Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #11

[tallmansix]

I'm not the only person on the thread pointing out that owners of large houses build structures in rivers. Some of these structures might not be all that obvious to a casual observer.


There are some areas where eddies form and also in holes you can get situations where the current flowing across may deposit objects into an area below where the water is stationary or moving in the opposite direction.

It isn't as simple as the whole lot is moving. Yes it is all going towards the sea but some objects especially submerged objects may be trapped in certain areas. Apparently this includes the deep holes where objects may be deposited and covered in more deposited material over time.

The theory being that if a body found its way into one of these deep hole areas it may become covered with other materials until a flood event flushes the whole lot out.

Agreed, I was responding to a comment that claimed the river couldn't move a body.

 

[Petrocelli]

I still can’t get my head around possible abduction. Which road would a car be close enough and unobserved by residents/random dog walkers at mid morning to drag a grown woman to it with excitable dog in tow?

Maybe they didn’t need a car.

I’ve been wondering if it was bright enough for sunglasses that day as a lot of her photos she’s wearing them . These would almost certainly have come off in the river.

Also wonder if any of the CCTV has sound recording from local area as may have picked up a scream or gunshot etc.

 

[JumpingFrog]

I still can’t get my head around possible abduction. Which road would a car be close enough and unobserved by residents/random dog walkers at mid morning to drag a grown woman to it with excitable dog in tow?

Meh idk but let's face it, if threatened with a weapon and told how to comply, then the Garstang road entrance could truly be the exist as well. Remember that Nicola's coat and gilet have hoods....and police want dash cam of that area. Basically tldr an abuction doesn't necessarily have to be with violence - the threat could suffice maybe. Jmo

 

[PS8800]

If anyone can research the incident of Elizabeth Rawcliffe falling into the river in 1926 it seems to be similar to the police working theory. It happened at "Fiddler's Neck", do we know where this is and if it is the same location? Maybe previous colloquial name? She was spotted and the person who waded in to help said it was deeper than expected. She disappeared under the water in front of the rescuer but she stuck an arm out and he managed to grab it.

Update - just seen that the Rowanwater site refers to accessing the "Fiddle Neck" in its site rules so could be the same place.

Fiddleneck is part of the river she walks . The creepy thing is thats written as a comment under one of Nicolas FB pics by some guy Prophetic?

 

[Enigmacode]

It's been mentioned previously, it's been searched and there are gates at the road entrance and a gate between the top field and the lodge site

Ok, thanks, noted.

 

[PS8800]

In June 1945 a young boy named Derek Roscoe Tyson drowned in the River Wyre at St Michael's which also appears to be the exact same location. The river was described as 8 feet deep and "treacherous" at that place with the river bed fluctuating in depth. Back then, the area was protected by "wire". That was in summer though and obviously conditions will change but still interesting info.

Source:BNA Home | Search the archive | British Newspaper Archive

So once upon a time that spot was secured. Interesting.
When I mentioned doing this I got jumped on, but it must have made sense to do so at one point.
Changes are often made after tragedies occur but its a shame this one wasnt made permanent.

 

[ginnyw]

Maybe they didn’t need a car.

I’ve been wondering if it was bright enough for sunglasses that day as a lot of her photos she’s wearing them . These would almost certainly have come off in the river.

Also wonder if any of the CCTV has sound recording from local area as may have picked up a scream or gunshot etc.

It was fairly early, around 9am on a dull cold winter morning so don't think sunglasses would have been necessary.

 

[martinwatts5]

I completely agree, I would be too. I'm not so sure I'd call the police immediately though.

It seems that there were plenty of dog walker witnesses around from 8:43 to 9:10.

But none from 9:33 to 11 am.

Then when PA arrived there were dog walkers around who helped him search.

Was the dog tied there for that time at all?
Or was it than just no one walked past in those 1.5 hrs?

It was stated earlier on this thread that 2 other witnesses spotted the phone as well.

 

[Lady Gwendoline]

My understanding from a previous WS thread is that the person who found the dog and tied it up was the elderly owner of campsite and she contacted her daughter in law (who also runs the campsite) as thought it belonged to a mother at the school that the daughter in law knew/knew of. FB shows her as a friend of NB. Presumably daughter in law did recognise whose dog is was and phoned school, sensible as it would have access to relevant contact details. Sounds like a sensible and plausible response to finding the dog.

Do we know what she tied the dog up with ? And where did she get it from ? Did she have it on her ? Did someone bring it to her ? Do we know anything about this ?

 

[msmarple99]

Reportedly in Hall Lane. Round the corner from Blackpool Lane, where the Church is located, so very close.

Thank you

 

[PS8800]

It was very cold on the morning that NB disappeared....I looked at a weather map for the area and it was about 1 degree, barely above freezing. I guess that if somebody fell in in, say, July, they might have had a better chance of surviving for longer in the water, or would not have been wearing heavy clothes either. It was such a very cold few days.

