GUILTY VA - Noah Thomas, 5, Pulaski County, 22 March 2015 #4

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matou said:
OK so dad was arrested on Monday? The day after Noah's disappearance was announced? Was he held in jail for awhile? Did he start flipping out for drugs and gave some info to LE about where Noah and any other items (e.g. drugs, drug making equipment) could be located? The 5 day thing is really bothering me. It can't be an oversight. The FBI was there too, dogs were everywhere.
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No, he was arrested today. 3/22 is the offense date.
 
courtneyb said:
I am at work and couldn't listen to the PC, but did they mention if the lid was on, covered with grass and sod, etc.? I'm guessing not, but they had to have reason to know for certain that Noah didn't fall in on accident... and if it was obvious from the autopsy that he was not alive when he was put in the tank, wouldn't they have charged them with murder? Or one of them?
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I'm not defending the parents, I absolutely think at this point they are responsible. However, I think if he fell in by himself, there would be evidence of drowning that would have been obvious to the medical examiner upon the initial autopsy. That leaves someone placing him in the tank after he was deceased. (I hate typing that) Even though LE believes that Noah was killed and placed (someone tried to hide him) in the septic tank, they need proof of who that person was before charging that person (or in this case, I believe two people) That evidence may be what they are hoping to find with the additional autopsy results.
 
gitana1 said:
The bit about a "hard, credible tip" was the one thing that had me believing this was more than a tired mom napping while her five year old watched cartoons. But now we hear there was no tip at all? Odd. So they just finally decided to drain the septic tank? What was the purpose of that statement about the hard, credible tip then?
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I didn't buy the exhausted mum napping from the start. Not when it was reported that she was exhausted from working nights, yet the paper reported that the family were out Saturday night. Firstly, if you were that exhausted that you needed to sleep for hours when solely responsible for looking after 2 children, wouldn't you sleep Saturday night rather than go out? Especially if you had to get up early Sunday morning to drop your partner to work for 7.00am. The whole timeline didn't sound right from the start.

Davis had previously said that video surveillance from a convenience store showed Noah and his family out on Saturday evening, but that investigators only had the family's statements as corroboration for Sunday's activities.
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Taken from: http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_86971938-fb24-5957-9562-89fb1f087864.html So, not even someone from Dad's place of work could confirm the family dropping him off?

Then there were the clothes - Noah went missing on Sunday morning wearing exactly the same clothes as he had worn on the Saturday night, right down to the coat and boots. Just made me think that Saturday night was the time that was important, not Sunday morning. Yes, children can wear the same clothes two days running, but it just seemed too convenient to me.
 
Jeez, I can't stop thinking about little Noah...my heart just is breaking...

Also, I just thought about how hard it would be for the person who had to do his autopsy, I don't know how those people do it, but so glad they are able to carry out their job. We should all say a prayer for them as well.
 
Davis had previously said that video surveillance from a convenience store showed Noah and his family out on Saturday evening, but that investigators only had the family's statements as corroboration for Sunday's activities.

This makes me think the horror happened on Saturday night. Party time for the parents? I wonder if Paul was actually at work on Sunday and if he was, how was his demeanor? Did he have a large package with him? I believe murder charges will follow. JMO

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/p...cle_317ae1ed-ccc2-52cc-bb94-0ebfb2e94095.html
 
gitana1 said:
Yeah, don't be too alarmed. Those are two possible examples of serious injury. Others could include drowning or drug overdose, etc. What's key is not to forget the language: " shall include but not be limited to".
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Thank you, Git. Now that I'm almost caught up, I understand. I was thinking that maybe the A 4 was referring to a specific sub charge. I'm still confused about the "classes" of the charges. Can you elaborate?
 
matou said:
Davis had previously said that video surveillance from a convenience store showed Noah and his family out on Saturday evening, but that investigators only had the family's statements as corroboration for Sunday's activities.

This makes me think the horror happened on Saturday night. I wonder if Paul was actually at work on Sunday and if he was, how was his demeanor? Did he have a large package with him? I believe murder charges will follow. JMO

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/p...cle_317ae1ed-ccc2-52cc-bb94-0ebfb2e94095.html
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I just posted exactly the same!
 
