointed to find his mobile as a TOP priority 'we know its triangulation' C could have been found earlier, much earlier.

Now Elliot is playing cat and mouse spaghetti junction interviews for the protection of SP & its repeated failures, divide and conquer, her media training as many public servants inhouse training is designed to confuse, distract, pass blame (& N will know this from cases & facts she has worked on and what actually is said in public issued by Police Scotland).


One thing is certain - UK service personnel know for the first time in its history in the last few years they can be at more risk on UK soil than a deployment - and they can be certain if the worst was to happen the worst place to be stationed is on a base in SP boundary.


N will iPCC SP, there is no doubt, the evidence points to it, you always follow the main evidence even when distracted by other smaller lines of enquiry (Elliot's deliberate spaghetti junction public misinformation).


I cant imagine the thought of my child missing, and such inept police work surrounding such. Heartbreaking for N, C family & friends.