With the combination of the temp, clothing depth of the embankment, no walkers at the precise time- its like the perfect storm. A series of very unfortunate events. Sadly it is reality and happens more often than we would think.

 

[Furore]

In June 1945 a young boy named Derek Roscoe Tyson drowned in the River Wyre at St Michael's which also appears to be the exact same location. The river was described as 8 feet deep and "treacherous" at that place with the river bed fluctuating in depth. Back then, the area was protected by "wire". That was in summer though and obviously conditions will change but still interesting info.

Source:BNA Home | Search the archive | British Newspaper Archive

Some incredible sleuthing. Seems in past 100 years at least two other drownings in this stretch of river. Does make PF’s comments seem a bit silly.

 

[sundaaaay]

At the place NB disappeared the river is deep and wide - a lot of water will be flowing by volume but relatively slowly. At just 1mph (slow compared to walking speed of 3-4mph) the body would move 110 metres in just 10 minutes - well out of sight in the small window that this incident occurred in.

Very sensible response, ever since the contractor with the sonar checked the river and said she isn't in there, people have been quick to jump to all sorts of elaborate scenarios. Regarding the buoyancy you mention, I wonder what you think of her outfit that day making her more buoyant. NB is both small and slim and she is wearing a long quilted jacket (to her knees) which probably has a lot of air pockets which would take a while to saturate, so I wonder did the jacket help remove her from the scene within minutes of falling in.

 

[porkypies]

If the police's first thought was that NB had fallen in the river, why wouldn't the local woman who initially found the dog also think the same and ring emergency services immediately?

Because NB's partner, knowing her habits/behaviour had dialled 999 to alert the police to the fact that NB not being with the dog and phone was an emergency. Whereas the finder of the dog had no such insights or fears, may have checked the river, but could not possibly know that this was an emergency that needed a 999 call, and could have thought that the owner would soon turn up or be found.
The finder of the dog was perhaps not trained to think like the police and did not have the benefit of PA's insights at that point because no-one knew that NB was missing.

 

[Cuko]

Ok, but NB has keys, I don't understand what you're geting at

My error. I hadn’t caught up with the info about the key confirmation. Mea culpa.

 

[Lincoln34]

This is a very old case I’m linking to . It was huge news at the time - like this case- but does demonstrate that an abductee can be held for days . I’m not saying NB was abducted - just pointing out that she could be being held somewhere if she was . IMHO.

Stephanie Slater, estate agent kidnapped in 1992, dies aged 50 | UK news | The Guardian

 

[Lady Gwendoline]

I watched the documentary/interview on TV last night. I was surprised that no members of her own family were part of it.

What is the upside for him to do these interviews? What does this help achieve -(apart from continued visibility on Nicolas dissapearance.)how helpful it is? And how does it work w interviews on a case like this. Do th police have to approve him taking to press?

 

[Just-a-random-girl]

Found this aerial image of what appears to be the location in question in St Michael's from 1985. Probably won't help solve the case but it provides a good aerial view of the river (so you can see what's changed) and I found it interesting...

Source: https://ncap.org.uk/frame/17-1-4-17-32?=1

 

[markoid]

There is no more evidence that NB fell in the river than there is evidence that some unusual people were in the village that day.

I do hope that the police are correct in their assumptions that the focus on the river is correct.
If someone just wanted to murder NB they would do so and throw her to the river.

Does anyone feel that her being an IFA, a regulated business had anything to do with someone wanting to silence her.

Perhaps someone had breached a set of regulations and she was aware of this? it depends on what she shared about her work with her partner though, you would think that she may share any work concerns with him, unless of course she had just discovered something very recently.

For what purpose would abduction serve someone else?

Agree totally. Maybe get other agencies to help. TA?

But you can never say she’s not in the water.

Very sensible response, ever since the contractor with the sonar checked the river and said she isn't in there, people have been quick to jump to all sorts of elaborate scenarios. Regarding the buoyancy you mention, I wonder what you think of her outfit that day making her more buoyant. NB is both small and slim and she is wearing a long quilted jacket (to her knees) which probably has a lot of air pockets which would take a while to saturate, so I wonder did the jacket help remove her from the scene within minutes of falling in.

This. We know a body could move quickly in moving water. We also know that a body could get over the weir - hence LE searching past the weir. It’s entirely feasible that a body could have floated out of the immediate vicinity and subsequently missed by LE divers.

 

[onthecounter]

Really interesting and informative contributions from tallmansix, Mr X and just-a-random-girl on the river theory. MOO if an abduction, it would seem sophisticated. I wonder what sort of a character profile could be drawn for the sort of person who could do this?