GUILTY UK - Mikaeel Kular, 3, Edinburgh, Scotland, 15 Jan 2014 - #2

[sar2them1984]

What is a significant case review?
Significant case reviews take place after a child dies or is seriously injured and abuse or neglect is known or suspected.

The purpose is to help agencies learn lessons about how better to protect children and young people from serious abuse.

They are the equivalent of serious case reviews in England, case management reviews in Northern Ireland and multi-agency child practice reviews in Cymru/Wales.

From http://www.nspcc.org.uk/Inform/resourcesforprofessionals/scrs/scotland_wda87552.html

So the same thing, just a different name for some reason

Just as a point of information and a little o/t Serious Case Reviews are also carried out for vulnerable adults who have come to serious harm or death by abuse or neglect.

Many people do not know this amd assume the SCRs only apply to children

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

 

[Ellmau]

BTW: there's loads of useful info on how the legal system works in Scotland here:

http://www.copfs.gov.uk/

 

[sar2them1984]

BTW: there's loads of useful info on how the legal system works in Scotland here:

http://www.copfs.gov.uk/

You beat me to it

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

 

[zwiebel]

They don't actually have coroners in Scotland; their role is taken by the Procurator Fiscal. If it's the way it is in England, there may never be an inquest if it is superseded by a murder or manslaughter trial. (NB the inquest is different from the post mortem, it's the legal hearing at which the cause of death is determined.)

Oh, and it says on wiki they have the role of a prosecutor, just about? And there is something about a Sheriff there too.

Procurator fiscal - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

 

[Atoz]

It's so difficult to know what the truth will be here. It could go off at so many tangents, especially taking into consideration the circles she may have been moving in.

Also, with that in mind, it is a real possibility that the truth will never be established.

I really hope that the other kids get shielded and loved as much as possible through this awful time. Which, going back to what you said Zwiebel, the media could do them a massive favour in backing the hell away from the family that are caring for them. There is nothing the media can do anymore, apart from sell more papers. Let's hope they give some respect.

 

[MsFacetious]

I've worked in mental health for a number of years. I in no way want to attempt to diagnose Rosie as I don't believe you can do so without meeting the individual and their family/friends nor without knowing their background and so on.

As all we have is her sm profiles it would be impossible to! She does come across as narcissistic perhaps, but would that really have any impact on her functioning as a parent? I doubt it

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

I definitely can see narcissism having an impact on parenting.
When someone thinks the world revolves around them, that's a problem for the children who depend on them.
I know a couple of narcissistic parents and it's amazing how little they focus on the kids.
If not for other family members, they would be seriously neglected. :twocents:

 

[skibaboo]

I don't think 'respect' is in the British medias dictionary, specifically the tabloids . JMO

 

[sar2them1984]

I definitely can see narcissism having an impact on parenting.
When someone thinks the world revolves around them, that's a problem for the children who depend on them.
I know a couple of narcissistic parents and it's amazing how little they focus on the kids.
If not for other family members, they would be seriously neglected. :twocents:

Fair point. I guess it would depend on how narcissistic they were but I can see your point totally

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

 

[Bluey]

It's so difficult to know what the truth will be here. It could go off at so many tangents, especially taking into consideration the circles she may have been moving in.

Also, with that in mind, it is a real possibility that the truth will never be established.

I really hope that the other kids get shielded and loved as much as possible through this awful time. Which, going back to what you said Zwiebel, the media could do them a massive favour in backing the hell away from the family that are caring for them. There is nothing the media can do anymore, apart from sell more papers. Let's hope they give some respect.

I agree - was just discussing with the OH how a criminal trial isn't an exercise in revealing the truth of a matter. Very frustrating how some questions just remain unanswered forever.

Also strongly agree that what is left of this family need leaving the heck alone by the media. I'm not impressed by them posting pictures of the Aunt, who has not been charged with anything, but is bereaved and caring for the bereaved and now almost motherless children, as well having to face her own sister being charged in connection with this.

 

[sar2them1984]

I don't know about anyone else but I think the police involved should get a big "well done" for how they've handled this case. We've all recognised the tremendous efforts which volunteers and locals made in finding mikaeel but fair play to the police for their input and kudos for how they have handled a potentially emotionally volatile case. Credit where credits due. JMO

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

 

[sar2them1984]

I agree - was just discussing with the OH how a criminal trial isn't an exercise in revealing the truth of a matter. Very frustrating how some questions just remain unanswered forever.

