Found Deceased UK - Nicola Bulley Last Seen Walking Dog Near River - St Michaels on Wyre (Lancashire), Jan 2023 #19

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Rusty Braincells said:
This also says that Nicola’s sister called the mental health crisis team over her health including some increased alcohol use, and the services visited to find her intoxicated, so any idea that the alcohol problem story may have emanated from only one source and that source is not reliable, can probably be put to rest. To emphasise I am not saying being intoxicated at home on one occasion means a problem but it seems from the sister’s call and evidence it had gone beyond that and not judging Nicola or anyone else in the slightest in any way, being a recovering alcoholic myself.
Click to expand...
This is purely my opinion having been under a NHS crisis team multiple times in the past. They are not there for your average mental health issues, they're typically dealing with people who are acutely psychotic, severely self harming or very suicidal/have recently attempted. It's the last layer before you are sectioned or advised you'd be best in hospital. For them to attend so quickly with the Police and a Paramedic I find a bit strange for an apparent vague call about alcohol usage and non-specific concerns about being suicidal - That is not the typical response. Not sure what to make of that if I'm honest.
 
12:17PM

Family - Nikki likely died from single gasp of water​

Ms Bulley’s family say it is their view, based on the evidence, that Ms Bulley likely died from a single gasp of water after falling in the River Wyre.
They also highlight another point heard in police digital forensic evidence to her inquest that Ms Bulley increased the volume on her mobile conference call at 9.18am.
Their legal team say in their closing statement: “We say the evidence completely supports accidental death - she was emailing a colleague about a mortgage at 8.53am, receiving messages about a spa day, sending a text message about a play date.
“She received the zoom call in a field which it was clear was busy with dog walkers, many of whom had seen her walking that day. It is clear from the evidence that at 9.18am Nikki increased the volume on that phone and in some way what happened after 9.18am must have been linked to the dog harness found on the steep riverbank between then and 9.30am.
“You have the clear evidence that Willow was Nikki’s third child, you also know Nikki had her car keys in her pocket, so the evidence from Prof Tipton and Dr Morgan, as well as PC Thackray the police diver, of the impact of cold water shock.
“The evidence given to you on the balance of probability is that Nikki likely, when one looks at the layout of the ground, would have gone under the water and as a result that first gasp would have been the lethal dose.”
12:15PM Telegraph)
 
12:15PM

Family - Evidence allays social media rumours​

The Bulley family have also condemned TikTok and social media sleuths and conspiracists, who dominated the three-week search for the 45-year-old.
In their closing statement, their legal team tell the coroner: “There has been much rumour and suspicion and speculation in relation to Nikki’s death particularly bearing in mind the time taken to found the body.. but the family are very clear of the view that that rumour and suspicion is allayed completely when one looks at all the evidence.
“Particularly Fitbit data shows she stopped between 9.15am and 9.30am. So the family are clear that Nikki’s death would have taken place very shortly after she entered the water and are comforted that it would have taken place in a matter of seconds, certainly less than 30 seconds.”
12:09PM Telegraph
 
12:09PM

Family - Screams have 'no relevance' to Nikki's death​

The Bulley family have also asked in their closing statement for coroner Dr James Adeley to dismiss evidence from two eyewitnesses who told the court they heard screams near a graveyard at around the time Ms Bulley went missing.
Their legal team say: “The family submission to you is plainly ... the timing and location of those screams in conjunction with the other evidence, you can dismiss those screams as irrelevant and would like you to make a finding of fact that those screams do not have relevance to her death.”
Telegraph
 
12:07PM

Family ask coroner to record accidental death​

Lawyers representing Ms Bulley’s family have asked the coroner to record a verdict of accidental death during a closing statement to the inquest.
They told the court: “We make a submission of accidental death, informed by the eyewitness evidence, the pathological evidence, the toxicical evidence, the phone interrogation and evidence, the assistance you can have from the Fitbit data.
“Also, and significantly sir, the expert evidence you have received and in particular the evidence yesterday from Prof Tipton and Dr Morgan.
“Very likely at 9.30am, Nicola Bulley died on the balance of probability in the river from accidental death.”
Telegraph source
 
12:03PM

'We couldn't ask for any more from her': Evidence concludes with father's tribute​

Ms Bulley’s father Ernest pays tribute to his daughter to conclude the final evidence session of the two-day inquest.
Ernest Bulley says: “As a child she was lovely, a little ballerina she always danced around, she was great. As a teenager, she wasn’t any trouble, she was at the college trying to become a make up artist which she studied at college, she was good as a daughter. She met a boyfriend in the college then moved up to Lancashire.
“She was a great daughter, sister and mother - we couldn’t ask for any more from her.”
 
