Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #17 *ARREST*

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tresir2012 said:
Was it suspicion of murder or suspicion of abduction or abduction? Difficult to remember all the charges once the other stuff came up.
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Both are suspicion of- the other charges were just added later and went straight to court (no second arrest, as he was already under investigation albeit for a different crime). IMO from a legal perspective the sentencing for the other crimes does not automatically close the under investigation part- so if the recent news is about PR why has he been arrested again (have they been forced to close the abduction aspect by the CPS, so now having to arrest on an entirely different charge?, otherwise they can just change/add to the charges no need to arrest again as he is still under investigation) Just my thoughts, I know many think that the police felt they could just gain more time to investigate etc, but I personally think they are a bit more professional and a bit more logical than that. It’s the wording of an arrest- that is putting questions in my mind (if you are of the absolute mindset that it was PR who they are talking about, it asks more questions than answers)
ETA and I do think it is probably PR they were talking about hence his name being released in certain newspapers
 
tresir2012 said:
Was it suspicion of murder or suspicion of abduction or abduction? Difficult to remember all the charges once the other stuff came up.
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Initially arrested on suspicion of abducting her. Kept for the maximum allowable time which is difficult to get.

Difficult to remember time frames but police went from saying abduction to saying kidnapping at one point. And from saying missing person enquiry to saying they feared she'd come to harm. I'm not really clear on the distinction between abduction and kidnapping.

Then to homicide to murder.
 
Ruthbullock said:
Both are suspicion of- the other charges were just added later and went straight to court (no second arrest, as he was already under investigation albeit for a different crime). IMO from a legal perspective the sentencing for the other crimes does not automatically close the under investigation part- so if the recent news is about PR why has he been arrested again (have they been forced to close the abduction aspect by the CPS, so now having to arrest on an entirely different charge?, otherwise they can just change/add to the charges no need to arrest again as he is still under investigation) Just my thoughts, I know many think that the police felt they could just gain more time to investigate etc, but I personally think they are a bit more professional and a bit more logical than that. It’s the wording of an arrest- that is putting questions in my mind (if you are of the absolute mindset that it was PR who they are talking about, it asks more questions than answers)
ETA and I do think it is probably PR they were talking about hence his name being released in certain newspapers
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Could it be that they had the maximum amount of time to question him after he was arrested in suspicion of abduction? Though he remained under investigation? Hence further questions had to be under a new arrest?

It would need a legal person to answer that properly though
 
Ruthbullock said:
Both are suspicion of- the other charges were just added later and went straight to court (no second arrest, as he was already under investigation albeit for a different crime). IMO from a legal perspective the sentencing for the other crimes does not automatically close the under investigation part- so if the recent news is about PR why has he been arrested again (have they been forced to close the abduction aspect by the CPS, so now having to arrest on an entirely different charge?, otherwise they can just change/add to the charges no need to arrest again as he is still under investigation) Just my thoughts, I know many think that the police felt they could just gain more time to investigate etc, but I personally think they are a bit more professional and a bit more logical than that. It’s the wording of an arrest- that is putting questions in my mind (if you are of the absolute mindset that it was PR who they are talking about, it asks more questions than answers)
ETA and I do think it is probably PR they were talking about hence his name being released in certain newspapers
Click to expand...
I think police can arrest on suspicion of anything and hold for 24 hours. Longer requires a judge. Then when/if they are released that's the end of it unless they are rearrested and charged. With PR he was charged with other offences and found guilty. This time they arrested him for murder but still haven't charged him but have stated he has been released under investigation. They will rearrest when they are ready to charge him IMO. They could then arrest him for abduction, rape and murder depending on the evidence. MOO
 
Newthoughts said:
Could it be that they had the maximum amount of time to question him after he was arrested in suspicion of abduction? Though he remained under investigation? Hence further questions had to be under a new arrest?

It would need a legal person to answer that properly though
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There is no maximum time in the UK if remaining under investigation, and they can question as often as they want and add charges- hence my suspicion about CPS and abduction.
 
tresir2012 said:
I think police can arrest on suspicion of anything and hold for 24 hours. Longer requires a judge. Then when/if they are released that's the end of it unless they are rearrested and charged. With PR he was charged with other offences and found guilty. This time they arrested him for murder but still haven't charged him but have stated he has been released under investigation. They will rearrest when they are ready to charge him IMO. They could then arrest him for abduction, rape and murder depending on the evidence. MOO
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Released under investigation is indefinite time wise in the UK, unless cleared of the original charges (additional charges can be added without arresting again). So if it is PR, there is not enough evidence to charge so that case has been dropped. Which is unlikely as they would have then had to arrest again for the other charges theft etc (which they didn’t so he was still under investigation).
 
