Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #14 *ARREST*

[Vermont24]

I need to rewatch the footage but don’t we see the bike firstly leaving the park and then going back in? Not the other way round? In which case where did he get his bike from?

We don't see the bike leaving/entering the park at all.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

I need to rewatch the footage but don’t we see the bike firstly leaving the park and then going back in? Not the other way round? In which case where did he get his bike from?

Yes, the cyclist was going away from the park on the first clip, then back towards it 10 minutes later.

 

[Catsarse]

Just re-analysing the Croda CCTV footage that appears to be a key piece of the puzzle.

I really thought that the police would of put specific timings on each of the four eventful scenes that we see. Rather than two ranges of time, it would be more helpful.

The first scene is of the fluorescent jacket runner. He’s been scared by something he’s heard or seen, so he’s ran not wanting to be on the isolated path. Coming down to a slow jog and a look over the shoulder now he’s in a more open and lit area.

Why wouldn’t he come forward?
Has he been caught sneaking out early from work for a night shift?
Is he sneaking out for an affair?
Was he drunk, does he not remember?
Has he been jumped for his bike and is embarrassed?

The second scene, the cyclist. The most dodgiest character in all of this CCTV’s footage. Why would you be leaving and then re-entering a desolate road in the early hours of Friday morning adjacent to the park? My theory is this is Pawel.

Libby has been left in an area in the dark park. Pawel is on his way home to get something or maybe information so he can return to cover his tracks.

The third scene, Pawel on a bike. Is coming back towards the park. To use whatever he has obtained or learnt from going home.

The fourth scene, a couple has passed Pawel further down the path before they come onto screen. They have safety in numbers at this point so wouldn’t be intimadated by the cyclist but police have been wondered what they have seen or where he was going.

Why would they have not come forward?
Are they having an affair and don’t want to risk their marriages?
Are they drunk and do not remember?
Are they dodgy characters themselves in their own right and not wanting police attention on themselves?

Dubious points of my theory:

When did he take his car home? Before or after he carried out his cycling escapade? Is it logical he could have a cycle there and then?

It’s difficult to make sense of. Let me know what you think.

I said the same a little while ago, I myself think that yep they’re either as dodgy as anything, or owt as we say here and don’t want to come forward. Especially if you’re dealing/delivering drugs or on them yourself.

Or

Scared to come forward? Never been in this situation but regardless of moral compass I would be straight up bricking it at the thought of coming forward, going to court etc

Then great ideas you’ve put forward of drunk, affairs, not where they said they were maybe to other halves which straight away makes you look dodgy.

I just think this is so important due to the repetition of the police in asking for help

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Yes, the cyclist was going away from the park on the first clip, then back towards it 10 minutes later.

I've asked a couple of our cyclists to test out if they can get to a 24 hour garage and back in that time.

 

[paddy40]

I’m torn on the bike point to be honest paddy. On one hand it can be unlikely but on the other he had a decent time frame, not far from his home and he could be described as “resourceful” given his burglary links.

Yeah if he could his hands on a bike it could be him but whoever it is , does look very suspect cycling back and forth at that hour

 

[Miss_French]

Regards her not having keys ? Was that confirmed by police / friends even ?

It wasn't confirmed either way.

 

[CoverMeCagney]

Just re-analysing the Croda CCTV footage that appears to be a key piece of the puzzle.

I really thought that the police would of put specific timings on each of the four eventful scenes that we see. Rather than two ranges of time, it would be more helpful.

@DanCJ the police DID tell us the timings:

The first clip shows an individual, believed to be in a light coloured T shirt and dark trousers, at first running into view on Oak Road and then walking out of shot at 1.13am.

The second clip shows a figure on a bike cycling along Oak Road towards Clough Road at 1.24am, and is then seen cycling back up Oak Road at 1.34am.

The third clip shows two people, one who appears to be dressed all in dark clothing and the second in light coloured trousers and a dark coloured top walking along Oak Road at 2.34am.

Libby Squire – witnesses sought on CCTV footage | Humberside Police

 

[ChiCubs2016]

That video is giving me doubts her body travelled all that way without being spotted!

I thought the opposite. It made more inclined to think it was possible since her body might not be at the surface the whole time.

 

[DanCJ]

Interesting theory Dan, thank you for sharing.

Can I ask, if you think PR is the cyclist, are you suggesting he drove his car home, began worrying that he hadn’t covered his tracks, cycled back into the park, checked he’d cleared the scene, and then cycled home?

I need to rewatch the footage but don’t we see the bike firstly leaving the park and then going back in? Not the other way round? In which case where did he get his bike from?

That’s correct Audiohoney, the bike leaves the adjacent park path then goes back. Odd behaviour at that time of night.

That’s the thing he must of obtained a bike somehow. I realise this does sound far fetched though.

 

[Mommysleuth11]

Or to play devils advocate, is he a very good planner?
The amount of houses he got into, rifling through people’s knicker drawers, taking cash/sex toys etc seems to me like he’s scoped a few places out. Maybe he knew the area, but I know areas of hull and surrounding and I sure wouldn’t by trying doors and entering homes-that’s a certain type of ballsiness to do that!

Has he seen women he liked the look of? Is this linked to the Wellesley masturbation charge and others in that he’s followed them, watched them and their homes, got to know the best timings of entering their homes (shudder). Watched for lights going on and off so he knew their bedrooms?

To me his behaviours seem to take somewhat of a plan for him to try his best to not be caught in a house, and also to know when and where to run to when he was flashing/fondling in case (on the off chance) someone did give chase.

I dont think he was that clever. Do you know that he wasnt caught inside anyones house? Perhaps by a woman who wouldnt have apprehended him had she returned home to find him standing at the top of her stairs?

