GUILTY UK - Karen Buckley, 24, Glasgow, Scotland, 12 April 2015 - #1

[YidArmyRach]

I don't think we will find that out until the trial. AP has a decent amount of friends on FB so unlikely he was a loner type that went out alone. I'd say he was there with a friend. He seems to be friends with several bar staff so maybe he went out a lot.

As for the knife it probably isn't relevant to the case, there are probably dozens of knifes in that canal as people fish in it.

Not being argumentative, but that means nothing. Kids add pretty much every pupil at their school, and rarely delete them when they leave, then continue to add "friends", often people they've never met. Even the unpopular kids will get added onto other people's FB accounts.

My 19 year old has over 1,200 friends on Facebook - yet hangs around with the same 9 or 10 people most of the time.

 

[still-searching]

Thought the same thing rather strange thing to be hanging on a window in mid April.

It's a somewhat studenty area. Students have all sorts of weird things in their flats. I remember having a mini heart attack looking up at a window in student halls and seeing Edward Cullen from Twilight staring back at me (a cardboard cut out).

 

[CoverMeCagney]

It's a somewhat studenty area. Students have all sorts of weird things in their flats. I remember having a mini heart attack looking up at a window in student halls and seeing Edward Cullen from Twilight staring back at me (a cardboard cut out).

Haha, same thing happened to me with Noel Gallagher, in Lancaster.
I waved :blushing:

 

[Deleted member 102539]

The knife found in the canal near AP flat may or may not be connected as no reports at all mention stabbing.

http://www.sundayworld.com/news/crimedesk/eight-inch-blade-discovered-near-suspects-home

But: "Formal identification has yet to take place, but police believe the body parts belong to that of Buckley."

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/karen-buck...rested-after-human-remains-found-farm-1496663

 

[Alyce]

Another thing which makes me think it's not Gallus footage is that on the video at 2.12 you can see the actual monitor, some of the writing is in Chinese as if the system has been set up in that language. The R&N place is owned by Chinese people.

Not that it really matters! I'm more interested in why Church St was mentioned as wherever the CCTV is from it doesn't look like they went up there at all.

I'm wondering if AP said his car was on Church Street to misdirect the investigation ? in the hope that the police would not find any CCTV footage of where it really was

 

[Alyce]

A lot of the "accounts from friends" have been taken from boards.ie and other irish forums and some have been pretty conflicting so I'd say they're just gossip rather than definite facts.

I really can't see how they would keep the glass with contents in it unless they handed it to bar staff to look after. You can't leave a club holding a glass, a taxi driver wouldn't let you in their vehicle with a glass so the chances of her friends getting the glass back to hill street are very slim.

Would have been easy for me to do........ I have large handbags and always have at least one small plastic bag inside ( in case need to put wet umbrella in there ! ) so I could have easily put the glass into the plastic bag and then into my handbag

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I'm wondering if AP said his car was on Church Street to misdirect the investigation ? in the hope that the police would not find any CCTV footage of where it really was

This is why I can't think it was premeditated. Surely anyone would assume there is CCTV around bars and nightclubs? If you really wanted to go out to find a girl to murder, that kind of street would be the last place: too many people, traffic, cameras etc.

 

[Cherwell]

I really can't see how they would keep the glass with contents in it unless they handed it to bar staff to look after. You can't leave a club holding a glass, a taxi driver wouldn't let you in their vehicle with a glass so the chances of her friends getting the glass back to hill street are very slim.

It's quite possible that they did just that.

 

[Irishguy]

But: "Formal identification has yet to take place, but police believe the body parts belong to that of Buckley."

http://www.ibtimes.co.uk/karen-buck...rested-after-human-remains-found-farm-1496663

That is why the picture of the knife chilled me such much, if stabbing wasn't the cause of death then it seriously disturbs me to think of what the knife may have been used for after death. However that river is used by fisherman a poster has said so its possible the knife pulled from the river may not be connected to this horrific atrocity.

 

[Irishguy]

I'm wondering if AP said his car was on Church Street to misdirect the investigation ? in the hope that the police would not find any CCTV footage of where it really was

Its possible he did this, as he also told the Police that she left his flat at 4 AM, when if it played out as the media are reporting Karen could have been dead much earlier.

 

[sar2them1984]

Based on reports of Karen's friends, they were concerned about her very quickly. I know that the CCTV show Karen and AP walking together and she doesn't seem to be under duress however, any ruse may have convinced Karen to go with him. I'm also guessing that AP was hanging around and they were concerned about him. They kept her glass with some contents still in it. They were worried about her drink from the onset. This tells me that things were going on in the club that we are not privy to.

Ted Bundy managed to get women to leave with him under the guise of helping him carry things while he pretended to have a broken arm or a broken leg.

So although appearances are that she left with him willingly I think we need to remember that perhaps she left willingly under the guise of a ruse. Her body language tells me she's cold perhaps but also defensive.

