VA - Hannah Elizabeth Graham, 18, Charlottesville, 13 Sept 2014 - #11

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After reading more hours than I care to admit, I'm left with some conflicting feelings that I'd like to share.

I believe racism is alive and well in our country and I often say if I was the mother of a black son, I'd be terrified for his safety each and every day. I don't think many of us that are white and of a certain age (WF, 60 years old) have a clear idea what it's to be a young black man in today's world. Sort of like me a female expecting a man to understand a pregnancy. People still see black men on the sidewalk and lock their car doors (I've done it) when we see them on the street. They are judged as "punks" "trouble" if they are wearing a hoodie and jeans falling down over their butt. I understand a large segment of black men/women have a real distrust/fear of LE and the establishment based on past decades of unfairness in every day life, convictions that over the years have been reversed after spending 30+ years in prison for crimes they did not commit. I live in Dallas and in the past ten years, something like 26 men with an average of 36 years time spent in prison were found NOT guilty through new DNA testing. The majority of the freed were Afro American. I believe that Jesse carries this cultural distrust and his fears have dictated his actions the past few days which really aren't helping him at all. Another poster said the prosecutor will/can use that behavior as a flight risk example and they would be correct to do so. I'm not defending him, merely trying to understand his actions. I have no idea if he is guilty in the disappearance of Hannah (or others), it doesn't look good at all that he was the last known person with her! He's made a mess of the past few days (he could have done so much better with good counsel) but I sort of get the fear that's dictated his actions/non-actions.

The other thing I ponder on is that LE must have sooooooooo much evidence that points to Jesse being in deep as far as Hannah's disappearance. I don't believe I've ever seen press conference where the chief basically calls a POI out over and over - really strange. The wanted poster for traffic violations was strange to me. The only way I can reconcile the Captain's behavior is he's pretty darn sure Jesse abducted and killed Hannah or much less likely he's gone over the deep end. If Jesse did in fact kill Hannah, he's toast as he should be.

My heart hurts, hurts, hurts seeing her precious mom and dad. I pray this can be cleared up soon for those dear souls.

And their darling Hannah. What a dynamic young woman! I've read her tweets and fell in love with her. I never had a daughter but if I had and she was like Hannah I would consider myself blessed beyond words. She was going to make something wonderful out of her life . . .


Hope this makes some sort of sense. I've typed it after taking a sleeping pill, must get some rest.
 
:goodpost:

I agree with you entirely WichitaFalls!
 
do you think uva students have been advised not to speak to the media and not to post anything on FB pages?
 
Have her friends spoken publicly? All the footage of her reminds me of Run Lola Run, why is she running in her apartment hallways at 930? Why did her friends come then go without her? How long were they with her? If this has been discussed I am sorry, I can't keep up. Was there some sort of drama unfolding that evening before she went missing?
 
Have we discussed this? Found this on FB page for Hannah posted today

"They keep saying that they don't think Hannah could have been where she said she was in her last txt message. But 14th in Wertland is right in front of the hospital where Mathews worked... Is this a coincidence??? Praying for answers soon."

 
ozazure said:
Have her friends spoken publicly? All the footage of her reminds me of Run Lola Run, why is she running in her apartment hallways at 930? Why did her friends come then go without her? How long were they with her? If this has been discussed I am sorry, I can't keep up. Was there some sort of drama unfolding that evening before she went missing?
Click to expand...

All very good questions. AFAIK, her friends have not spoken to MSM about the events of that evening.
 
WichitaFalls said:
After reading more hours than I care to admit, I'm left with some conflicting feelings that I'd like to share.