 

[Catsarse]

Yeah if he could his hands on a bike it could be him but whoever it is , does look very suspect cycling back and forth at that hour

Dealing?

Garage run? Are the garages near pets at home and b&q 24 hours?

I’m just wondering do the police have more footage that they don’t want to show (eg the direction these people left oak road when they reached Clough Road/cyclist popping out around Beresford area)
There’s a fair few shops down Clough Road and the police station so hopefully they have more info on these people. Which makes me think it’s mostly just to hear them say “yes we did hear/see something”

 

[Audiohoney]

We don't see the bike leaving/entering the park at all.

Help me out Vermont because whilst I’ve studied maps / videos & the pics you and Stronts have kindly shared, I do get mistaken at times.

He’s cycling parallel to and past the park? Not in and out of it?

 

[RosalindaA]

I’ve wondered about this too. Obviously this would be a horrific scenario. If PR is guilty and there isn’t enough evidence to charge him, there’s a very real chance he will walk free this summer. If this were to happen, can somebody like PR stop his pattern of behaviour? Is the fact that he so nearly got caught enough to frighten him into stopping his line of escalation and starting a new life with no further incident? Or is it physically impossible to temper these urges? I realise this is a question for a psychologist. Just wondering what people’s thoughts are. Obviously praying it does not come to this.

I think men like this are always a risk to others, given the opportunity. One of the interesting things that has been noted from cases where DNA science is finally identifying long-lost rapists/murderers, (GSK, Claremont serial killer, killer of April Tinsley etc ) is that there are periods where they go dormant or stop of their own accord. Or in the case of April Tinsley's murderer, he does not APPEAR to have carried on attacking children although of course, it's difficult to establish this for certain.

So I think we have to re-consider the idea that all of them are compelled/driven to offend. Personally, I think this is yet another excuse that they use to justify their crimes. Bottom line is most of them do it because they fantasize about it and want to carry it out. GSK appears to have stopped when he realized that DNA would catch up with him. The killer of Christy Mirack appears to have no other victims. The man implicated for the murders of JB Beasley and Tracie Hawlett appears to have not re-offended and led a productive life.

The prosecutor in the Claremont case has specifically linked the attacks on other women to periods when the accused was having difficulties in his marriage https://www.watoday.com.au/national...kdown-prosecution-claims-20190220-p50z4t.html
Many other offenders of this type attack women unknown to them when they are having relationship difficulties, you will often find this mentioned in profiles.

I may be being over-optimistic but I do believe Libby's killer will be charged and hopefully convicted. In general the UK has a high clear-up rate for murder, and in this case to me there is every indication that police have always regarded this as an abduction/murder. And to be blunt, this is a high profile case, with a very sympathetic victim and family and a university, a city and a public that wants and expects justice for this horrible crime. And the police maybe have questions to answer as to why he wasn't apprehended earlier. Undoubtedly they also want the person who did this to Libby to pay for it, seem pretty sure they have the right person, so at the moment I have faith this will happen.

 

[DanCJ]

@DanCJ the police DID tell us the timings:

The first clip shows an individual, believed to be in a light coloured T shirt and dark trousers, at first running into view on Oak Road and then walking out of shot at 1.13am.

The second clip shows a figure on a bike cycling along Oak Road towards Clough Road at 1.24am, and is then seen cycling back up Oak Road at 1.34am.

The third clip shows two people, one who appears to be dressed all in dark clothing and the second in light coloured trousers and a dark coloured top walking along Oak Road at 2.34am.

Libby Squire – witnesses sought on CCTV footage | Humberside Police

Cheers Cags, I must of missed that.

 

[Vermont24]

Help me out Vermont because whilst I’ve studied maps / videos & the pics you and Stronts have kindly shared, I do get mistaken at times.

He’s cycling parallel to and past the park? Not in and out of it?

That's the one!

 

[Mommysleuth11]

I dont think 10 minutes is long enough for PR to make it home from clough rd on a bike and back again, much less have time to do anything whilst there.

 

[JosieJo]

Personally I think its unlikely these people heard anything of great help if they had they may have come forward ...its possible they may want to know if they saw PRs car parked up ..but then again unless it was in an unusual position ?
I really think these people were just taking a short cut .. very few people walked through during those few hours (unless others already came forward)
It looks a very scary lane to pass through ..but one was on a bike so risks it ..one is a pair so brave in numbers..and the other runs through the scary part

 

[Vermont24]

@DanCJ That's not Pawel cycling to his house and back. Not in 10 mins.

 

[Catsarse]

I dont think he was that clever. Do you know that he wasnt caught inside anyones house? Perhaps by a woman who wouldnt have apprehended him had she returned home to find him standing at the top of her stairs?

Totally agree that the majority of people wouldn’t give chase, but he’s taking a massive risk on the 1% that might (appreciate that’s probably part of the thrill)
I just think that he HAS planned though. Planned to be in their homes. Go through their personal and intimate items.
Take money and foreign money from another house.
Pick the women he’s had a ham shank in front of.

To me, personally, that takes a degree of planning, cunning and an ability to keep cool under pressure

 

[motherofdaughters]

That video is giving me doubts her body travelled all that way without being spotted!

I think 99% of the time it would have been spotted, I'd say for whatever reasons the body has sunk and stayed submerged until it exited. Possibly getting snagged on bends and debris at low tide and the surge of high tide shunting it along again. That river is also expcetionally...... brown, you can see naff all in it. My children always comment on it when we cross the bridge, they call it the river out of Charlie and the chocolate factory.
Just another sad series of events , I'd say.