Karen's friends are adamant that she's not a drug user or a one night stand kind of girl and I believe them based on their early concern. They thought something was not right very quickly.

I think he was onto her....she left to use the restroom....he saw his chance to cut her away from her herd...convinced her to come and see something or help him with something and she went. It was over before she knew it.

I also think that this isn't the first time. I think he was working on technique.

Very very sad.

Do we definitively know that they kept the glass and that it is not hearsay ? It would be rather wierd for a group of young twenty somethings to keep their mates glass purely on the basis that they went to the loo and did not come back. What did they do with it? Would have been mighty difficult to get it out of club and really if they asked for it to be put on one side in the club do they really think it would have. The club would probably have been busy and it would have been mixed up with other glasses and in all honesty most clubs would not want to acknowledge that spiking was taking place on their premises (can lead to licensing issues) so would they really have put it to one side to be tested later??

 

[Ironside]

Do we definitively know that they kept the glass and that it is not hearsay ? It would be rather wierd for a group of young twenty somethings to keep their mates glass purely on the basis that they went to the loo and did not come back. What did they do with it? Would have been mighty difficult to get it out of club and really if they asked for it to be put on one side in the club do they really think it would have. The club would probably have been busy and it would have been mixed up with other glasses and in all honesty most clubs would not want to acknowledge that spiking was taking place on their premises (can lead to licensing issues) so would they really have put it to one side to be tested later??

I think it could just be hearsay, the accounts from friends only come from irish forums that anyone can post on and can't really be taken as gospel. Had we read about the glass on a friends FB page I'd be far more inclined to believe it. The account claimed the police had glass with contents in it, it would be difficult to get a glass with liquid in it out of the club and preserve it. The only way is if they handed it to bar staff to keep safe but it seems unlikely the staff would take the situation that seriously just because they couldn't find her in the club. Unless of course the friends witnessed AP hanging around her glass and were very sure he was spiking her.

Her friends could have a lot of evidence to give in court or they could be just as baffled as we all are as to why she left with him.

 

[Thistlegirl]

One thing I haven't seen mentioned is who was AP at the club with, was he on his own or did he enter the club with friends? A 21 year old going to a club on his own and parking his car around the corner seems a bit odd to me.

One of his FB friends has his job title as barman at Sanctuary.

 

[Irishguy]

The biggest two questions for me are why did she leave the club with him and when did it turn nasty.

 

[gregjrichards]

This is why I can't think it was premeditated. Surely anyone would assume there is CCTV around bars and nightclubs? If you really wanted to go out to find a girl to murder, that kind of street would be the last place: too many people, traffic, cameras etc.

I would be interested to know what your thoughts are on someone who commits a crime like this. Do you think someone accused of this commits the crime because they were in a rage because someone they fancied spurned their advances to have sleep with then or do you think they had a rape or violent fantasy they decided to act out? *carefully worded do to compliance with court order.

I was thinking maybe an accused person would maybe say they had lost something in the street and asked for her help to find it. Or maybe they wanted to introduce them to someone they knew outside or said someone they knew was outside looking for them. It is a mystery leaving without telling your friends you were leaving and where to or even grabbing your jacket before you go.

 

[Irishguy]

No rape charge in any reports, was she just strangled in the park or is it possible that they cant bring rape charges over the body being covered in corrosive substances therefore not being able to find DNA?

 

[Irishguy]

One of his FB friends has his job title as barman at Sanctuary.

Has the accuseds FB page been removed?

 

[Thistlegirl]

Has the accuseds FB page been removed?

https://www.facebook.com/apacteau?fref=ts

 

[yellowxo]

Just wanted to say so what if Karen wanted a one night stand, people are saying she wasn't that sort of girl etc so what if a girl has one night stands! It doesn't make a womans murder more justified It's not people on here just comments on FB .
Her friends said she wasn't a drinking type only had 1-2 drinks, didn't touch drugs and wasn't a one night stand sort of girl, if something happened to me on a night out my friends wouldn't say anything that could be viewed negatively to the press. I'm 22 and before i met my fiance I had been known to drink, party and wander off ( had a couple of one night stands too one with a proper minger!!) this was me privately no one knows about it apart from trusted friends and if my family found out about i'd be mortified . I don't understand why Karen would have gone off with AP, maybe she lost her friends in the packed club, got chatting to AP he agreed to help her look for her mates, go to another bar, maybe he showed a charming side? IDK but AP could have put on a charming & friendly act.

IMO I think karen walked with AP, AP suggested going to his flat to pick something up, he tried it on karen turned him down/changed her mind he got really angry raped karen, hit her and strangled her then dumped her body.

 

[Ironside]

There are not any late bars in the direction they were walking. I think we all agree though that whatever reason she left with him it was not her fault in any way what happened to her.