eucalyptuz
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snippet:
Perhaps 2013 earthquake injury in Pakistan?
It's a long shot but perhaps worth exploring:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Balochistan_earthquakes
Identified! UK - David Lytton, South Pennines, 'Neil Dovestone', 65-75, Dec'15
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Perhaps 2013 earthquake injury in Pakistan?
It's a long shot but perhaps worth exploring:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2013_Balochistan_earthquakes
ShakerSince92
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Just to add to this. I'm sure that there was some kind of accidental shooting involving the platt family that helped lead to there eventual demise.
CoverMeCagney
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Yes there was, they had a lovely big house up there but the owners brother accidentally shot himself, the family left the house and it fell to ruin before being bought by a water company I think. Following the Platt family down there were several mentions of people serving abroad in India and I wondered if our man could have been born in Pakistan hence him having a connection there. All extremely tenuous though!!
I'm more interested in the memorial trees , could "Neil" have gone there to be near a particular tree?
ShakerSince92
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The memorial tree line is interesting. Surely this would have been one of the police first lines of enquiry though? Much cheaper to conduct than isotope testing and queries with Indian hospitals.
MelmothTheLost
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A neverendum?
wfgodot
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wfgodot
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Okay -- so, most of us have our doubts this will be resolved by Christmas.
So this: why was the man on that moor in the first place?
Why was his body found in a relaxed, almost posed, position if he died by strychnine poisoning?
Was anyone else involved in his apparent suicide?
So this: why was the man on that moor in the first place?
Why was his body found in a relaxed, almost posed, position if he died by strychnine poisoning?
Was anyone else involved in his apparent suicide?
Not sure if this has already been discussed, but has anyone questioned why he would kill himself and in such a painful way. The obvious answer would be mental health problems, but he doesn;t strike me as someone in mental health crisis, maybe it was debt, after all the amusement arcade visit could point to gambling, although I dont think that is the case. Or possibly he killed himself due to guilt, has he potentially committed a crime that hasn't been discovered yet, or did he get away with something years ago and that has weighed heavily on him. Neil's suicide was very well thought through, this was not something that he did on a whim, there was detailed planning, there was a clear intention, there was a course of action. And it would make sense why he chose the method he did, it must have been a painful death why would he want to punish himself like that, and why would he take such drastic action to prevent himself from being i.d'd, could it be that if they identified him, they may identify something about his past
CD82
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Great points. I'm with you-- maybe once they ID him, they will link him to an unsolved homicide or crazy, weird case. Thanks for the post!
LaLaw2000
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I came over last night from the Lori Ruff page. This has really intrigued me.
Could this man have come here to spread someone's ashes? That is the first thing I thought of. He could have spread the ashes at a location up or down the trail and found someplace to hide the plastic bag they were in. Then he found a place to take the poison and lay down to die.
Maybe he is a Platt or his Mother was. Still, why all the secrecy? So much time has passed that I doubt anyone would know of an older man from their neighborhood that got rid of all of his things and disappeared. I am referring to the place where he first took the train.
The isotope research sounds promising. One day we will just sign on to WS and see that he has been identified just as we did with Kimberly! How many years will it take?
(MOO)
Could this man have come here to spread someone's ashes? That is the first thing I thought of. He could have spread the ashes at a location up or down the trail and found someplace to hide the plastic bag they were in. Then he found a place to take the poison and lay down to die.
Maybe he is a Platt or his Mother was. Still, why all the secrecy? So much time has passed that I doubt anyone would know of an older man from their neighborhood that got rid of all of his things and disappeared. I am referring to the place where he first took the train.
The isotope research sounds promising. One day we will just sign on to WS and see that he has been identified just as we did with Kimberly! How many years will it take?
(MOO)
It's possible he didn't realise how painful it would be.
CoverMeCagney
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It might have been me who linked this case on Lori's page, I have a tendency to do that when other threads slow down and we need more hands on deck on our lil ole UK cases! Good to see you here, Lalaw, been a while! Have you checked out the brilliant BBC report/presentation yet?
Legally Bland
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I wouldn't say this is 'dead on balls accurate' but I think I've got the locations pretty close. If proximity to a specific location is key, then the avalanche is closest.
I haven't been able to find locations for another 2 plane crashes or memorial trees.
But he could have just gone to a random place, this could be meaningless.
B is Neil, A the Clarence, blue line is his likely route.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.5...m1!4b1!4m2!6m1!1s1ct_ZMAJ5VWVyCvc9tdzAvtCpGTs
I haven't been able to find locations for another 2 plane crashes or memorial trees.
But he could have just gone to a random place, this could be meaningless.
B is Neil, A the Clarence, blue line is his likely route.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@53.5...m1!4b1!4m2!6m1!1s1ct_ZMAJ5VWVyCvc9tdzAvtCpGTs
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The thing that surprises me about this case is the lack of discussion about how the man got from Piccadilly to Greenfield, and why the journey wasn't seen on cctv.
He could have got a train from Piccadilly , changing at Stalybridge, and this would probably have been the best option. But presumably the police are satisfied that he did not re-enter the station after leaving it for the second time.
Alternatively, he could have got a direct train from Victoria station. But you'd imagine he'd have been caught on cctv there if so; and in any case, I really can't see why he'd have chosen this route in preference to changing at Stalybridge. Victoria is a fair walk from Piccadilly, although I suppose he could have hopped on one of the free Metrolink buses.
