UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 7 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 6 hung re attempted #34

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I agree - it would be a total no show from her.
I had said upthread I didn’t think they would go ahead with a retrial but I just don’t know anymore. It’s a tricky one.
JMO

Edited to add - yes Dotta ! She would be taken to court and just sit in the holding cell and refuse to go up.
 
Marantz4250b said:
And once again I am reminded as to why I absolutely despise professional football! It's mostly a depressing embarrassment, quite honestly.
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As sick as it is, I guess it was inevitable.
Manchester United fans chant about Hillsborough and Liverpool fans still chant about Munich.
 
notsure said:
Yes, that tells us at least one colleague had noticed the pair openly flirting.
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Yes, but that's just one colleage in one series of txts, prior to the two of them actually hooking up in whatever way they hooked up. That's all we can know from the evidence presented in court. To assume they were blatant (per your original post to which I responded) and carrying on in front of everyone is pure speculation and hasn't any basis in fact since all the other txts were private ones between him and LL.

Anyway, all more than a bit moot at this very late stage of the game, don't you think? :)
 
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cottonweaver said:
related, in today's news MSN

'Nottingham maternity scandal victims have demanded police action against hospital leaders.

The families affected by the maternity care failings that led to the death and harm of hundreds of babies and mothers at Nottingham University Hospitals Trust (NUHT) have said they “expect action” to be taken against its former senior bosses.

The Nottingham Families Maternity Group met with the Nottinghamshire Police’s Chief Constable, Kate Meynell, to ask for a criminal investigation to be launched.

The hospital is currently undergoing an independent review led by Donna Ockenden, which began exactly one year ago today.

Ms Ockenden told The Telegraph that her team is now examining around 1,800 cases which is up from the 1,700 already planned and “will lead to an extension of the timeline” that will be confirmed as soon as possible. '
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update on that related news link above

www.bbc.co.uk

Nottingham maternity deaths: Police announce criminal inquiry

Police are to investigate deaths at a trust in Nottingham, already the subject of a major review.
www.bbc.co.uk
Announced tonight....
'Assistant Chief Constable, Rob Griffin, to oversee the preparations and the subsequent investigation."

announcement of this police investigation....
' follows an investigation by West Mercia Police, launched in June 2020, into maternity practices at the Shrewsbury and Telford NHS Trust.

'Having pushed for years for a truly independent review to reveal the scale of harm at the trust, families are now also looking for accountability.
This announcement raises the possibility that individuals could face criminal charges, or appear in court, but it will be a sensitive and complex investigation'
 
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squish said:
This was my impression too. She knew he fancied her and played him like a fiddle. I do not believe for one moment Dr Choc’s claims that she had an “unrequited affection” for him.

I do believe that Dr Choc set out to woo her, but he was thinking with his “little brain” and so LL was able to manipulate him rather than the other way round.

I don’t think she fancied him back, but I think as the investigation rumbled on, she leant on him more and more for care and support (and inside information) and may have eventually developed feelings for him.
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Yes, that's exactly what it was!
 
I don’t think she would turn up. I thought I could give her credit for turning up for the second round of verdicts but I didn’t know the first round only contained the insulin AM charges. im Sure if they had of included the first murder and G charge in the first round she wouldn’t have turned up for the second round. Absolutely sure of it.

pure speculation but looking at the different consequences of G charges on murder or attempted you might think she was hoping to hear NG on the murder charges, reason being if g on the am charges she gets the chance of parole. One single G verdict on the murder charges is an automatic life order. the defence team would have informed her of this.

eta. I think it would be an automatic life order due to the circumstances
 
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esther43 said:
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If they think they will probably get a conviction I think it’s a go. It’s such a high profile case especially now and unfortunately the degree of victims suffering in this which is staggering, I think would mean any likely conviction would be deemed in the public interest. It’s weird I’ve followed this for almost a year, the only thing that still impacts is the degree of suffering in this. It’s mind boggling.
 
squish said:
This was my impression too. She knew he fancied her and played him like a fiddle. I do not believe for one moment Dr Choc’s claims that she had an “unrequited affection” for him.

I do believe that Dr Choc set out to woo her, but he was thinking with his “little brain” and so LL was able to manipulate him rather than the other way round.

I don’t think she fancied him back, but I think as the investigation rumbled on, she leant on him more and more for care and support (and inside information) and may have eventually developed feelings for him.
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"little brain" :D
 
Anxala said:
Yes, but that's just one colleage in one series of txts, prior to the two of them actually hooking up in whatever way they hooked up. That's all we can know from the evidence presented in court. To assume they were blatant (per your original post to which I responded) and carrying on in front of everyone is pure speculation and hasn't any basis in fact since all the other txts were private ones between him and LL.

Anyway, all more than a bit moot at this very late stage of the game, don't you think? :)
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Oh absolutely! :)

I never intended to get into a long debate about it ;)
 
Sweeper2000 said:
If they think they will probably get a conviction I think it’s a go. It’s such a high profile case especially now and unfortunately the degree of victims suffering in this which is staggering, I think would mean any likely conviction would be deemed in the public interest. It’s weird I’ve followed this for almost a year, the only thing that still impacts is the degree of suffering in this. It’s mind boggling.
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If they do decide to go ahead with a retrial, I wonder if it would be held separately or together with the new cases potentially being brought?
 
Sweeper2000 said:
pure speculation but looking at the different consequences of G charges on murder or attempted you might think she was hoping to hear NG on the murder charges, reason being if g on the am charges she gets the chance of parole. One single G verdict on the murder charges is an automatic life order. the defence team would have informed her of this.

eta. I think it would be an automatic life order due to the circumstances
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This is not correct - assuming you are referring to a Whole Life Order.

The vast majority of murder convictions give a chance for parole.

Every single murder conviction results in the sole sentence mandated in law being handed down - that being "imprisonment for life". There is no option in that.

When you are sentenced to life in prison you are given a minimum term before you may apply for release on "licence" (parole). These minimum terms have starting points which range from fifteen years up to a whole life order and, again, are subject to statutory guidelines.

Every murderer who is out on parole is still, technically, "imprisoned for life" but has been granted a licence to live beyond the prison walls and can be recalled to prison for contravening the terms of his/her licence. This is the same for any prisoner on parole (licence) for any conviction.

A Whole Life Order is exceedingly rare; Lucy Letby is only the second woman to receive such a sentence from the convicting court (Joanne Dennehy was the first - they are reportedly now in the same prison) and I think the first to receive a whole life order for a non-murder offence as she was handed WLO's in respect of the attempted murder convictions.

I'm also not sure whether one single guilty verdict on any of the murder charges would have resulted in a WLO for her, tbh. Had that been the case I think the sentencing would have been quite a bit more convoluted especially, for instance if she had been acquitted of all, pr perhaps all bar one, of the AM charges.
 
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