Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #17 *ARREST*

[mrjitty]

Yes. The river Hull is open to the Humber. The barrier is only closed at very high tides.

Can you pass the sluice with a sea kayak?

 

[HopeForGoodNews]

Can you pass the sluice with a sea kayak?

No. This is a picture of the sluice taken from the wikipedia page.

Beverley and Barmston Drain - Wikipedia


Edited to add Map of area (sluice is located at the big red marker)

 

[Cherwell]

IMO they had enough to charge him with abduction initially.

I don't see how. They would have had to prove that Libby didn't go with him willingly, or that he didn't take her where she wanted to go, or refused to let her out. All very difficult without witnesses or camera evidence.

 

[Newthoughts]

I don't see how. They would have had to prove that Libby didn't go with him willingly, or that he didn't take her where she wanted to go, or refused to let her out. All very difficult without witnesses or camera evidence.

They had camera evidence.

It doesn't matter whether she got in willingly it's whether she got in knowing that he was a sex offender and wasn't going to drop her off safely. She'd disappeared.

If I, for example, get into a taxi or a friend's car in the expectation that they will leave me somewhere and they don't - I'd say that's abduction. Otherwise every kidnapper, rapist and murderer could use the defence that that they got in willingly

 

[Cherwell]

I don't think they could prove abduction, or they would have charged him.
They had camera evidence that Libby (presuming it is her) got into the car, but that is all, as far as we know.

 

[motherofdaughters]

Just popped back to see if there was any advance on an arrest but nope.
No further in at all it seems.
Wether you/I believe PR is guilty or someone else, it seems they’re missing a break through piece of evidence that’s seeming unlikely to materialise.
I’m not confident this case will be brought before a court and if it does it seems the evidence is shakey so an unlikely conviction.


I did find the
‘Why didn’t he plead guilty earlier’ interesting . I’d not considered that, even though I know about sentence reductions etc.
Does seem odd retrospectively.
Arrogance?
Bad advice?

And my last question;

 

[Newthoughts]

I don't think they could prove abduction, or they would have charged him.
They had camera evidence that Libby (presuming it is her) got into the car, but that is all, as far as we know.

Difficult to 'prove' anything which is why I didn't use that word.

Someone gets into his car the same time as she disappears in the only place she could disappear - i.e. not covered by cameras.

He's obviously tracked going somewhere.

She clearly didn't get out and go home or anywhere else safely.

That's as much as you'd get it any abduction case.

 

[Cherwell]

You said "they had enough to charge him with abduction initially".
Clearly the police or the CPS did not agree with you.

Let's be clear, I'm not disputing the abduction. Only whether there was sufficient evidence to charge PR back in February.

 

[Newthoughts]

Just popped back to see if there was any advance on an arrest but nope.
No further in at all it seems.
Wether you/I believe PR is guilty or someone else, it seems they’re missing a break through piece of evidence that’s seeming unlikely to materialise.
I’m not confident this case will be brought before a court and if it does it seems the evidence is shakey so an unlikely conviction.


I did find the
‘Why didn’t he plead guilty earlier’ interesting . I’d not considered that, even though I know about sentence reductions etc.
Does seem odd retrospectively.
Arrogance?
Bad advice?

And my last question;

Very odd given the weight of evidence. Can't see any solicitor advising him to plead not guilty with all of that.

I can only think he wanted to distress or see the victims again.

 

[Newthoughts]

You said "they had enough to charge him with abduction".
Clearly the police or the CPS did not agree with you.

We don't know that because the minute they got his DNA they were able to charge him with several unrelated offences with damning forensics.

Why waste time building an abduction case when you don't immediately need to and think it might be much more anyway.

Without the sexual offences do you think they'd have let him out?

 

[Cherwell]

We don't know that because the minute they got his DNA they were able to charge him with several unrelated offences with damning forensics.
Why waste time building an abduction case when you don't immediately need to and think it might be much more anyway.
Without the sexual offences do you think they'd have let him out?