I believe racism is alive and well in our country and I often say if I was the mother of a black son, I'd be terrified for his safety each and every day. I don't think many of us that are white and of a certain age (WF, 60 years old) have a clear idea what it's to be a young black man in today's world. Sort of like me a female expecting a man to understand a pregnancy. People still see black men on the sidewalk and lock their car doors (I've done it) when we see them on the street. They are judged as "punks" "trouble" if they are wearing a hoodie and jeans falling down over their butt. I understand a large segment of black men/women have a real distrust/fear of LE and the establishment based on past decades of unfairness in every day life, convictions that over the years have been reversed after spending 30+ years in prison for crimes they did not commit. I live in Dallas and in the past ten years, something like 26 men with an average of 36 years time spent in prison were found NOT guilty through new DNA testing. The majority of the freed were Afro American. I believe that Jesse carries this cultural distrust and his fears have dictated his actions the past few days which really aren't helping him at all. Another poster said the prosecutor will/can use that behavior as a flight risk example and they would be correct to do so. I'm not defending him, merely trying to understand his actions. I have no idea if he is guilty in the disappearance of Hannah (or others), it doesn't look good at all that he was the last known person with her! He's made a mess of the past few days (he could have done so much better with good counsel) but I sort of get the fear that's dictated his actions/non-actions.

The other thing I ponder on is that LE must have sooooooooo much evidence that points to Jesse being in deep as far as Hannah's disappearance. I don't believe I've ever seen press conference where the chief basically calls a POI out over and over - really strange. The wanted poster for traffic violations was strange to me. The only way I can reconcile the Captain's behavior is he's pretty darn sure Jesse abducted and killed Hannah or much less likely he's gone over the deep end. If Jesse did in fact kill Hannah, he's toast as he should be.

My heart hurts, hurts, hurts seeing her precious mom and dad. I pray this can be cleared up soon for those precious souls.

And that precious Hannah. What a dynamic young woman! I've read her tweets and fell in love with her. I never had a daughter but if I had and she was like Hannah I would consider myself blessed beyond words. She was going to make something wonderful out of her life . . .


Hope this makes some sort of sense. I've typed it after taking a sleeping pill, must get some rest.
Click to expand...

I dont agree with this one bit and I'm not going to be made to feel guilty for being white since its something thats 100 percent out of my control to start with.

I will say that the personas we cultivate have a lot to do with how society views and treats us and that goes for everyone...... regardless of race, color or creed.

That being said, I dont believe that race belongs in this discussion at all. This should be about Hannah, helping to find her and if she is dead, helping to bring her killer to justice. Please leave your outside agendas at home or in another thread.

It doesnt matter if the POI is black, white, latino or any other ethnicity. Their race shouldnt excuse their actions....if you stop to think about it isnt that intrinsically racist to start with?

All that SHOULD matter is that a lovely 18 year old girl with her whole life ahead of her is missing and the likelihood of her being found dead increases with each passing day.

My sympathies lie firmly with the "victim" here. IMO bad guys and those suspected of being bad guys, neither warrant nor deserve our compassion....... unless they are later shown to be innocent and I just dont see that happening in JLMs case.

Thats based on his actions, not the color of his skin. Its not about black versus white, or any other ethnicity for that matter.

Its about good versus evil.Right versus wrong. & Life versus death
 
zapped said:
I dont agree with this one bit and I'm not going to be made to feel guilty for being white since its something thats 100 percent out of my control to start with.

I will say that the personas we cultivate have a lot to do with how society views and treats us and that goes for everyone regardless of race, color or creed.

That being said, I also dont believe that race belongs in this discussion at all.
Click to expand...

With respect, I didn't take her post as 'white guilt' or bringing race into the discussion (not in the manner I think would be irrelevant). I thought she brought up some good points on what could be behind his recent actions. As far as cultivated personas contributing to this, I've known plenty who didn't have any particular 'persona' that would explain how police and the public in general respond to them.
 
Suthrnqt said:
All very good questions. AFAIK, her friends have not spoken to MSM about the events of that evening.
Click to expand...
Do we know if the friends she was with that night were her roommates? I just can't get over no one looking for her when she said she was lost and did not return home that night. My friends and I did a lot of stupid stupid things when we were young and probably wouldn't be here today if we had not watched out for each other. Looking back, I can't believe how careless we were.
 
Waddles said:
Have we discussed this? Found this on FB page for Hannah posted today

"They keep saying that they don't think Hannah could have been where she said she was in her last txt message. But 14th in Wertland is right in front of the hospital where Mathews worked... Is this a coincidence??? Praying for answers soon."
Click to expand...

Anyone know if the hospital has a medical waste incinerator?
Its far fetched but i know a case in Sweden where they think one of these were used to burn a body or parts of it. The problem was that all of the ashes and residue had been shipped off long before anyone thought of this. If they have one, would POI have access to it?
 
