GUILTY UK - Joanna Yeates, 25, Clifton, Bristol, 17 Dec 2010 #15

[Firefly75]

Don't underestimate VT. I suspect that he is a consummate actor.

And while you're about it, don't underestimate the possibility of a stupid, sentimentally inclined jury.

I'm afraid you might be right on both counts. It's downright worrying.

 

[aneurin]

No, was the answer in court (it could equally well come from sweat).

Also, the DNA analysis looks as though it was done through a type of low copy number technique, which has proved very controversial (and which was banned for a while because of doubts over its reliability).

DNA SenCE (used in the JY case) is indeed a "type of low copy number technique" but whereas the use of DNA LCN has been "very controversial", there has been no controversy over the use of DNA SenCE. They are two different low template methods used by two different companies.

 

[kINGFISHER]

Strange this Chaplin should come to the prison in January, I believe that's right, was this after VT was arrested. I tend to believe some of the other theories of involvement out there, none that have been mentioned on here.

 

[wfgodot]

Don't underestimate VT. I suspect that he is a consummate actor.

And while you're about it, don't underestimate the possibility of a stupid, sentimentally inclined jury.

Aiieee! Don't say that! Shhhh! It might come true and I will be PEEVED. (Faints.)

 

[edgedweller]

I'm afraid you might be right on both counts. It's downright worrying.

Oh don't. It doesn't bear thinking about that he might get off with manslaughter and get a paltry sentence of a few years. Then presumably he can go back to Holland and carry on with his life, nobody really knowing who he is.

The facts are though, that he did strangle her to death. How can that be done accidentally? And WHY was he trying to silence her? Surely the jury will want to know that?:waitasec:

 

[aneurin]

I'm surprised that it hasnt been reported but during a 'live' Sky broadcast outside the court at lunchtime, the reporter said how GR had testified that there was a broken pedestal in the hall with Jy's underwear on it (it wasn't made clear if that was an unusual place for her underwear to be) but maybe the 'broken' pedestal was what made the parents realise that there had been an 'incident'.... have searched for the footage but Sky have updated their report now.

Greg, who also felt a "buzzing level of stress", said at one point he noticed a green plastic pedestal had been chipped and two fragments about two and three inches long were lying on top together with a pair of Jo's briefs. Greg said they would not normally have been left there.

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepag...oat-for-20-seconds-to-stop-her-screaming.html

 

[edgedweller]

Strange this Chaplin should come to the prison in January, I believe that's right, was this after VT was arrested. I tend to believe some of the other theories of involvement out there, none that have been mentioned on here.

ooh ooh - like what? Any links?

 

[Clio]

Strange this Chaplin should come to the prison in January, I believe that's right, was this after VT was arrested. I tend to believe some of the other theories of involvement out there, none that have been mentioned on here.

From Skynewsgatherer

Mr Brotherton started to volunteer at prison in January. He has been a prison visitor since 1975

VT was arrested at ~6:00am on 20th January

 

[notsure]

I wonder if this chaplain bloke notifies his clients that he will only respect confidentiality if they are "religious". A decidedly dodgy character, imo.

Something he said sounded a bit odd to me: that VT wanted to tell him more, but he didn't want to hear it because it was too upsetting for him. Now surely a prison chaplain should be prepared to hear some shocking stuff?

 

[bos]

I wonder if this chaplain bloke notifies his clients that he will only respect confidentiality if they are "religious". A decidedly dodgy character, imo.

Something he said sounded a bit odd to me: that VT wanted to tell him more, but he didn't want to hear it because it was too upsetting for him. Now surely a prison chaplain should be prepared to hear some shocking stuff?

I got the impression that the Chaplain thought it was upsetting for VT?

Mr Brotherton told the court that Tabak wanted to talk more but that he didn't want him to as he was getting upset.by skynewsgatherer via twitter 10/18/2011 11:22:31 AM 12:22 PM

 

[Cherwell]

skynewsgatherer
Mr Brotherton told the court that Tabak wanted to talk more but that he didn't want him to as he was getting upset.

I took that to mean that VT was getting upset. That's the problem with these snippets, they are so brief they aren't always very clear.

Snap Bos

 

[Redgoblin]

So basically if VT was a religious person our kindly brother, Mr Brotherton wouldn't have reported it.

Sounds like a very Christian thing to do...NOT

I bet VT never researched that one, aw well.

 

[notsure]

Thank you bos and Cherwell. These tweets can be a bit ambiguous at times.

