UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #35

[Dotta]

I don't think it's quite the bombshell they are implying. In fact, the corrected timings work far better - unsurprisingly!
As for the other cases, I'm not sure the door swipe data (even if incorrect) is significant for any of them. There may be one or two, but my recollection is that there is no doubt LL was on the unit, certainly for the majority. Obviously the insulin cases are different anyway.
All JMO.

I disagree.
Mistakes in evidence are worrying -
generally speaking as in any case.
They cause mistrust.
I would never treat them in nonchalant way.

JMO

 

[marynnu]

I disagree.
Mistakes in evidence are worrying -
generally speaking as in any case.
They cause mistrust.
I would never treat them in nonchalant way.

JMO

I'm not being nonchalant. Obviously it's a really bad error. But in the wider scheme of things it changes absolutely nothing. If it did I'm sure Ben Myers would have been all over it.
We should actually be reassured rather than losing trust, in that it came to light and has been acknowledged.

 

[Dotta]

I'm not being nonchalant. Obviously it's a really bad error. But in the wider scheme of things it changes absolutely nothing. If it did I'm sure Ben Myers would have been all over it.
We should actually be reassured rather than losing trust, in that it came to light and has been acknowledged.

It is worrying it did not come to light during original trial.

 

[marynnu]

It is worrying it did not come to light during original trial.

True, it should have been spotted.

 

[Anxala]

I'm not being nonchalant. Obviously it's a really bad error. But in the wider scheme of things it changes absolutely nothing. If it did I'm sure Ben Myers would have been all over it.
We should actually be reassured rather than losing trust, in that it came to light and has been acknowledged.

As you say, it changes absolutely nothing.

It's interesting with all these new theories, speculations, occasions of error etc that no one has yet challenged the actual evidence against Lucy Letby herself. They all seem happy to continue to circle around if not actually completely avoid the elephant in the room that she and her own words, deeds and actions is. Instead, all we're getting continues to be concerns in a vacuum. It's, to say the absolute least, dishonest and irresponsible.

The media that are giving a platform to the miscarriage of justice narrative need to step up and follow through on the investigative job they claim they're there to do. Either paint the full picture or just stop with what is now imo borderline clickbait.

 

[Dotta]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1826001264452210948

Documentary covering trial of child serial killer Lucy Letby to air on Channel 4

Letby’s trial ran for 10 months from October 2022 to August 2023.

www.standard.co.uk

 

[katydid23]

I KNEW a documentary would hit the airwaves soon. And unfortunately, I think it will be misleading and distorted. Perfect clickbait if they can point out all the details pointing to hr being a victim here.

I hope I am wrong.

 

[Parker Knoll]

The door swipe data was addressed at the re trial and BM accepted it was an innocent mistake so absolutely nothing to see here.
Just wild headlines for click bait.

 

[Dotta]

The door swipe data was addressed at the re trial and BM accepted it was an innocent mistake so absolutely nothing to see here.
Just wild headlines for click bait.

But the fuel for LL's advocates.

Mistakes in evidence are not "nothing to see here."

They indicate chaos and are worrying IMO.
Just speaking generally.
Nobody wants to be accused by "mistakes in evidence", right?

JMO

 

[Tortoise]

The door swipe data was addressed at the re trial and BM accepted it was an innocent mistake so absolutely nothing to see here.
Just wild headlines for click bait.

I'm certain I read about this before this week, much closer in time to the retrial or the appeal, because I remember thinking it had been accepted by the defence as a non-issue. But I can't find what it was that I read.

 

[Parker Knoll]

It was during the re trial I’m sure (ish)
Will have a dig about.

 

[Parker Knoll]

I can’t find it anywhere either, I’m wondering if I am mistaken here and what I am remembering is the evidence given by Kate Tyndall on the 20/6/24 ?
I just remember something being accepted as a genuine mistake and the re trial cracked on.
These related to undated charts/readings for Baby K that could have been from the day previous or the day after the original “ agreed “ date.

 

[katydid23]

Where's CS2C? He might know about that 'new' info.

 

[Dotta]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1827670674250305799

 

[imstilla.grandma]

The letter reads: “As a collective group of nurses both registered and retired, we write this open letter to Prime Minister Keir Starmer to communicate our growing concerns regarding the evidence presented and used to convict Miss Letby.

“All of us are worried that this conviction is unsafe and as a result we and many of our colleagues are now terrified to continue working in the NHS as we believe that next time it could be one of us who is blamed for a failing system.

“We believe that flawed and unreliable scientific evidence was used to convict Ms Letby, and this is having a huge impact on the nursing profession.”

The nurses said they had a “duty of candour” to speak out about their concerns and have called for a forensic review or Royal commission and cross-party working group to be established to look into the case.

