Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire) #15

[tallmansix]

I apologize for this very basic question, but would appreciate any clarification a fellow WSer could provide:

Ron is apparently the fellow who found the phone, harness and leash on the bench at approx. 9:35 that morning, correct? But the same news reports have discussed a “10 minute window of time” between 9:10 (when she was seen in the upper field) and 9:20 (when her phone was returned to the bench).

What is that 9:20 location of her phone on the bench based on? Her phone’s GPS?

From what I can gather, LE hasn't released how they know this level of information, but some apps will store or record the GPS location.

Either way, LE hasn't given any specifics.

Despite what some people think about mobile phones tracking every movement and recording all the time, it just isn't that simple. They are capable of doing that, but depending on the apps in use and how the users has configured the phone, it could literally have no data.

I think LE are lucky to have the info they do, if I disappeared in the same circumstances, LE isn't getting any data from my phone due to the security/privacy precautions I take, however, I'm a tech professional, the average user would leave some data trail that may be useful.

 

[DaFroome]

Harness was on slope (link posted in early threads). She might have been trying to put it on and stumbled. She would have needed both hands so it makes sense imo that she put the phone down first.

Absolutely.

Can’t overlook the most logical.

NB has finished her walk, is sat on the bench, listening to her call.

Decided it’s time to go. Takes the harness to Willow on the bank, phone on speaker.

Stumbles, falls, possibly hits her head, and sadly slips in the water, and is swept away.

All in a matter of seconds.

Almost straight away the witness arrives, harness on the bank, phone on the bench, Willow present and anxious.

Would illustrate where we’re at, sadly.

No other theories match that likelihood, IMO.

Yet to be found.

 

[RichardKimble]

IMO it is curious that this missing person had virtually no coverage on media or on this forum but the NB case has got the prime minister talking.

Something odd going on here. Not sure what it is but this is being driven by something other than concern for the welfare of a missing person.

It's an odd one .

Just been reading more on it, police divers were involved earlier in the month, maybe a guy missing doesn't have the wow factor for the media.

 

[Lord Peter Flimsy]

I assume there are 4 possibilities

1) NB fell in the river either by accident or due to a medical episode or trying to help or retrieve something.
2) There is a 3rd party involvement in her disappearance. Kidnap or physical attack.
3) NB decided to take her own life either in the river or somewhere else.
4) NB decided to disappear either of own accord (including impaired mind) or with the assistance of others?

Are there any others? If not, which is most likely from the above?

 

[Haveyoufedthecat]

Would a fitbit still work if it's been underwater for several weeks?

I was under the impression that these devices perhaps "could" be submerged in water but not for a long length of time. Mind you I don't know whether that has ever been tested. I always got the impression with these so called waterproof devices that if you drop it in the bath or the loo not a disaster but obviously if you were to leave it in a full bath that may well be a different story.

 

[tallmansix]

It depends on the type of memory a FitBit uses. Flash memory, for example, doesn't require any power to hold the data. Over time the data will deteriorate in the absence of power, but the time it takes to deteriorate is usually months or years rather than weeks. If the FitBit is found and hasn't been damaged, it *should* still hold the data, IMO.

I checked my info from the official FitBit forums before I posted:

The Fitbit Community

Hi there , welcome to the Community Forums. I'm sorry for the late response. Thanks for the details provided and for taking the time to troubleshoot this situation. What happened to you is an expected behavior. You should have logged in to sync the tracker before you let your Versa ran out of...

community.fitbit.com

The Fitbit Community

My Fitbit battery died. When my Charge 5 came back on after charging for a while, the clock was wrong and all my data for today was lost. Anyone know why that happened? Also the data was lost on the Fitbit App on my phone too.

community.fitbit.com

Seems that the data is stored in volatile memory, but may depend on the exact model.

But I had a FitBit for a few years as well so personal experience confirms what the official FitBit rep is saying.

 

[Mr X]

Just been reading more on it, police divers were involved earlier in the month, maybe a guy missing doesn't have the wow factor for the media.

The PF didn't fancy it despite it being much closer to his base in Dorking.

