VERDICT WATCH UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, Faces 22 Charges - 7 Murder/15 Attempted Murder of Babies #29

[katydid23]

And yes, life still happens, and in a 9 month time period it would be unusual if none of the jury had "stuff" happen.

Tooth Aches, food poisoning, stomach flu, sick child, etc etc----<<<these things happen no matter whet else we are supposed to be doing.

 

[katydid23]

We do have that option in the States. The defendant can choose to have the judge decide, instead of bringing in a jury. It's called a Beach Trial:

Bench trial - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

*Bench Trial----not beach trial

 

[Observe_dont_Absorb]

Most of the examples above, could be dealt with by the judge in our jury system.
If the group feels that one of the other jurors is disruptive, insincere, not taking it seriously, has a prior agenda, not listening, etc etc, they can send a note to the judge and it will be discussed. It is up to judges discretion to have them sent home. I've seen it happen before.

This is good to know! I always imagine being on a jury is as random as being plucked from thin air together with the people sitting on the same tube carriage at any given time... and *that* could be my idea of a living hell...

 

[Kittybunny]

It won't interfere with the competition because it's based on hours spent in deliberation. It'll just pick up where we left off, when they restart deliberations.

Aaaand this is why the ever-brilliant Tortoise insisted on total deliberation time, rather than date/time!

Oh and for the record, if I win, I'm ordering myself a pizza, so there!

I've been so busy with work I've barely had time to check in. I figured the verdict might've come in and I missed it but the way this case has been going, I should've known it would not be that easy!

 

[katydid23]

This is good to know! I always imagine being on a jury is as random as being plucked from thin air together with the people sitting on the same tube carriage at any given time... and *that* could be my idea of a living hell...

At the very very beginning, it is as random as you describe---like being chosen from all the people sitting in the same tube carriage. [ I think they are actually randomly chosen from lists of drivers licenses and state ID cards. ]

But then each of those randoms are sent a certified letter to their home address. And the ones that respond are given a date and time to travel to the courthouse. And then they are each questioned by both defense and prosecution, and even the judge. They are asked pertinent questions about how much they might know about the case, make sure they don't know anyone involved. Make sure they don't have preconceived notions about the subject of the case----etc etc

Then each side gets to 'vote out' three potential jurors. The judge then puts the remaining people in a pool of potential jurors, and 16 or so will be chosen randomly, to sit on the jury panel. Only twelve will be chosen on the day deliberations starts--the others were extras in case of illness, etc.

 

[marynnu]

*Bench Trial----not beach trial

I was liking the idea of a beach trial, echoes of Baywatch.

 

[Tortoise]

Aaaand this is why the ever-brilliant Tortoise insisted on total deliberation time, rather than date/time!

Oh and for the record, if I win, I'm ordering myself a pizza, so there!

I've been so busy with work I've barely had time to check in. I figured the verdict might've come in and I missed it but the way this case has been going, I should've known it would not be that easy!

Haha I had actually written a post way back to the people in the shredder, saying it was based on deliberation time in case jurors were off sick or Mr Johnson had to take his team to a Salsa class, but I deleted it because I didn't want to jinx the deliberations!

Bringing the remaining contestants forward from last thread -

Length of Deliberations Predictions

Mon 10th - day 1 (afternoon only) - 2pm to 4pm minus 5mins = 1h 55m
Tues 11th - day 2 - 4h 20m
Wed 12th - day 3 - 4h 20m
Thur 13th - day 4 - 4h 20m
Fri 14th - day 5 - 4h 20m

Running total = 19h 15m


Still in the game -

19h 30m - @MissMarbles
19h 45m - @ScotAng
20h - @Moll
21h 30m - @Kasmeer
22h 22m - @abovethestorm
23h 12m - @Dcflag
24h 10m - @Blondiexoxo
25h - @Sarahlou
28h - @squish
28h 28m - @DianaWW
30h 10m - @WaxLyrical
31h 30m - @Sweeper2000
32h 14m - @Kittybunny
34h - @bbsaz
35h 25m - @Dotta
41h 15m - @Observant-ADHD-ENFP-BSc
45h 10m - @esther43
58h - @Jw192
70h - @bobbymkii
75h - @CS2C
80h - @V347


--

 

[DinerMite]

Some random thoughts on Baby E/F, note they are just thoughts and not a structured narrative.

LL attended a debrief for Baby A (twin) on 30/07 and 2 days later she is designated E/F (twins) where she switches up the method to AE and assault (E) and insulin (F). I wonder if the debrief on Baby A influenced her method - maybe NEC was discussed for A hence causing blood via NG for E.

When you consider this new method and the close call of being interrupted mid act by the mother it is no wonder LL searched E/F countless times over the following months. That and asking the mother to speak up in court which seems like a power play imo.