11:59AM

Father - Last words were about 'closing deal'​

Ms Bulley’s father Ernest reveals the last words Ms Bulley said to him and the final hug they shared before she vanished.
Describing the night before Ms Bulley went missing, she said: “She did say because she had this important meeting whether we could stay later, until after 7pm, which we said was fine no problem.
“Nicola came back into the kitchen as the evening went on, from the work station, just after 7pm and we asked if all ok - she said: “It was a great day, went really well, I think I’m going to close this deal off.”
“She put so much into it after those exams, it wasn’t easy to combine together with her family, but we knew she could do it. We said ‘right we’re going to shoot off now’, she was messing around with something in the kitchen, we moved towards the front door, Nicola joined us.
“She was full of it, she was really happy and she appreciated that we stayed a bit later so she could do what she had to do. As Dorothy said, we gave her a kiss and hug. It was just another lovely evening.”
 
11:48AM

Ms Bulley's parents give evidence​

Mr Ansell confirms Ms Bulley had resumed taking HRT for the menopause and stopped drinking when she went missing.
He concludes his evidence by saying: “Anyone that saw her would not have thought anything happened... If you didn’t know Nikki, anybody who met her would still have loved her.”
Nicola Bulley’s family solicitor has asked the coroner if her parents Ernest and Dot can give evidence too -- they were not listed to do so.
The request has been accepted with the couple visibly emotional.
 
MollyHarps said:
<modsnip: personalizing>

It seems to me from the EVIDENCE which was provided yesterday that Nicola sadly passed away in a tragic accident.

I hope it brings some comfort to the family (especially the daughters in future years) that IMO it appears that this was a complete tragic accident rather than Nicola intentionally completing suicide.
Click to expand...
<modsnip: quoted post was snipped>
Please feel free to come back on any of these specific aspects that came out of yesterday's evidence.
1 A witness puts another female in the field at 9.15.The other female says they got there at 9.30.Which one is lying on oath and why
2 Another witness references a man dressed in black being in the vicinity of Nicola around this time. Has he been found and eliminated
3 The Police view is she entered the water around 9.22.At that time one person left at 9.18,another person may have been there depending on point and another unidentified person was reported as being there. So why was nothing seen or heard
4 The Hypothesis comes from an increased heart rate at 9.22.This could also be explained by an altercation with someone still present. I would also ask why the time her heart beat stopped recording hasn't been released as this is key evidence and will be known
5 if we accept 9.22 as her time of entering the water, why is fitbit recording steps for a further 8 minutes which is ample time to exit the water and/or scream for assistance
6 Two separate people heard screams around 9.35,have these been investigated or are we to believe these respected people are also lying

Aside from the evidence heard two other key aspects exist. The first is why was Willow dry, every owner of a springer I've talked to says their dog would enter the water if their mum was struggling. The second is why was the body not found for 23 days despite the most extensive search of water in our history.
Both of these can be explained if an altercation took place.
<modsnip> All I would say is if this was a loved one of mine there are questions I'd like answers to before accepting the decision.
RIP Nicola and may your family get the findings they want even if some of us disagree with it
 
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Blondiexoxo said:
www.lancs.live

Nicola Bulley inquest latest updates as two day hearing continues

A two day inquest into the death of Nicola Bulley begins on Monday. Our reporter will be in court providing updates on proceedings as it happens.
www.lancs.live www.lancs.live

From todays hearing, bruises were found to the front and back of Nicolas arm. Could this have been atall suggestive of someone grabbing and pushing her? When her iPhone was set down at 9.18am, her heart rate peaked at 9.22am - which I would assume could have been due to the initial shock of her entering the water. Could it be possible that could mean it leaves roughly 4 minutes in between putting her phone on the bench and Nicola entering the water? What could have been happening in those 4 minutes? I suppose we will never know but IMO that could have given enough time for a brief confrontation and a push that maybe sent her into the freezing cold river.

This is all JMO, now we wait to see what tomorrow brings. I’m not hopeful we will ever find out exactly how Nicola died that day. I just feel for her family, husband and daughters having to deal with this playing out in the public eye whilst they grieve the loss of Nicola. MOO
Click to expand...

I don't recall seeing anything about the depth of the water from the inquest so far, but I recall at the time seeing records of it being about two foot on the river monitoring which at the time I thought seemed to shallow to drown in.

However based on what we are hearing now I think that bruises on her arm - and yesterday on that Independent link I'm pretty sure I read of similar on her leg/knee (can't find it on there now) - would be suggestive to me of possibly hitting them on the river bed while thrashing around in the water before succumbing to it.
 