Newthoughts said:
Round here all the traffic lights have cameras with ANPR. Including pedestrian crossing lights. There is a crossing close to the junction of Beverley and Beresford - that should have caught him as well.

LE also requested dash cam and shop CCTV from everyone up to 3am. Quite a long time frame.

I guess it's once he heads into residential areas it gets tougher. It's so lucky spidercam was there. Well hidden and unexpected but unusual in a residential street. They could however track him out of those areas.

IMO they had enough to charge him with abduction initially. But I guess if they could clear up a great chunk of outstanding sexual crimes and keep him off the streets they might as well make the most of it. Gives them the rare luxury of extra time.

IMO something relevant must happen in the unseen minutes of spidercam. Something relevant was said during the reporting blackout at the start of his sentencing - I didn't even know consecutive sentencing existed in the UK. Something is important in the later Oak Road CCTV.

IMO only - something is complicating about this case. But I can't think what
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Great summary.
 
Ruthbullock said:
Released under investigation is indefinite time wise in the UK, unless cleared of the original charges (additional charges can be added without arresting again). So if it is PR, there is not enough evidence to charge so that case has been dropped. Which is unlikely as they would have then had to arrest again for the other charges theft etc (which they didn’t so he was still under investigation).
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Now it is confusing. I like to look at it like drink driving. Police can stop you if they suspect you of drink driving. They talk to you, smell alcohol on your breath or if they don't you confirm verbally you have been drinking. Then they breathalyse you. If the breathalyser indicates you are over the limit, that confirms the suspicion and they arrest you, etc etc. Back at the station, maybe you pass the next one so they don't charge you. They then release you. If you fail the second one too they will charge you and take blood or urine for prosecuting. Once they have charged you can go. Unless you are too drunk to walk......
 
The police can bail for 28 days and then charge. They had no body at this point so no chance of finding enough evidence to prosecute within 28 days. The alternative is the unending release, not cleared. They cannot however pursue a case of murder without a pathologists cause of death submitted to the CPS.
 
tresir2012 said:
Now it is confusing. I like to look at it like drink driving. Police can stop you if they suspect you of drink driving. They talk to you, smell alcohol on your breath or if they don't you confirm verbally you have been drinking. Then they breathalyse you. If the breathalyser indicates you are over the limit, that confirms the suspicion and they arrest you, etc etc. Back at the station, maybe you pass the next one so they don't charge you. They then release you. If you fail the second one too they will charge you and take blood or urine for prosecuting. Once they have charged you can go. Unless you are too drunk to walk......
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Yes you can go- but one of two ways- case closed (not enough evidence), under investigation (indefinitely we will find something about you, unless the CPS tells us we don’t have enough evidence)
 
Ruthbullock said:
He remained under investigation for the first offence. - this is my point!
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So he’s still waiting to be charged with 1)abduction and 2) murder. Is that what you mean? The first arrest/ suspicion still stands and now the 2nd arrest/suspicion still stands as he’s still under investigation for both?
 
Cherwell said:
I don't think they could prove abduction, or they would have charged him.
They had camera evidence that Libby (presuming it is her) got into the car, but that is all, as far as we know.
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Totally agree .. you cant charge someone just because someone got in there car and ended up deceased ...no matter how sure we might be he is the culprit
I really do not think there is anything cryptic about this case its imo been purely and simply about not having enough evidence to charge ..I think they have been working tirelessly to try and gather enough circumstantial evidence to convince the CPS.. hopefully they will be able to eventually charge the right person for the right crime
 
I just came across this on YouTube in case anyone's interested. I think it starts near Chapman Street bridge, which is a long way south of Oak Road, but it gave me a better idea of the river.

It also made me cry when I thought of it being part of poor Libby's final journey :(
 
Im very rarely the voice of reason but... let's all have a day of reflection and consolidation?
Take a Day out from posting and revisit the thread from , say, thread 5?

Even after doing this , we must understand that there is knowledge and information that is not widely known. There are widely differing strata of knowledge even within this small community.

Re: Kayak

Sigh. Have you not read the byelaws regarding private traffic on the East Yorkshire drainage channels, you silly Twit, jitty?

Eta..substituted Twit for
 
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