GUILTY UK - Shana Grice, 19, murdered at her Brighton home, 25 Aug 2016

[Alyce]

One thing - amongst many - that interests and puzzles me re this case is that Lane is talked of as the jealous ex boyfriend and AC is considered to be the regular boyfriend.
But looking at the history, Lane had been the regular boyfriend from April 2016 onwards ( and had also had a relationship with Shana in 2015 ) and the relationship only ended ( apparently ) 2 days before Shana was killed.
At which point, AC became the current boyfriend again.

 

[xmsmadex]

One thing - amongst many - that interests and puzzles me re this case is that Lane is talked of as the jealous ex boyfriend and AC is considered to be the regular boyfriend.
But looking at the history, Lane had been the regular boyfriend from April 2016 onwards ( and had also had a relationship with Shana in 2015 ) and the relationship only ended ( apparently ) 2 days before Shana was killed.
At which point, AC became the current boyfriend again.

Did it really just end 2 days before? She had gone to the police about Lane a few times, did those incidents occur all in 2 days?

 

[Squamous]

Did it really just end 2 days before? She had gone to the police about Lane a few times, did those incidents occur all in 2 days?

I think she had them both on the go at that point?

I agree Alyce, I don't think drawing lines like serious boyfriend and ex boyfriend quite work in this case.

 

[Alyce]

Did it really just end 2 days before? She had gone to the police about Lane a few times, did those incidents occur all in 2 days?

I really was trying to say that msm are reporting the case as Shana having one long term boyfriend and one stalker - whereas it sounds to me more like she was switching between the 2 men and both had the status of regular boyfriend at some point.
There was info to say that Shana ended the relationship with Lane in July, but then she was back with him in August, staying at a hotel together.

 

[xmsmadex]

I really was trying to say that msm are reporting the case as Shana having one long term boyfriend and one stalker - whereas it sounds to me more like she was switching between the 2 men and both had the status of regular boyfriend at some point.
There was info to say that Shana ended the relationship with Lane in July, but then she was back with him in August, staying at a hotel together.

I see, thank you for explaining. I didnt realize she was so back and forth.

 

[Squamous]

She was both back and forth and simultaneous I think. Plus at least one extra man.

Just to be clear, I believe she had every right to lead a complex love life without having to worry about her personal safety. I do think it's a shame that the level of to-ing and fro-ing seems to have made it hard to build a strong case though.

 

[Alyce]

She was both back and forth and simultaneous I think. Plus at least one extra man.

Just to be clear, I believe she had every right to lead a complex love life without having to worry about her personal safety. I do think it's a shame that the level of to-ing and fro-ing seems to have made it hard to build a strong case though.

Exactly this.
She was young and single, she should have been having fun with whomever she chose to be with.
It is just, as you say, hard to build a case against one particular person with so many overlapping strands.

I hope the Court evidence is a lot clearer than the very small snippets we have heard.

 

[Tortoise]

With Shana making complaints to police as she did, while seeing Lane secretively, and secretly recording him to show police so that he would be arrested when he returned the key he'd taken, before allegedly letting him in through her window, and staying at a hotel with him, it begs the question - was she being pressured to make complaints?

The car tracking and house watching Lane was doing shows clearly obsessive behaviour, but infatuation and obsession doesn't necessarily mean intent to harm or kill, and the secret recording shows he appeared to accept what he did was wrong and didn't come across as possessive. I would like peace of mind that he wasn't an obsessive but harmless individual who was set up by another jealous character who may have discovered her secret liaisons were continuing. If she was being pressured to make complaints it could show another party was invested in him being collared by police.

Quite a bit of strange behaviour like throwing away t-shirts can have dual explanations. Buying the petrol was highly suspicious though in my opinion. But then so is the unidentified high-viz guy seen at 9:30, the fire with accelerant that merely smouldered on bedding for 2 hours, and AC's very timely raising of the alarm.

 

[Squamous]

Do we know what happened to the petrol in the end? The suicide explanation is pretty dodgy imo - buying petrol doesn't seem very untoward to me, I work in a petrol station and see any number of people filling cans so if he'd said it was for his mower/quad bike/petrol stove I wouldn't think twice. Associating it with an intention to cause a death rings alarm bells though!

 

[xmsmadex]

Do we know what happened to the petrol in the end? The suicide explanation is pretty dodgy imo - buying petrol doesn't seem very untoward to me, I work in a petrol station and see any number of people filling cans so if he'd said it was for his mower/quad bike/petrol stove I wouldn't think twice. Associating it with an intention to cause a death rings alarm bells though!