A guest on a morning news program suggested the probable cause for the initial warrant for jam apt was seeing mud on the cars tires and inside the car. Anyone know if that is fact, or more sloppy conjecture? I wouldn't.t think mud probable cause..without a crime scene, let alone a body.
 
Zapped it never occurred to me to connect feeling guilty to being white and I assure you I carry no outside agendas. My post simply tried to address some of the many layers of this human tragedy. I don't believe you read this in the spirit that I wrote it. That being said I respect your right to respond as you wish. My sympathies are in line with yours (did you miss that part or just chose to ignore it), innocent, vibrant, beautiful, smart, funny Hannah, her precious mom, dad, brother and friends who love her. This event will change who they are and not in a good way. We're all here because we care.
 
WichitaFalls said:
After reading more hours than I care to admit, I'm left with some conflicting feelings that I'd like to share.

I believe racism is alive and well in our country and I often say if I was the mother of a black son, I'd be terrified for his safety each and every day. I don't think many of us that are white and of a certain age (WF, 60 years old) have a clear idea what it's to be a young black man in today's world. Sort of like me a female expecting a man to understand a pregnancy. People still see black men on the sidewalk and lock their car doors (I've done it) when we see them on the street. They are judged as "punks" "trouble" if they are wearing a hoodie and jeans falling down over their butt. I understand a large segment of black men/women have a real distrust/fear of LE and the establishment based on past decades of unfairness in every day life, convictions that over the years have been reversed after spending 30+ years in prison for crimes they did not commit. I live in Dallas and in the past ten years, something like 26 men with an average of 36 years time spent in prison were found NOT guilty through new DNA testing. The majority of the freed were Afro American. I believe that Jesse carries this cultural distrust and his fears have dictated his actions the past few days which really aren't helping him at all. Another poster said the prosecutor will/can use that behavior as a flight risk example and they would be correct to do so. I'm not defending him, merely trying to understand his actions. I have no idea if he is guilty in the disappearance of Hannah (or others), it doesn't look good at all that he was the last known person with her! He's made a mess of the past few days (he could have done so much better with good counsel) but I sort of get the fear that's dictated his actions/non-actions.

The other thing I ponder on is that LE must have sooooooooo much evidence that points to Jesse being in deep as far as Hannah's disappearance. I don't believe I've ever seen press conference where the chief basically calls a POI out over and over - really strange. The wanted poster for traffic violations was strange to me. The only way I can reconcile the Captain's behavior is he's pretty darn sure Jesse abducted and killed Hannah or much less likely he's gone over the deep end. If Jesse did in fact kill Hannah, he's toast as he should be.

My heart hurts, hurts, hurts seeing her precious mom and dad. I pray this can be cleared up soon for those dear souls.

And their darling Hannah. What a dynamic young woman! I've read her tweets and fell in love with her. I never had a daughter but if I had and she was like Hannah I would consider myself blessed beyond words. She was going to make something wonderful out of her life . . .


Hope this makes some sort of sense. I've typed it after taking a sleeping pill, must get some rest.
Click to expand...

Great Post!
 
curious jane said:
A guest on a morning news program suggested the probable cause for the initial warrant for jam apt was seeing mud on the cars tires and inside the car. Anyone know if that is fact, or more sloppy conjecture? I wouldn't.t think mud probable cause..without a crime scene, let alone a body.
Click to expand...

The guest wasn't exactly clear in his explanation when I heard this....but it would be likely that the mud allowed them to get a warrant for the CAR....then other items inside the car allowed them to get a warrant for the apartment. This would fit exactly with what has already been stated a number of times by LE and news media.

jmo
 
whyman said:
Anyone know if the hospital has a medical waste incinerator?
Its far fetched but i know a case in Sweden where they think one of these were used to burn a body or parts of it. The problem was that all of the ashes and residue had been shipped off long before anyone thought of this. If they have one, would POI have access to it?
Click to expand...
I can't imagine he would be able to pull something like that off but I'm still trying to figure out how he was able to work at the hospital with his record. Even as a patient transporter, he would be subject to background checks.
 
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