The nurses who signed the letter come from across Britain, but have chosen to remain anonymous for fear of reprisals from their trusts. They have shown their NMC registration numbers to The Telegraph to verify their positions

Lucy Letby’s conviction leaves nurses ‘terrified’ to continue working for NHS

Group urges Government to establish royal commission to conduct forensic examination of evidence presented in case

www.telegraph.co.uk

 

[imstilla.grandma]

 

[katydid23]

The letter reads: “As a collective group of nurses both registered and retired, we write this open letter to Prime Minister Keir Starmer to communicate our growing concerns regarding the evidence presented and used to convict Miss Letby.

“All of us are worried that this conviction is unsafe and as a result we and many of our colleagues are now terrified to continue working in the NHS as we believe that next time it could be one of us who is blamed for a failing system.

“We believe that flawed and unreliable scientific evidence was used to convict Ms Letby, and this is having a huge impact on the nursing profession.”

The nurses said they had a “duty of candour” to speak out about their concerns and have called for a forensic review or Royal commission and cross-party working group to be established to look into the case.

The nurses who signed the letter come from across Britain, but have chosen to remain anonymous for fear of reprisals from their trusts. They have shown their NMC registration numbers to The Telegraph to verify their positions

Lucy Letby’s conviction leaves nurses ‘terrified’ to continue working for NHS

Group urges Government to establish royal commission to conduct forensic examination of evidence presented in case

www.telegraph.co.uk

IMO, these nurses are grossly misinformed. They have no reason to feel 'unsafe' unless they plan to assault 25 newborns in their care, IMO. Those babies did not die accidentally or from a 'failing system.' They died at the hands of an emotionally unstable woman who was cunning enough to stay under the radar for two years.

 

[Marantz4250b]

IMO, these nurses are grossly misinformed. They have no reason to feel 'unsafe' unless they plan to assault 25 newborns in their care, IMO. Those babies did not die accidentally or from a 'failing system.' They died at the hands of an emotionally unstable woman who was cunning enough to stay under the radar for two years.

Agreed. I'd just seen the below link about this letter and came here to post it but I was beaten to it.

Lucy Letby conviction leaves nurses 'terrified' of working for the NHS

Lucy Letby's conviction for murdering babies has left a group of nurses feeling "terrified" that they could be wrongly blamed for a child's death.

www.lbc.co.uk

This is just getting silly now, quite frankly. She's guilty, she was always guilty and she'll remain guilty!

Once again, it's nit-picking individual points which are circumstantial rather than looking at the evidence as a whole - like the jury spent 10 months actually doing!!!

And, once again, they are ignoring all the other stuff like the 257 hand-over sheets she had for starters.

In fact, it's getting more than silly; the constant wailing for new trial, new appeals, new investigations, Royal Commissions and suchlike is insulting. They are insulting to the justice system (I mean you can hardly call it a half effort as it took what, five years from her first arrest to her conviction and another on top with the various appeals and re-trials).

I also feel that it is incredibly insulting to the jury who gave up knocking on for a year of their lives and who had to listen and wade through months and months of deeply disturbing evidence. These fools asking for new trials and appeals and suchike are essentially saying that at best they were hoodwinked by some grand conspiracy and were at worst incompetent or negligent.

 

[Tortoise]

A group of experts have asked the government to postpone or alter the public inquiry into the Lucy Letby case over concerns about the way evidence was presented to her trial.

[...]

The letter, which was quoted in The Guardian and confirmed by the BBC, said the group had concerns over the way statistics and the science around newborn babies were presented to the jury at Letby's first trial.

[...]

"Possible negligent deaths that were presumed to be murders could result in an incomplete investigation of the management response to the crisis," they added.

[...]

A spokesperson for the Thirlwall Inquiry told the BBC it would begin as planned on 10 September and would "follow the terms of reference set by the secretary of state".

Experts want inquiry delay over Letby evidence concerns - BBC News


(I'm not sure the term "experts", used in the same sentence as "evidence was presented to her trial", is at all correct. It should have said a group of uninformed medics, haha!) JMO

 

[Luwin]

A group of experts have asked the government to postpone or alter the public inquiry into the Lucy Letby case over concerns about the way evidence was presented to her trial.

[...]

The letter, which was quoted in The Guardian and confirmed by the BBC, said the group had concerns over the way statistics and the science around newborn babies were presented to the jury at Letby's first trial.

[...]

"Possible negligent deaths that were presumed to be murders could result in an incomplete investigation of the management response to the crisis," they added.

[...]

A spokesperson for the Thirlwall Inquiry told the BBC it would begin as planned on 10 September and would "follow the terms of reference set by the secretary of state".

Experts want inquiry delay over Letby evidence concerns - BBC News


(I'm not sure the term "experts", used in the same sentence as "evidence was presented to her trial", is at all correct. It should have said a group of uninformed medics, haha!) JMO

Searching for the eye-roll emoji for this!