They might have had to. But it's moot.
This discussion is going round in circles so I'm out.

 

[bluesntwos]

Can you pass the sluice with a sea kayak?

we are sort of going around in circles here at the moment. mention sluice once more and we will have otto back you will be lucky to get a carrier bag through it never mind a body. It stops all the crap from barmston drain entering the river hull.

 

[Ruthbullock]

Detectives were granted up to 96 hours to question the suspect but did not officially name him at the time. After four days of questioning, he was released under investigation in that case.
Pawel Relowicz officially linked to Libby Squire case for first time

Police have released the 25-year-old man arrested on suspicion of murdering tragic student Libby Squire.
Humberside Police detectives had quizzed the man they had detained on Wednesday night, but have since released a statement saying he has been "released under investigation as further enquiries continue".
Libby Squire murder: Update on man arrested for Hull student's death

PR was released under investigation over LS in Feb- did they close the investigation in secret, only to arrest him again? If he was still under investigation, they can question him anytime (it’s not being arrested again). What are people’s theories as to the release of this information now? Just curious!

 

[Cherwell]

He wasn't arrested for murder the first time.

 

[ChiCubs2016]

we are sort of going around in circles here at the moment. mention sluice once more and we will have otto back you will be lucky to get a carrier bag through it never mind a body. It stops all the crap from barmston drain entering the river hull.

I like otto.

Also maybe it was too early for me but when I originally read the following quote I thought it was some kind of crazy local slang! Like pass the sugar or something. I know OT!!

Can you pass the sluice with a sea kayak?

 

[Ruthbullock]

He wasn't arrested for murder the first time.

That makes sense, but they didn’t rearrest him before they just added offences and took him to court over voyeurism, thefts etc- so my question still stands

A 24-year-old man arrested over the disappearance of university student Libby Squire will go on trial later this year charged with 12 unrelated offences.
Man arrested over Libby Squire disappearance faces trial over unrelated offences

 

[tresir2012]

I don't think they could prove abduction, or they would have charged him.
They had camera evidence that Libby (presuming it is her) got into the car, but that is all, as far as we know.

That was enough for the abduction of Ying Ying Zhang's kidnapper and murderer and they never did have the body. She got in willingly too. I know that was in the states but it is the intent of the abductor to deceive that is the key IMO.

 

[tresir2012]

He wasn't arrested for murder the first time.

Was it suspicion of murder or suspicion of abduction or abduction? Difficult to remember all the charges once the other stuff came up.

 

[tresir2012]

Detectives were granted up to 96 hours to question the suspect but did not officially name him at the time. After four days of questioning, he was released under investigation in that case.
Pawel Relowicz officially linked to Libby Squire case for first time

Police have released the 25-year-old man arrested on suspicion of murdering tragic student Libby Squire.
Humberside Police detectives had quizzed the man they had detained on Wednesday night, but have since released a statement saying he has been "released under investigation as further enquiries continue".
Libby Squire murder: Update on man arrested for Hull student's death

PR was released under investigation over LS in Feb- did they close the investigation in secret, only to arrest him again? If he was still under investigation, they can question him anytime (it’s not being arrested again). What are people’s theories as to the release of this information now? Just curious!

I don't think they did anything except add more things and then charge him for what they were able to prove.

ETA he was saying he let her out at her address IIRC or did he admit taking her to the park, then they went back and concentrated on a bench in the park? I remember cone markers for some reason. But it could be another case I'm thinking of.

 

[HopeForGoodNews]

I don't think they did anything except add more things and then charge him for what they were able to prove.

ETA he was saying he let her out at her address IIRC or did he admit taking her to the park, then they went back and concentrated on a bench in the park? I remember cone markers for some reason. But it could be another case I'm thinking of.

We don't know what he said to the police. The police did go back to the park late one night and checked a bench but no details of findings have ever been released.

Most of the conversations on here are purely speculation based on where police searched etc in the days after Libby went missing.