All random meaningless thoughts.

 

[katydid23]

Some random thoughts on Baby E/F, note they are just thoughts and not a structured narrative.

LL attended a debrief for Baby A (twin) on 30/07 and 2 days later she is designated E/F (twins) where she switches up the method to AE and assault (E) and insulin (F). I wonder if the debrief on Baby A influenced her method - maybe NEC was discussed for A hence causing blood via NG for E.

Oh wow---very interesting thoughts. I had wondered why she allegedly switched it up at that particular time. It made sense she would do so at some point, but I wondered what the specific trigger was.

Having a debrief for the first incident could really have been a bit worrisome for her, if Guilty.

When you consider this new method and the close call of being interrupted mid act by the mother it is no wonder LL searched E/F countless times over the following months. That and asking the mother to speak up in court which seems like a power play imo.

I think her various comments about Baby E's mother are possibly going to hurt her with the jury. I think people will trust the mother's memory concerning her feeding schedule with her babies. And her shocking memories of the bloody mouth and cries and screams from Baby E.
It was weird that LL later testified that she and the mother were very close and got along well, considering their sworn testimonies were conflicting. That made no sense.

All random meaningless thoughts.

 

[Dotta]

Waiting for a verdict...

 

[Parker Knoll]

I binge watched the BBC drama “ The sixth commandment “ last night on the case of Ben Field and the murders of Peter Farquhar and Anne Moore-Martin, it was one of the first cases where the term “ gaslighting “ was used in court. The police had found Fields jumbled up diaries and notes that he had kept at his home.
All circumstantial evidence and the jury were out 19 days in that case.
I think we are in for a long wait on this one.

 

[crystalline]

We have to consider also...if one member of the Jury had the 'whoopsies' they need to give at least 48hrs after the last 'whoopsie' to ensure the others don't become ill. So yes I would Say Wednesday is a good time to say for sure. Not saying that was the case by the way.....just thinking/typing out loud really

 

[gc105]

Has it been confirmed that jury aren’t sitting due to illness related absence? I only ask as on all other occasions it’s been clarified, and also baffling that 2 jurors were absent yesterday.

I think I’m just worrying as really want to see this trial go over the line, it’s gone on so long and would be devastating for the families if it was to collapse at this stage. I hope I’m just being a panty wetter and worrying over nothing!

 

[crystalline]

Has it been confirmed that jury aren’t sitting due to illness related absence? I only ask as on all other occasions it’s been clarified, and also baffling that 2 jurors were absent yesterday.

I think I’m just worrying as really want to see this trial go over the line, it’s gone on so long and would be devastating for the families if it was to collapse at this stage. I hope I’m just being a panty wetter and worrying over nothing!

I don't think so...but I wouldn't worry, I feel JMO the Jury will be holding it together personally knowing how devastating this is, on the families and all concerned. I know I would want to bring it all to a close for those families so I feel they will too. Just little unavoidable hiccups along the way from the sounds of it, to be expected.

 

[Dotta]

I don't think so...but I wouldn't worry, I feel JMO the Jury will be holding it together personally knowing how devastating this is, on the families and all concerned. I know I would want to bring it all to a close for those families so I feel they will too. Just little unavoidable hiccups along the way from the sounds of it, to be expected.

Besides,
does anybody really think that the State will allow this case to collapse and put millions of pounds already spent on it into the mud?

Let's get real!

JMO

 

[marynnu]

panty wetter

I love that! Is this an Ametican expression or have I just led a very sheltered life? Thinking it's the equivalent of the British "getting your knickers in a twist'.

 

[Marantz4250b]

I love that! Is this an Ametican expression or have I just led a very sheltered life? Thinking it's the equivalent of the British "getting your knickers in a twist'.

I think "pant wetter" was used in Black Adder Goes Forth, if memory serves?

 

[gc105]

I love that! Is this an Ametican expression or have I just led a very sheltered life? Thinking it's the equivalent of the British "getting your knickers in a twist'.

I’m Scottish maybe native to us Scots haha!

 

[gc105]

Besides,
does anybody really think that the State will allow this case to collapse and put millions of pounds already spent on it into the mud?

Let's get real!

JMO

By collapse I mean the worry of a re-trial if juror issues.

As I say, hopefully I’m just worrying over nothing and we’re back tomorrow!

 

[JosieJo]

I binge watched the BBC drama “ The sixth commandment “ last night on the case of Ben Field and the murders of Peter Farquhar and Anne Moore-Martin, it was one of the first cases where the term “ gaslighting “ was used in court. The police had found Fields jumbled up diaries and notes that he had kept at his home.
All circumstantial evidence and the jury were out 19 days in that case.
I think we are in for a long wait on this one.

Just started watching 1st episode this morning seems a good watch