Also strongly agree that what is left of this family need leaving the heck alone by the media. I'm not impressed by them posting pictures of the Aunt, who has not been charged with anything, but is bereaved and caring for the bereaved and now almost motherless children, as well having to face her own sister being charged in connection with this.

The sad truth is everthing and everyone are fair game in the world of tabloids. The family should not give them anything to run with. They'd soon get bored

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

 

[Atoz]

I don't know about anyone else but I think the police involved should get a big "well done" for how they've handled this case. We've all recognised the tremendous efforts which volunteers and locals made in finding mikaeel but fair play to the police for their input and kudos for how they have handled a potentially emotionally volatile case. Credit where credits due. JMO

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

Totally agree with this. The police have operated with utmost professionalism, treating all the family with the respect they deserve, while carrying out a thorough investigation and managing to keep the focus of the media and people on the matter at hand, not letting this spiral out into something that it probably never was.

There were so many delicate aspects to this case, and I cannot think of how they could have dealt with it more sensitively.

The sad truth is everthing and everyone are fair game in the world of tabloids. The family should not give them anything to run with. They'd soon get bored

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Tapatalk

I agree with you up until your last sentence...sadly. If they can find something that might sell papers, then I am not so sure they will get bored. Hopefully they will be respectful though.

 

[zwiebel]

I went off researching procurators and ended up at the Salem witch trials. That's not Scotland.

Think I'll have to wait until Monday, like everyone else.

The timeline needs firming up for this little man. It will tell a tale, I'm sure. I am relying on Edinburgh Law Enforcement to come up with goods. I have been irritated to heck over the past few days by them, but they have my utmost respect. They didn't tell me what they were doing, but it didn't matter because they have brought this little boy home so quickly.

From media/social media reports alone, there is a timeline falling into place and we could probably put together a more detailed one ourselves. I think that would be allowed, as long as we were careful and didn't claim it was set in stone?

 

[zwiebel]

For example, any more media reports anyone can think of with sightings by non-family after December 19th, when Mikaeela was last seen at school?

 

[Atoz]

I went off researching procurators and ended up at the Salem witch trials. That's not Scotland.

Think I'll have to wait until Monday, like everyone else.

The timeline needs firming up for this little man. It will tell a tale, I'm sure. I am relying on Edinburgh Law Enforcement to come up with goods. I have been irritated to heck over the past few days by them, but they have my utmost respect. They didn't tell me what they were doing, but it didn't matter because they have brought this little boy home so quickly.

From media/social media reports alone, there is a timeline falling into place and we could probably put together a more detailed one ourselves. I think that would be allowed, as long as we were careful and didn't claim it was set in stone?

If we're able to come together and provide a possible timeline of events, then I would be interested. But in all honesty, I think there's a lot that's totally unknown that will come out and change things completely. Perhaps not, maybe it's more straightforward than that.

 

[katydid23]

Sadly, I bet it will be up to the 9 yr old to enlighten LE about what really happened. :cry:

 

[Atoz]

Sadly, I bet it will be up to the 9 yr old to enlighten LE about what really happened. :cry:

What a really tragic reality that would be. But all too likely. The ripple effect of suffering from one event can sometimes seem endless.

This is off topic - But if one wants to open a thread about a missing person, can I just open a thread, or do I need to contact a moderator first? It's not a child, but an older lady, and there is not much info to go on, but I just thought people might be able to help. Any advice most welcome.

 

[katydid23]

What a really tragic reality that would be. But all too likely. The ripple effect of suffering from one event can sometimes seem endless.

This is off topic - But if one wants to open a thread about a missing person, can I just open a thread, or do I need to contact a moderator first? It's not a child, but an older lady, and there is not much info to go on, but I just thought people might be able to help. Any advice most welcome.

If I remember correctly, there needs to be a mainstream news article or an alert put out, before we can start a missing person thread. But I think you might want to send a PM to a mod to check.

 

[Atoz]

If I remember correctly, there needs to be a mainstream news article or an alert put out, before we can start a missing person thread. But I think you might want to send a PM to a mod to check.

Thanks for the reply. I know it's been reported in local news, but I doubt any more than that. Media tend not to take much notice unless it's a child. But then I guess the majority of adults who go missing, actually choose to so it's understandable.

I will contact a mod.

 

[mrsward]

A teenage witness says she saw the youngster, wearing a green jumper, playing inside his city home with his twin sister on Monday. Police have twice interviewed Shannon Cairns, 17, who lives with her parents directly opposite Mikaeel’s flat.

mirror.co.uk