UPDATE- Bin Laden is Dead-President spoke

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I haven't read the upthread, so please pardon me.

HE'S ALREADY BEEN BURIED AT SEA?

No autopsy
No DNA confirmation
No photos released *yes I want to see them*

Didn't this attack just happen, and yet he's already swimmin with the fishes? I don't like it, and I pray someone can explain it to me.

Thanks in advance.

Mel

ps: it's on the breaking news front page of CNN

Mel, it's all here in the thread.

photos released. (see Dr. Fessel who dared to link them)
DNA confirmed. (use his sister's DNA records)
Autopsy? (bullet in forehead - see photos)

US will honor Muslim custom of burial w/in certain timeframe.

Attack happened yesterday, during the Royal wedding, far as I can tell.

Planned hatched August 2010.

nice to see you Mel.
 
I think he should have been put to death.

I think this would have been an amazing time to back off on the American pride thing and just be quiet. Let the world see that we can have some respect and humility.

Osama Bin Laden has coordinated attacks against countries across the world; not just the United States. We are not the only ones who feel that justice has been served. Obama said during his speech that this a great victory for anyone who values peace, not just for Americans. We just eliminated someone who murdered THOUSANDS of innocent people around the world for decades.

What do you think would be accomplished by being respectful and showing humility over the death of a mass murderer? It is pretty disrespectful that you're grouping everyone who isn't an American together and acting like they are all about to attend a memorial service for Osama Bin Laden.
 
Justice does not need to show class or restraint.

au contraire my friend!

The epitome of justice IS class and restraint.

Remember in Schindler's List this quote?

Oskar Schindler: Power is when we have every justification to kill, and we don't.
Amon Goeth: You think that's power?
Oskar Schindler: That's what the Emperor said. A man steals something, he's brought in before the Emperor, he throws himself down on the ground. He begs for his life, he knows he's going to die. And the Emperor... pardons him. This worthless man, he lets him go.
Amon Goeth: I think you are drunk.
Oskar Schindler: That's power, Amon. That is power


The original statement and point was justice showing class and restraint. The example you posted did not show justice. It showed power using power to exercise class and restraint - but certainly did not show justice as there had been a crime committed that deserved justice.
 
The fourth helicopter crashed into the compound. Seals promptly destroyed it (blew it up) due to sensitive communications.

When inside, photo analysis confirmed OBL's identity. Also, an individual in compound confirmed---Yes, that is OBL. Gave him opportunity to surrender.

Possible burial at sea to prevent a land shrine.
 
Aah, OS...not exactly a saint. Life isn't a movie, but I get your point.
Let's also not forget the celebration that went on in the streets leading to Ground Zero. People were coming from all over the world to help. Should we have also shown restraint lest the world look unkindly at us?

I appreciate your point and it is a good one and no, we should not have turned down help on 9/11

the world was reaching out to us in compassion. What we do now when the crisis has passed can either speak to justice OR speak to nationalistic pride,

We have an election looming. I dont think there is going to be any other outcome here other than a "WE" got him approach. This is going to alienate to global community but it will fuel political positions in our country.
 
The point is not about a pardon. He deserved death. The point is about not crowing about it and making even more enemies that will in turn hate more Americans.

How hard is this concept really?

Yeah, because the terrorists are going to retaliate BECAUSE we celebrated their leader's death. They obviously wouldn't attack us simply because we killed their leader. No, there had to be another 'trigger'.
 
My hinky meter is working, but prolly cuz I'm tired. I want photos, I want proof that this guy is really dead. Don't tell me you threw him in the ocean and not back it up with anything. Yes compounds are burning - but dang, I wanna hear from the dude that put the bullet in his head.

Do I trust the government - No I Don't. Sorry if that offends anyone.

Moo

Mel

http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg616/scaled.php?tn=0&server=616&filename=l7ktyd.jpg&xsize=640&ysize=640

credit for finding photo to Dr. Fessel.
 
The point is not about a pardon. He deserved death. The point is about not crowing about it and making even more enemies that will in turn hate more Americans.

How hard is this concept really?
...and we were afraid to speak and millions died many years ago. We should never be afraid to celebrate what we believe in. I like to think that by waving our flag and coming together to chant USA we're showing our strength and national pride in a dignified manner.
 
While looking for mel's breaking news I saw this and thought I'd share:

http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2011/05/02/obama-to-make-statment-tonight-subject-unknown/

[Updated, 1:36 a.m. ET] As news of bin Laden's death reached people via cell phones late Sunday, thousands of fans at a Philadelphia Phillies baseball game chanted "USA! USA!" in the ninth inning of a Phillies-Mets game.

There is also a video of a game that was interupted by chanting of USA. If anything my take on this is those that want to kill us already have plenty of reasons (reasons within their own minds besides any of our younger generation expression pride in their country at this time). I refuse to live my life in fear that my actions and words will get me murdered by a terrorist. They already want me dead---I might as well say how I really feel. I tend to be to matter of fact at times so I apologize for that. If anything the reaction by a lot of americans when seen by those terrorist that want us dead will give them just a moment of pause for thought. Maybe maybe not but in times of war anytime the enemy feels even slight demoralization from either one of their prominent leaders being killed---after they had been told he would---and seeing so many Americans showing resolve by chanting USA---just might give them a pucker in the right place---at least for a minute? That makes me smile.
 
Compound discovered in August 2010.
Conclusion made that OBL living there in mid-February 2011.
Hatched a plan for operation in mid-March 2011.
 
Mel, it's all here in the thread.

photos released. (see Dr. Fessel who dared to link them)
DNA confirmed. (use his sister's DNA records)
Autopsy? (bullet in forehead - see photos)

US will honor Muslim custom of burial w/in certain timeframe.

Attack happened yesterday, during the Royal wedding, far as I can tell.

Planned hatched August 2010.

nice to see you Mel.

Nice to see you too. It's late, I'm cranky, so I'll read the upthread. I'm just suprised they tossed him so quick. Dang - he would have a good mind to examine dont ya think? I appreciate that the US honored the Muslin culture -- not for the radicals mind you, but for the peace loving muslims who don't believe killing is an honour.

Hugs,

Mel
 
Ding Dong the Witch Is Dead...

It is very sad to me to watch the celebration going on right now.

I hoped we were a people who could have risen above this.

Yes he was responsible for great death and pain.

How does celebrating his death elevate those people he killed?

Killing, killing and more killing.

All of this makes us more like him rather than less.

I watch this and while I understand the emotion (governments should not run on emotion, BTW)

I am saddened that at the end of the day all of our cheering over the death of an individual reduces us.

Right now is a chance to think globally instead of "locally" and we are turning it down.

It is a chance to show class and we are totally missing it once again.

The world is turning us off and tuning in to other channels.

So sad for America.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aIFY9h8DImg

AMEN WOO!

We can celebrate when Scott Peterson is found guilty, but we can't celebrate when a guy kills thousands of people.

I hope so! I do! I pray for each and every victim (except for the evil thang). I hope we can all hang our American flags proudly tomorrow.

What I hope NOT to see is anyone berating any peaceful muslims in the US. Women and children especially. This can't be easy on them.

God Bless America!

MOO

Mel - who is nothing like HIM!

Yes, and that was painful to watch. We need to realize we are in that same position now. Our celebrating can be perceived as "painful to watch"




You never end killing with more killing. Basic101


I understand your sentiments, Glow. My mom had a slightly similar reaction after awhile. We turned on the t.v. and saw the announcement and sat there stunned. I then called everyone I knew. But the scenes of people celebrating wildly in the street gave my mom pause. She did wonder if we were acting kind of like "them" meaning those who celebrated after 911.

My mom is a saint who was sent straight down to heaven to us. She has a deep respect for life and has instilled in me the feeling that we should never celebrate death, even when the death is necessary.

That being said, I did tell my mom that we are not celebrating the deaths of innocents, like some did after 911, but rather, we are celebrating the end of one very evil and dangerous person. I asked her how she felt when Hitler was killed. Did they celebrate? My mom is from Holland and went through WWII. She saw little Jewish friends disappear and never come back to school again. She saw dead bodies in the streets of Amsterdam, dead from starvation. She saw Nazi's come to the house and question her about what her parents were up to (they were underground members). So yes, they celebrated. And when I reminded her of that, she understood.

I agree that we should always try to act with dignity. And I don't feel joy when an evil person is executed. I won't feel joy when scott peterson or, if she should be sentenced to death, when casey anthony is executed. Those deaths won't bring back the people they murdered. And I don't glory in death. In fact, I'm essentially against the death penalty. But this was totally necessary. There would have been no way to bring osama to trial and had we been able to do so, he'd be a martyr in prison still probably finding a way to give out orders. And, he would have been sentenced to death anyway. No, there was really no other way I can think of to get him without more grief.

So, I do feel great relief that an incredible evil has been wiped off the face of the earth. And while quiet displays of humility might be the ultimate expression of humanity, it's been 10 long years of pain and living under a cloud of fear and despair - and the feeling that these terrorists cannot be stopped - so the wild celebrations are certainly understandable. osama's death will be unlikely to prevent all terrorism from here on in, but the head of the snake has been cut off - at least one of the snakes. So joy and relief are evident.

Thus, I had a beer, thought about those we lost on 911 and felt amazed that this beast had finally been found and destroyed. I am relieved and while I don't feel joy, exactly, I do feel satisfaction and pride that our intelligence succeeded despite the odds.

Nevertheless, your thoughts on the matter are very worthy of consideration, IMO. Ghandi and MLK got a lot done with a similar attitude. They used quiet resistance, passivity and expressions of love in their protests.

Yet, how many more lives would have been lost had we taken that tack against Hitler?

So, although I can't say I agree with you, your thoughts are valid ones and worthy of consideration.
 
...and during the webcam arrest of Casey A. in the middle of the night.

Yep and that was a few servers ago.

This news didn't break the server. (ok, who wasn't peeved when WS wasn't working?)

and oil futures are falling. Who didn't expect that?
 
FOX is now reporting that just half an hour ago he was buried at sea. They did this so as not to have a "shrine" for his followers. It is not known which sea or how he was dropped just that he was buried at sea about half an hour ago.
 
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