 

[tallmansix]

I was under the impression that these devices perhaps "could" be submerged in water but not for a long length of time. Mind you I don't know whether that has ever been tested. I always got the impression with these so called waterproof devices that if you drop it in the bath or the loo not a disaster but obviously if you were to leave it in a full bath that may well be a different story.

Depends on the model which hasn't been confirmed, but I used to swim with a FitBit Versa for several hours and it was ok.

 

[Interested_But_Confused]

I checked my info from the official FitBit forums before I posted:

The Fitbit Community

Hi there , welcome to the Community Forums. I'm sorry for the late response. Thanks for the details provided and for taking the time to troubleshoot this situation. What happened to you is an expected behavior. You should have logged in to sync the tracker before you let your Versa ran out of...

community.fitbit.com

The Fitbit Community

My Fitbit battery died. When my Charge 5 came back on after charging for a while, the clock was wrong and all my data for today was lost. Anyone know why that happened? Also the data was lost on the Fitbit App on my phone too.

community.fitbit.com

Seems that the data is stored in volatile memory, but may depend on the exact model.

But I had a FitBit for a few years as well so personal experience confirms what the official FitBit rep is saying.

I'm *really* surprised by that. In this day and age, using volatile memory that loses data when power is removed is not at all what I'd expect. I can't argue with the evidence from Fitbit's own website, it just seems like a very strange design decision.

 

[Mr X]

I assume there are 4 possibilities

1) NB fell in the river either by accident or due to a medical episode or trying to help or retrieve something.
2) There is a 3rd party involvement in her disappearance. Kidnap or physical attack.
3) NB decided to take her own life either in the river or somewhere else.
4) NB decided to disappear either of own accord (including impaired mind) or with the assistance of others?

Are there any others? If not, which is most likely from the above?

There are more far fetched possibilities such as her being taken by a large cat and eaten. Or a crocodile.

I did wonder if there had ever been large cat sightings in the area. They do turn up from time to time in some places.

I think if it had been a cat the dog would have also been taken but as has been mentioned it is possible that the dog was "not on the lead" and was quite a long way away when the disappearance occurred so may be unaware of what actually happened.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

IMO it is curious that this missing person had virtually no coverage on media or on this forum but the NB case has got the prime minister talking.

Something odd going on here. Not sure what it is but this is being driven by something other than concern for the welfare of a missing person.

It's an odd one .

Perhaps not equal attention, but Nathan Cole does have a thread on WS: Found Deceased - UK - Nathan Cole, 32, frm Notting Hill, W London, said going to gig in Camden, but last seen 10.46pm on 158 bus Black Horse Road, E17, 21 Jan 2023

 

[Agatha3]

IMO it is curious that this missing person had virtually no coverage on media or on this forum but the NB case has got the prime minister talking.

Something odd going on here. Not sure what it is but this is being driven by something other than concern for the welfare of a missing person.

It's an odd one .

Well Nicola friend Emma White knew Dan Walker and Emma’s father was a much respected BBC presenter, known and liked on Look East by those of us who called him Uncle Stewart.(White).
If you had a link to the media when a relative was missing, you might want to use those links to publicise and help find them.

 

[mrblack]

IMO it is curious that this missing person had virtually no coverage on media or on this forum but the NB case has got the prime minister talking.

Something odd going on here. Not sure what it is but this is being driven by something other than concern for the welfare of a missing person.

It's an odd one .

No conspiracy, the media are more interested when a female vanishes, particularly is strange circumstances. It sells papers.

There are hundreds of people going missing every day. The press couldn't possibly cover all of them. The police don't even release details of the majority because they are quickly found without issue.

A huge amount are kids in units. Some are adults that are feeling suicidal, most are traced and given support but some complete suicide. Very few are people wanting to go off and start a new life without telling anyone.

 

[Haveyoufedthecat]

Just thinking through about that Welfare Check and apologise if admin don't allow this post. I don't know how near their house was to others but could it be that a neighbour heard a row and lets say that row escalated to the point where a neighbour (knowing there were children in the house) thought "I think I had better ring someone i.e. the Police as there are young children in the house. I have read that medical professionals attended as well. Could it be that the Police arrived and realised that someone needed some medical input as well and called them in. Only my opinion.