He's definitely lying.

 

[Alyce]

With Shana making complaints to police as she did, while seeing Lane secretively, and secretly recording him to show police so that he would be arrested when he returned the key he'd taken, before allegedly letting him in through her window, and staying at a hotel with him, it begs the question - was she being pressured to make complaints?

The car tracking and house watching Lane was doing shows clearly obsessive behaviour, but infatuation and obsession doesn't necessarily mean intent to harm or kill, and the secret recording shows he appeared to accept what he did was wrong and didn't come across as possessive. I would like peace of mind that he wasn't an obsessive but harmless individual who was set up by another jealous character who may have discovered her secret liaisons were continuing. If she was being pressured to make complaints it could show another party was invested in him being collared by police.

Quite a bit of strange behaviour like throwing away t-shirts can have dual explanations. Buying the petrol was highly suspicious though in my opinion. But then so is the unidentified high-viz guy seen at 9:30, the fire with accelerant that merely smouldered on bedding for 2 hours, and AC's very timely raising of the alarm.

I have listened to that recording a few times and something about it niggles at me. Lane is heard to apologise for his actions but the conversation then goes on and on.
It seemed a bit strange to me. Why not just end the conversation after the person has apologised and agreed not to repeat his actions, rather than prolonging the discussion.

 

[Squamous]

Where's the recording Alyce? I'd like to listen.

It bothers me that Lane doesn't seem to be in control of his behaviour and is a bit concerned about it himself (saying he's not right in the head).

 

[Squamous]

Just read this in the Argus:

Russell Flint: “What time did you leave home?”

Lane: “7.25am”

Mr Russell Flint: “Where were you planning to go?”

Lane: “I was planning to go and see Shana.”


Mr RF: “Why?”

Lane: “To make sure we wouldn’t have contact again in relation to us meeting up and having contact like had happened before.”


So he's claiming he went round to see her, early in the morning, to check that they were definitely not going to meet up for sex again?! He's not doing a great job with his story here!

 

[Tortoise]

Just read this in the Argus:

Russell Flint: “What time did you leave home?”

Lane: “7.25am”

Mr Russell Flint: “Where were you planning to go?”

Lane: “I was planning to go and see Shana.”


Mr RF: “Why?”

Lane: “To make sure we wouldn’t have contact again in relation to us meeting up and having contact like had happened before.”


So he's claiming he went round to see her, early in the morning, to check that they were definitely not going to meet up for sex again?! He's not doing a great job with his story here!

I think he's saying he wanted clarity - is the relationship really off because you're not behaving like it is.

 

[Tortoise]

[FONT=&quot]Miss Grice: “So one question that’s really bugging me, why did you take the key in the first place?”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Lane: “Because I wanted to see you … I wanted to see you and properly talk to you and I knew you wouldn’t let me in.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “Yeah but that’s not good … you could’ve flipped at any point.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “No, I wouldn’t have flipped.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “What about if I took someone home or something and then you came in and saw that I was with someone else.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “I honestly would’ve, I would’ve just left.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “Well ... but you left anyway …. You have no right at all to.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Michael Lane (Starting to cry): “I know I didn’t and I know : I’ve got no right or nothing, I know that.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Shana Grice: “You need to apologise to the girls ’cause it is out of order… just don’t do it again.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “I won’t come near the house again, I won’t contact you again OK.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “I think that’s best ’cause it’s just going to keep on going around in this vicious circle isn’t it?”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “Yeah I know, sorry that’s all and I know, I know you don’t, well you won’t accept it and that but I still am sorry OK.”
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “Yeah well I really don’t know what else to say to you, I just think it’s just so wrong and so out of order.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “Definitely.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “You could’ve done anything, you could’ve done anything else. While I’m sleeping, that’s just weird.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “Look I’m sorry yeah.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “… to be honest I don’t think sorry is going to cut it this time, I really don’t… even when you’re saying sorry I can’t believe you.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “I know I’m just not right in the head, if I was I wouldn’t do it.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“Wouldn’t have done that would I?”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “Well maybe you need to get help then, maybe you need to do something about it and stop crying and getting all upset about it.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML: “Yeah I know, I just don’t know what to do though … I know I’ve got a problem and that, I just don’t want to be told that I’m mad and that.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SG: “Well don’t do mad things then… You can’t steal someone’s property and expect just, just for us to be all all right with it.”[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]ML:“Obviously something’s not right in my head … and I don’t know what it is but I know I need to find out or be locked up or something.[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]“Can you just not tell anyone please … I don’t want like everyone in Mile Oak to know.”

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1514..._in_the_weeks_before_he_allegedly_killed_her/
[/FONT]

 

[Tortoise]

This is weird, all the housemates worked at Brighton Fire Alarms which is in Portslade, a 20 minute bus ride away, a 7 minute drive, or a 1.6 mile walk. It opens at 9am. So I'm wondering where they were at 7:30.

[FONT=&quot]Emma King, one of her housemates, told jurors this when she gave evidence yesterday.[/FONT][FONT=&quot]She and Miss Grice had lived together in Chrisdory Road, Portslade, with Angela Stebbings since January of last year. All three worked at nearby Brighton Fire Alarms, in Foredown Drive, where Lane also worked.

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1514...ge_ex_girlfriend__I_m_not_right_in_the_head_/
[/FONT]

 

[Alyce]

Where's the recording Alyce? I'd like to listen.

It bothers me that Lane doesn't seem to be in control of his behaviour and is a bit concerned about it himself (saying he's not right in the head).

Apologies Squamous - I meant to say read the transcript - I dont think the recording has been released ( in my defence ! I was thinking of IS at the time, with his recorded interviews and his comment about Helen waving him goodbye and contrasting it with ACs comment about Shana seeing him off at the front door )

 

[Alyce]

[FONT="]Miss Grice: “So one question that’s really bugging me, why did you take the key in the first place?”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]Lane: “Because I wanted to see you … I wanted to see you and properly talk to you and I knew you wouldn’t let me in.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “Yeah but that’s not good … you could’ve flipped at any point.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “No, I wouldn’t have flipped.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “What about if I took someone home or something and then you came in and saw that I was with someone else.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “I honestly would’ve, I would’ve just left.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “Well ... but you left anyway …. You have no right at all to.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]Michael Lane (Starting to cry): “I know I didn’t and I know : I’ve got no right or nothing, I know that.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]Shana Grice: “You need to apologise to the girls ’cause it is out of order… just don’t do it again.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “I won’t come near the house again, I won’t contact you again OK.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “I think that’s best ’cause it’s just going to keep on going around in this vicious circle isn’t it?”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “Yeah I know, sorry that’s all and I know, I know you don’t, well you won’t accept it and that but I still am sorry OK.”
[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “Yeah well I really don’t know what else to say to you, I just think it’s just so wrong and so out of order.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “Definitely.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “You could’ve done anything, you could’ve done anything else. While I’m sleeping, that’s just weird.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “Look I’m sorry yeah.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]SG: “… to be honest I don’t think sorry is going to cut it this time, I really don’t… even when you’re saying sorry I can’t believe you.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]ML: “I know I’m just not right in the head, if I was I wouldn’t do it.[/FONT]
[FONT="]“Wouldn’t have done that would I?”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]SG: “Well maybe you need to get help then, maybe you need to do something about it and stop crying and getting all upset about it.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]ML: “Yeah I know, I just don’t know what to do though … I know I’ve got a problem and that, I just don’t want to be told that I’m mad and that.”[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]SG: “Well don’t do mad things then… You can’t steal someone’s property and expect just, just for us to be all all right with it.”[/FONT]
[FONT="]ML:“Obviously something’s not right in my head … and I don’t know what it is but I know I need to find out or be locked up or something.[/FONT][/COLOR]
[COLOR=#333333][FONT="]“Can you just not tell anyone please … I don’t want like everyone in Mile Oak to know.”

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/1514..._in_the_weeks_before_he_allegedly_killed_her/
[/FONT]

That's the one - thanks Tortoise

Have to wonder who was there when this recording was made....

 

[Tortoise]

I'm thinking what else there is to consider.

No one heard any screaming or shouting (the walls were thin we've heard) and I don't believe we've heard of any defensive injuries, or injuries on Lane. Which suggests to me that she was taken by complete surprise, she perhaps trusted her attacker, and didn't have any time to react. She was attacked in her bedroom because that's where the blood is.

She was in her dressing gown so hadn't yet started to get ready for work, so it probably was still early.

If Lane entered the house she would probably have heard something, which would prime her to be on alert, so why didn't she have time to get alarmed and scream, or text, and/or move off her bed and/or fight back?

 

[mrazda71]

Am just quickly reading through and catching up ... didn't Lane have/take a key at some point?

Even if that key was returned, I'd fully expect someone of his type to have got a copy cut before giving back the original to placate Sharna and give her a false sense of security.