 

[goldielox]

The prosecutions evidence could be finished in the morning. Did they find no evidence in Flat 1? That would be most unusual. Where is the location of the blood causing injuries?

Unless lots covered that hasn't been reported there seems to be much that hasn't been discussed. Have they not covered how Jo may have received the injuries ie from a punch, from falling, any other reason etc etc?

Greg, who also felt a "buzzing level of stress", said at one point he noticed a green plastic pedestal had been chipped and two fragments about two and three inches long were lying on top together with a pair of Jo's briefs. Greg said they would not normally have been left there.

Reminds me back to the knicker sniffer theory discussions on here at the start of all this.

I wonder if this chaplain bloke notifies his clients that he will only respect confidentiality if they are "religious". A decidedly dodgy character, imo.

Something he said sounded a bit odd to me: that VT wanted to tell him more, but he didn't want to hear it because it was too upsetting for him. Now surely a prison chaplain should be prepared to hear some shocking stuff?

Not a very good advert for the Sally Army is he. I bet, now he's appeared at this trial, a lot of his inmate flock will be ducking out of sight when he turns up on his rounds next.

At least we all now know. If any athiests amongst us ever feel the need to confess to anything to a member of the religeous fraternity....don't.

 

[notsure]

I think the defence will concentrate on witness evidence that VT was tired and stressed after the night in question, and will present a case that he was repentant and maybe even that he would have confessed sooner or later. Testimony from people like the prison chaplain will help towards this.

 

[bijoux]

skynewsgatherer
Mr Brotherton told the court that Tabak wanted to talk more but that he didn't want him to as he was getting upset.

Should this lay chaplain person even have been talking to VT about the case without a lawyer present, whether the accused wanted to say something or not?

 

[masekwm]

So, there is some dna from her body of his and the blood in the boot.

Key And final witness tomorrow, must be the crying woman, TM.

 

[Firefly75]

Oh don't. It doesn't bear thinking about that he might get off with manslaughter and get a paltry sentence of a few years. Then presumably he can go back to Holland and carry on with his life, nobody really knowing who he is.

The facts are though, that he did strangle her to death. How can that be done accidentally? And WHY was he trying to silence her? Surely the jury will want to know that?:waitasec:

You're absolutely right, it doesn't bear thinking about. However, I'm worried it's possible. I get the impression sometimes that given the offense, the sentence is more severe if someone has called their ex 30 times in two hours than it would be if they committed murder. Disproportionate would be a better expression, I think. (I'd have to do some research to give examples, and I don't want to because I'm finding it too depressing.) But, do you know what I mean, he took her life and caused so much heartache to her family, boyfriend, friends, and to think that he might get a couple of years in prison, then get out and say, what's past is past, and move on - where will his victim be? Her family (and I'm including the boyfriend here)?

Consummate liar is right, I'm afraid. Strangling someone when you're standing in front of them is very unlikely to be done accidentally, in my opinion, and the victim had other injuries, too. As you say, why was he trying to silence her, and why did he put an arm around her in the first place? I shudder to think.

All I can think of right now is, thank god she was found. She may never have been found if he'd managed to get her into the quarry.

Apologies for pessimism.

 

[edgedweller]

Consummate liar is right, I'm afraid. Strangling someone when you're standing in front of them is very unlikely to be done accidentally, in my opinion, and the victim had other injuries, too. As you say, why was he trying to silence her, and why did he put an arm around her in the first place? I shudder to think.

All I can think of right now is, thank god she was found. She may never have been found if he'd managed to get her into the quarry.

Exactly - I'm sure her parents are at least glad of that. To never know what had happened would be a horrible torture. At least she was found and given a proper burial surrounded by those that loved her. It is just such a waste of life.

I wonder if the defence are going to claim that she invited him in after seeing him outside and something happened in the bedroom (earrings displaced from bedside table) and that she 'led him on' then changed her mind...? Then she walked out to the hall/asked him to leave and that's where the struggle took place. He panicked as he was worried Jo would tell TM. So this would be later, more like 9.30-10pm in their view. Feel sorry for Greg if this is their tactic - talk about blemishing Jo's memory.

 

[edgedweller]

Key And final witness tomorrow, must be the crying woman, TM.

Hope so! I am interested to hear her take on it - how he seemed when he picked her up, etc. I cannot even imagine being able to function after doing such a thing, even if it WAS unintentional! Let alone chatting with girlfriend, going to burger van etc. "Detached" is the right word...:furious: