VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #8

[dangrsmind]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lake_Bodom_murders

Ha ha! No, that wasn't what I was thinking, but it is good.

 

[PAXIMUS]

FWIW, like some of the other posters here I have an interest in forensic science. My interest started in implementing digital forensic techniques, i.e. an algorithm for recognizing the source of a scanned image. I've considered going into the forensics field and so I've delved into some rather arcane and grotesque books. Many of these are available on the Internet for free BTW.

And now the weather...

See also Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Four People Murdered in VA College Town #3

This is the weather reported for the approximate time of the murders including temperatures and wind information.

I think we discussed previously that the bodies would have decayed more rapidly during the first part of the week when the temperatures were higher. Also, the wind direction might help explain why the decaying bodies weren't smelled until later in the week. Note the wind direction changes on both Thursday and Friday which is when the bodies were discovered. Further analysis would be required to say this with any confidence however.

THAT is some very interesting stuff there DM and a bit over my head I must admit but I can see why you would be interested in it as it is quite revealing on many levels.

For the last ten years I have been a student of forensic serology and have sat at the feet of some of the best in the business. The nature of blood, blood stains, blood patterns, splatter etc etc, very interesting stuff but the last year or so I have branched off in to forensic entomology and you would be surprised how much bugs can tell you about a crime scene and how long a body had been dead etc, there are certain moths and beetles that only apppear around a dead body in a particular time frame. For many years forensic entomlogist were taken about as seriously as psychics and mind readers but no more, people are now starting to realize the important role bugs play in any particularly crime scene.

FWIW Carrion flies are what you are looking for in relation to maggots as they are the first type of fly on the scene of a dead body and lay their eggs but as mentioned climate plays a major role in this. There are certain mathematical equations and various logarithms involved in all of this that I wont bore you with at this time.

 

[CharlieChan]

Thanks Pax. You're always covering everybody's behind. You may have been born just a "blue acid Woodstock mutant baby" but I will always love you for who you really are. .

 

[claudicici]

Ha ha! No, that wasn't what I was thinking, but it is good.

so what is it ?...they were on the "unholy alliance tour" and sick has "unholy apostles"?...don't say because they're both satanists cos children of bodom are not

 

[tapu]

so what is it ?...they were on the "unholy alliance tour" and sick has "unholy apostles"?...don't say because they're both satanists cos children of bodom are not

Christ, Claudi, I don't even get the question now....

 

[tapu]

RE: the usefulness of determining order of death

Maybe I've missed it being said, but if not, here's what I think would matter:

They'd use a variety of things, including insect activity, to determine time and order of death, right? This information would be used to construct a narrative of the crime. They need to have a theory of what Sam did exactly to present their version of what happened to the jury. Some of this would go to motive (which is not legally necessary, right?), and to helping the jury make sense of it all in the way they want them to make sense of it all. Motive may not be a necessary part of the formal presentation, but it goes a long way toward getting a jury to accept a narrative.

Well, I'm blabbing at this point and maybe everyone else has assumed this, but I thought it was getting lost in the discussion.


Oh, yeah, and good morning! :wave: -the tapu

p.s. I was just sure I'd be the only one with a Finnish joke, but now I find out... you ALL have one.

 

[claudicici]

we are supposed to connect "children of bodom" to the case....
mmmh maybe the song lyrics could qualify as a "diss" song directed at sicktanick?
Live the years of danger live on the road
To the point there's nothing to lose
Regrets all you want it to be!

In the blink of an eye you're fighting
Look at me chump, champ is my name
Were you going to all laugh? I'll always be

Five times I've died it's all the same
Got only myself to blame
Never begged for you to rescue me
Then again I never could find you
But you leave me ripe to choke
Who gives a f and your the devil

And now, wont we find out
Just how we should get down in hell
Funny, you don't seem that big time
Memorize that your better
When your smiling pretty for the devil

Ten times I've died it's all the same
Well I got myself to blame
Never begged for you to rescue me
Then again no one could find you
Because you leave me ripe to choke
Who gets the f and your the devil

And now, war will find you
This hour, you should live in hell
Funny, you don't seem that big time
Memorize that your better
when your smiling pretty for the devil

 

[tapu]

:::raising hand::: I know, I know!!! Pick me!! ::: waving hand wildly::: ME...ME!!! :::arrghhh, I finally know one:::

Dangrs, "Yes, Wadahoot? Do you know the answer?"

Me: "YES!!!! Those nice young men are just as charming as the SKR boys!!!" :dance:

<<<<<pssst... is wadahoot drunk??>>>>>

 

[dangrsmind]

so what is it ?...they were on the "unholy alliance tour" and sick has "unholy apostles"?...don't say because they're both satanists cos children of bodom are not

Close...but not really.

Here's some links...

Start here: http://www.myspace.com/deadnoteproductions

Start on the left side, in the section entitled "influences"

Then consider: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...ndID=6670398&albumID=1675341&imageID=31435660

There is more, but I'll leave it at that.

 

[dangrsmind]

THAT is some very interesting stuff there DM and a bit over my head I must admit but I can see why you would be interested in it as it is quite revealing on many levels.

For the last ten years I have been a student of forensic serology and have sat at the feet of some of the best in the business. The nature of blood, blood stains, blood patterns, splatter etc etc, very interesting stuff but the last year or so I have branched off in to forensic entomology and you would be surprised how much bugs can tell you about a crime scene and how long a body had been dead etc, there are certain moths and beetles that only apppear around a dead body in a particular time frame. For many years forensic entomlogist were taken about as seriously as psychics and mind readers but no more, people are now starting to realize the important role bugs play in any particularly crime scene.

FWIW Carrion flies are what you are looking for in relation to maggots as they are the first type of fly on the scene of a dead body and lay their eggs but as mentioned climate plays a major role in this. There are certain mathematical equations and various logarithms involved in all of this that I wont bore you with at this time.

The point is about the smell and why no one smelled it until later in the week.

If I recall the map correctly, 1st street is north of the house itself. Early in the week when the murders were probably committed, it was hot and humid and the wind was very light, less than 5 MPH. As the week went on the wind picked up and changed direction. Thursday and Friday the wind was out of the north which would have blown any smell away from the road. However on Friday, the wind shifted to the southwest and picked up speed. This would blow the smell towards the road and the front of the house again. I think someone mentioned this wind shift before because of the SW wind connection to the demon Pazuzu. (You knew the big "P" was going to come back in here somehow right?) However it also helps to explain why none of the officers that came to the house noticed the smell until later on Friday night.

 

[dangrsmind]

RE: the usefulness of determining order of death

Maybe I've missed it being said, but if not, here's what I think would matter:

They'd use a variety of things, including insect activity, to determine time and order of death, right? This information would be used to construct a narrative of the crime. They need to have a theory of what Sam did exactly to present their version of what happened to the jury. Some of this would go to motive (which is not legally necessary, right?), and to helping the jury make sense of it all in the way they want them to make sense of it all. Motive may not be a necessary part of the formal presentation, but it goes a long way toward getting a jury to accept a narrative.

Well, I'm blabbing at this point and maybe everyone else has assumed this, but I thought it was getting lost in the discussion.


Oh, yeah, and good morning! :wave: -the tapu

p.s. I was just sure I'd be the only one with a Finnish joke, but now I find out... you ALL have one.

It seems like the main issue related to time of death is going to be showing that he killed the women first, then hung around the house for a while before he killed Emma's father. It goes to pre-meditation and disproving the "crime of passion" theory at least for one of the murders.

 

[tapu]

It seems like the main issue related to time of death is going to be showing that he killed the women first, then hung around the house for a while before he killed Emma's father. It goes to pre-meditation and disproving the "crime of passion" theory at least for one of the murders.

Right. But... what's Finnish about that?

 

[claudicici]

Close...but not really.

Here's some links...

Start here: http://www.myspace.com/deadnoteproductions

Start on the left side, in the section entitled "influences"

Then consider: http://viewmorepics.myspace.com/ind...ndID=6670398&albumID=1675341&imageID=31435660

There is more, but I'll leave it at that.

that is pretty sad:sick:...that was not the kind of love I was proclaiming for them earlier btw...

 

[dangrsmind]

Right. But... what's Finnish about that?

You ask, I deliver.

"It's only an individual, a family case, a crime of passion. Nothing else, nothing more," Nushi said.

From http://www.wtopnews.com/?sid=1852850&nid=105

 

[tapu]

Have I already told the joke about the Swedish half-sister?

(Actually, maybe I better not--I could get... jelly beaned!)

 

[dangrsmind]

that is pretty sad:sick:...that was not the kind of love I was proclaiming for them earlier btw...

Amusingly I just found this yesterday after Ziggy's comment about these guys having black nail polish. Originally I was going to just connect it to her MySpace influences list.

Folks, this is why I don't really buy the whole argument about those mean Websleuthers "investigating" people.

Don't post it on the Internet if you don't want people to read it.

 

[dangrsmind]

Have I already told the joke about the Swedish half-sister?

(Actually, maybe I better not--I could get... jelly beaned!)

Does this joke involve any Norwegians?

I used to have a Swedish brother in law who constantly told Norwegian jokes.

 

[tapu]

No, but it involves the Boston PD.


Norwegian jokes, really? Like how my parents on the WVa border of Ohio tell West Virginian jokes?? But of course that practice would be universal...

 

[dangrsmind]

No, but it involves the Boston PD.


Norwegian jokes, really? Like how my parents on the WVa border of Ohio tell West Virginian jokes?? But of course that practice would be universal...

It's the same idea. Just substitute Norwegian for West Virginian, Pole, etc. The gist of all of his jokes was that Norwegians were uncultured, uneducated, gullible and generally not very smart. The basic idea was to drink aquavit in ridiculous quantities, sing Swedish drinking songs loudly in inappropriate locations (i.e. a Chinese restaurant), and of course tell Norwegian jokes. When he got drunk he would become aggressive and he started bar fights on several occasions. Oh and he was a master of bar tricks. Ah those were the days...

ETA: One of these fights was at the Round Up Saloon in Lafayette. A place the Zigster might know about.

ETA also: Zigster? WTF?

 

[Woe.be.gone]

I know you're being ironic wada but I totally believe this to be true.
We can't forget that they lost 3 friends in this.
I understand their anger because it seems everyone is against them for different reasons.
I think that's what's dangerous.Pain and hurt leads to anger and anger leads to violence.
Not feeling understood,thinking you can't trust anyone aren't those reasons for pain and hurt? ...I think a lot of crimes could be prevented if people would recognize that cycle early on ,in school all they seem to care about is test grades and to get rid of the kids that are "disturbing" the environment.They send them to alternative schools that are like boot camps ,noone shows them how to deal with emotions positively.
Even pain can create so much beauty.

I so agree with your post claudicici. I've always had heart for the underdog - the fat kid, the random 'different' one, the racial standout, the one with epilepsy or some other status a person has no control over. When I was a child, I could never understand how/why some kids were consistently so mean toward kids who were different in ways of no fault of their own. Today, I'm looking closer at the mean kids - what's going on inside of them, what's 'wrong' with them?

Also imo Public schools didn't/don't handle people with different learning styles with any imagination at all imo. They're the smart ones?
A good book, 'A Mind At A Time' by Mel Levine, M.D.

One thing I heard a horrorcore person say, is that they consist of peeps who were always the one being picked on, the one who never felt they fit in. But I still don't understand why they would choose to build their 'empire' based on evil messages/doings. Did they buy into it themselves? Did they accept they are 'bad'. Is it an I'll show you mentality? Is is anger manifesting itself outwardly forever. Why be stuck at some destructive level when one's talents could be put to good use to help other kids who now are going through what you once went through. Unless, of course, you choose to choose evil, that is, you believe you belong to satan. Why? What is helpful/good about that? They are basically doing what one says was done to them in the first place. Their behavior is not an answer to anything in an earthly sense. Notice me for how 'bad' I am - I'll remain angry and show it through everything I do.