The idea of his travelling by bus is intriguing , because the Clarence is the final stop on route 180 from Piccadilly Gardens. Perhaps he went in there to ask for directions because he couldn't go any further on the bus, and it was right opposite. But if the landlord is correct about timings, he wouldn't have had time. The journey is over an hour, and he apparently left Piccadilly station at 13.01 and arrived at the Clarence at 2.
Nor does it seem that likely that he got a taxi, because when he left the station for the second time, it wasn't via the taxi rank exit, and yet he knew where that was because it was the exit he took previously. And in any case, I'm not sure why you'd take a taxi instead of the train; it would have been a lot more expensive, and I suspect not much quicker, if at all.
So, is it possible that he was met by someone at Piccadilly who took him to Greenfield? The fact that he left the station bang on 1pm is rather suggestive of an appointment to meet, and if so his apparently aimless behaviour can be attributed to time-killing. The fact that he subsequently spoke to someone on the information desk might contradict this theory, as the automatic assumption is that he was asking for advice about getting to Greenfield. However, he may simply have been asking about trains back to London; or perhaps he was unsure exactly where he was expected to meet his contact and was seeking information on the various different exits from Piccadilly. The fact that he subsequently left by a different exit from the one he'd previously tried would be consistent with this explanation.
Overall, I do think it it's odd that more effort hasn't been made to establish how he got to Greenfield, especially if a third party might be implicated in his death.
He could have got a train from Piccadilly , changing at Stalybridge, and this would probably have been the best option. But presumably the police are satisfied that he did not re-enter the station after leaving it for the second time.
Alternatively, he could have got a direct train from Victoria station. But you'd imagine he'd have been caught on cctv there if so; and in any case, I really can't see why he'd have chosen this route in preference to changing at Stalybridge. Victoria is a fair walk from Piccadilly, although I suppose he could have hopped on one of the free Metrolink buses.
The idea of his travelling by bus is intriguing , because the Clarence is the final stop on route 180 from Piccadilly Gardens. Perhaps he went in there to ask for directions because he couldn't go any further on the bus, and it was right opposite. But if the landlord is correct about timings, he wouldn't have had time. The journey is over an hour, and he apparently left Piccadilly station at 13.01 and arrived at the Clarence at 2.
Nor does it seem that likely that he got a taxi, because when he left the station for the second time, it wasn't via the taxi rank exit, and yet he knew where that was because it was the exit he took previously. And in any case, I'm not sure why you'd take a taxi instead of the train; it would have been a lot more expensive, and I suspect not much quicker, if at all.
So, is it possible that he was met by someone at Piccadilly who took him to Greenfield? The fact that he left the station bang on 1pm is rather suggestive of an appointment to meet, and if so his apparently aimless behaviour can be attributed to time-killing. The fact that he subsequently spoke to someone on the information desk might contradict this theory, as the automatic assumption is that he was asking for advice about getting to Greenfield. However, he may simply have been asking about trains back to London; or perhaps he was unsure exactly where he was expected to meet his contact and was seeking information on the various different exits from Piccadilly. The fact that he subsequently left by a different exit from the one he'd previously tried would be consistent with this explanation.
Overall, I do think it it's odd that more effort hasn't been made to establish how he got to Greenfield, especially if a third party might be implicated in his death.
Maybe his round- about route was actually a recollecting of days gone by, reliving his memories of the buses, the pub, the arcade, even if they might be the modern day replacement of those places?
Could it be that he stopped and asked for directions because he was a little lonely in his final hours, maybe he knowingly, or even subconsciously, was documenting his own end of life story, almost literally leaving it a cliff-hanger?
Speculation..
Could it be that he stopped and asked for directions because he was a little lonely in his final hours, maybe he knowingly, or even subconsciously, was documenting his own end of life story, almost literally leaving it a cliff-hanger?
Speculation..
dalsglen
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I think this is quite probably bang on dotr.
Not related to your post but I still cant get the neil name, hes definitely still a Dave to me!
It's an intriguing idea. However, although I think the location must have had a significance for him, the fact that he referred to it as 'the mountain' suggests to me that he hadn't grown up there. There might have been a family connection, of course.
CoverMeCagney
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Awesome map, LB!
Here's an article about the avalanche deaths in 1963. The men who died were born in 1934 and 1935. Could "Neil" be a brother of one of them, or one of the 100 rescuers, or just a friend or cousin? I'm thinking probably not and it would be like finding a needle in a haystack, but ya never know!
http://saddind.co.uk/dead-climbers-remembered/
The other 2 lads with them that fateful day were Allan Wheeler and John Smith who would now be about 70 -73 years old. Where are they now?
(John Smith, most common name in England, tut!)
Here's an article about the avalanche deaths in 1963. The men who died were born in 1934 and 1935. Could "Neil" be a brother of one of them, or one of the 100 rescuers, or just a friend or cousin? I'm thinking probably not and it would be like finding a needle in a haystack, but ya never know!
http://saddind.co.uk/dead-climbers-remembered/
The other 2 lads with them that fateful day were Allan Wheeler and John Smith who would now be about 70 -73 years old. Where are they now?
(John Smith, most common name in England, tut!)