WAWAW said:
<modsnip>
Please feel free to come back on any of these specific aspects that came out of yesterday's evidence.
1 A witness puts another female in the field at 9.15.The other female says they got there at 9.30.Which one is lying on oath and why
2 Another witness references a man dressed in black being in the vicinity of Nicola around this time. Has he been found and eliminated
3 The Police view is she entered the water around 9.22.At that time one person left at 9.18,another person may have been there depending on point and another unidentified person was reported as being there. So why was nothing seen or heard
4 The Hypothesis comes from an increased heart rate at 9.22.This could also be explained by an altercation with someone still present. I would also ask why the time her heart beat stopped recording hasn't been released as this is key evidence and will be known
5 if we accept 9.22 as her time of entering the water, why is fitbit recording steps for a further 8 minutes which is ample time to exit the water and/or scream for assistance
6 Two separate people heard screams around 9.35,have these been investigated or are we to believe these respected people are also lying

Aside from the evidence heard two other key aspects exist. The first is why was Willow dry, every owner of a springer I've talked to says their dog would enter the water if their mum was struggling. The second is why was the body not found for 23 days despite the most extensive search of water in our history.
Both of these can be explained if an altercation took place.
<modsnip> All I would say is if this was a loved one of mine there are questions I'd like answers to before accepting the decision.
RIP Nicola and may your family get the findings they want even if some of us disagree with it
Click to expand...

With respect you did post earlier that the man in black interacted with Nicola and were asked to substantiate this, but as far as I can see you haven't done that. Do you have a link or was it a mistake?
 
Last edited by a moderator:
WAWAW said:
<modsnip>
Please feel free to come back on any of these specific aspects that came out of yesterday's evidence.
1 A witness puts another female in the field at 9.15.The other female says they got there at 9.30.Which one is lying on oath and why
2 Another witness references a man dressed in black being in the vicinity of Nicola around this time. Has he been found and eliminated
3 The Police view is she entered the water around 9.22.At that time one person left at 9.18,another person may have been there depending on point and another unidentified person was reported as being there. So why was nothing seen or heard
4 The Hypothesis comes from an increased heart rate at 9.22.This could also be explained by an altercation with someone still present. I would also ask why the time her heart beat stopped recording hasn't been released as this is key evidence and will be known
5 if we accept 9.22 as her time of entering the water, why is fitbit recording steps for a further 8 minutes which is ample time to exit the water and/or scream for assistance
6 Two separate people heard screams around 9.35,have these been investigated or are we to believe these respected people are also lying

Aside from the evidence heard two other key aspects exist. The first is why was Willow dry, every owner of a springer I've talked to says their dog would enter the water if their mum was struggling. The second is why was the body not found for 23 days despite the most extensive search of water in our history.
Both of these can be explained if an altercation took place.
<modsnip> All I would say is if this was a loved one of mine there are questions I'd like answers to before accepting the decision.
RIP Nicola and may your family get the findings they want even if some of us disagree with it
Click to expand...
BBM - Presumably, yes. And cleared of any involvement which is why the police have not pursed it further. The single witness who reported seeing that man said themselves they "looked like they were waiting for a lift." That is probably exactly what they were doing, if they even existed at all. No witness has claimed to see anyone suspicious interacting with Nikki at any point. Drowning is quick, and often silent.

The rest of your points have mostly been explained during the inquest, you are just interpreting those answers differently - which is your right to do. Except for the one about springers. I know plenty who do not choose to enter water. From history, it seems Willow did not routinely enter water so that is consistent with this individual dog.

The fact remains that the victims family do believe this to be a tragic accident and do not feel any additional questions need answering in order to accept the decision. In fact, their barrister has specifically asked for the coroner to record a verdict of accidental death.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
infinit said:
This is purely my opinion having been under a NHS crisis team multiple times in the past. They are not there for your average mental health issues, they're typically dealing with people who are acutely psychotic, severely self harming or very suicidal/have recently attempted. It's the last layer before you are sectioned or advised you'd be best in hospital. For them to attend so quickly with the Police and a Paramedic I find a bit strange for an apparent vague call about alcohol usage and non-specific concerns about being suicidal - That is not the typical response. Not sure what to make of that if I'm honest.
Click to expand...
Describing the encounter as "brief", Dr Leevy said in a review of the service provided to the Bulley family, it was found she had been in receipt of the crisis service even though she "did not wholly meet the criteria".

www.bbc.com

Nicola Bulley was looking forward to future, says partner

The mother-of-two had a "blip" over Christmas but was back to herself in January, an inquest hears.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
Grouse said:
With respect you did post earlier that the man in black interacted with Nicola and were asked to substantiate this, but as far as I can see you haven't done that. Do you have a link or was it a mistake?
Click to expand...
You are correct, I'd misinterpreted something reported and future posts have referred to him being in the vicinity between 9.10 and 9.20.My points are still valid and open to challenge though
 
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