 

[Marie Bell]

From what I can gather, LE hasn't released how they know this level of information, but some apps will store or record the GPS location.

Either way, LE hasn't given any specifics.

Despite what some people think about mobile phones tracking every movement and recording all the time, it just isn't that simple. They are capable of doing that, but depending on the apps in use and how the users has configured the phone, it could literally have no data.

I think LE are lucky to have the info they do, if I disappeared in the same circumstances, LE isn't getting any data from my phone due to the security/privacy precautions I take, however, I'm a tech professional, the average user would leave some data trail that may be useful.

Checking the in-built motion sensors in your phone might be easier than you imagine (especially if done by a specialist police investigating technician). Here's an article giving a basic explanation as to how and why all smart phones have these things.

The investigators were able to determine when the phone moved, and in which direction, and when it was set down and remained still until someone picked it up again. Not really an invasion of your privacy unless you'd set it down at the premises you were burgling, and forgot to pick it back up again.

Mobile sensors: The Components that make our smartphones smarter

DynaTAC 8000x launched in 1983, was the first commercially available smartphone in the world from Motorola. At that time no one can even…

medium.com

 

[tallmansix]

I'm *really* surprised by that. In this day and age, using volatile memory that loses data when power is removed is not at all what I'd expect. I can't argue with the evidence from Fitbit's own website, it just seems like a very strange design decision.

Not really, should be syncing regularly when in the vicinity of the phone.

But this is one of the downsides of a FitBit that made me move to Apple Watch. If the Fitbit app is closed on the phone it won't sync. If the app is running in the background, it will sync regularly, provided the user settings allow background apps to run - so can't say for certain.

In fact, the Fitbit is really funny about syncing and I had so many issues with it that I decided to stop using it, lost loads of workouts - but the volatile memory issue isn't a design flaw with a typical 7 days battery life, just the poor app and guidance for users being the weakness.

 

[tallmansix]

Checking the in-built motion sensors in your phone might be easier than you imagine (especially if done by a specialist police investigating technician). Here's an article giving a basic explanation as to how and why all smart phones have these things.

The investigators were able to determine when the phone moved, and in which direction, and when it was set down and remained still until someone picked it up again. Not really an invasion of your privacy unless you'd set it down at the premises you were burgling, and forgot to pick it back up again.

Mobile sensors: The Components that make our smartphones smarter

DynaTAC 8000x launched in 1983, was the first commercially available smartphone in the world from Motorola. At that time no one can even…

medium.com

"Checking the in-built motion sensors"

The sensors don't store any information whatsoever.

The article assumes full access to the phone - ie passcode/password. Without that, the information is encrypted and inaccessible.

It seems that either because the phone was found unlocked or somebody such as PA knew the passcode/password then there has been the ability to retrieve information, but in the absence of that, there is no way to access the data.

Some high-profile examples of this where even Apple couldn't (or wouldn't) access the encrypted data on iPhones despite FBI requests.

Apple–FBI encryption dispute - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[Agatha3]

No conspiracy, the media are more interested when a female vanishes, particularly is strange circumstances. It sells papers.

There are hundreds of people going missing every day. The press couldn't possibly cover all of them. The police don't even release details of the majority because they are quickly found without issue.

A huge amount are kids in units. Some are adults that are feeling suicidal, most are traced and given support but some complete suicide. Very few are people wanting to go off and start a new life without telling anyone.

Corrie McKeague who went missing in East Anglia had huge coverage of course. His mum was a police liaison officer so she helped publicise. And Nicola friend Emma White had media links which would also help.

 

[ayrshireguy]

Corrie McKeague who went missing in East Anglia had huge coverage of course. His mum was a police liaison officer so she helped publicise. And Nicola friend Emma White had media links which would also help.

Yep. It's not because NB is a woman. It's the bizarre nature of the case that is drawing and keeping the attention.

And as you said helped by the friends with media links

 

[Mr X]

I find it odd that someone working in financial services would only have one mobile phone. Presumably it has two SIMs in it.