SStarr33 said:
Explanation of the charges here:

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/p...cle_317ae1ed-ccc2-52cc-bb94-0ebfb2e94095.html
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hmmm Ashley's charges...wonder now if she got pissed off on Sat. Night after they got home and did something to Noah, and the dad covered it up?

Just an observation but wow, the people murdered in these two people's lives...Now I understand some of the comments about a family member murder, but also their friend that introduced the two of them. Just wow.

Not excuses for them whatsoever, but some statements from others ( not here) make sense now.
 
matou said:
Davis had previously said that video surveillance from a convenience store showed Noah and his family out on Saturday evening, but that investigators only had the family's statements as corroboration for Sunday's activities.

This makes me think the horror happened on Saturday night. Party time for the parents? I wonder if Paul was actually at work on Sunday and if he was, how was his demeanor? Did he have a large package with him? I believe murder charges will follow. JMO

http://www.roanoke.com/news/crime/p...cle_317ae1ed-ccc2-52cc-bb94-0ebfb2e94095.html
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I wonder what Noah's demeanor was like Saturday on that surveillance.

And I don't think he made it through Saturday night. I think he was already dead by Sunday :(
 
YidArmyRach said:
I didn't buy the exhausted mum napping from the start. Not when it was reported that she was exhausted from working nights, yet the paper reported that the family were out Saturday night. Firstly, if you were that exhausted that you needed to sleep for hours when solely responsible for looking after 2 children, wouldn't you sleep Saturday night rather than go out? Especially if you had to get up early Sunday morning to drop your partner to work for 7.00am. The whole timeline didn't sound right from the start.

Taken from: http://www.roanoke.com/news/local/p...cle_86971938-fb24-5957-9562-89fb1f087864.html So, not even someone from Dad's place of work could confirm the family dropping him off?

Then there were the clothes - Noah went missing on Sunday morning wearing exactly the same clothes as he had worn on the Saturday night, right down to the coat and boots. Just made me think that Saturday night was the time that was important, not Sunday morning. Yes, children can wear the same clothes two days running, but it just seemed too convenient to me.
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And it was said she worked nights. Noah was at school 5 days a week, so she had the opportunity to get sleep every day he was at school. I'm not buying that she was ever sleep deprived, unless it was under a drug induced stupor. Nope. She wasn't a poor little tired mom.
 
blue22 said:
And it was said she worked nights. Noah was at school 5 days a week, so she had the opportunity to get sleep every day he was at school. I'm not buying that she was ever sleep deprived, unless it was under a drug induced stupor. Nope. She wasn't a poor little tired mom.
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Do we know where either of them worked?
 
LaborDayRN said:
I assume that if there was evidence of drowning, the parents may have tried to spin it as an accident (that he had somehow fallen in). If there is no evidence of drowning, then LE knows someone was trying to hide a body.
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Wouldn't someone have called 911 for accidental drowning? I think drugs were involved, (illegal drug overdose/accident) which would explain (not excuse) the made-up scenario. It truly makes me sick that they could let all those people look for him, all the while knowing he was in that septic tank. They are in major trouble, and forever ostracized wherever they go. Right down there with Casey Anthony. Sickening:(
 
gitana1 said:
Nope. he was placed in there, IMO.



Hmm. Good question. If the abuse led to his death, they could charge them with felony murder and if they charge them with abuse/neglect without charging them with murder, double jeopardy would apply. So it seems that they don't have enough to conclude it is murder, unless they plan to amend the charges before trial.

If that is a possibility, then a smart defense attorney could have them plead guilty to the child abuse/neglect charges without warning, at an arraignment or whatever. That would preclude increasing the charges. So I hope that if they are going to increase the charges they act swiftly.

But we all know the clock starts ticking on speedy trial rights immediately, when a person is charged with murder, which is one reason such charges would not be made immediately. They have them in custody without bond now, so they may be buying themselves more time to solidify the charges, get their ducks in a row regarding evidence, before doing more.

If they had just waited and left the parents free without charging them with anything nor explaining what the case was about, there would've been a huge community uproar. So strategy is certainly at play here.

I am looking for more serious charges.



I think there was a tip.
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There seems to have been no tip. This Sheriff seems pretty blunt and straight forward and for him to publicly deny there was any tip I think is the truth. It may have been a process of elimination. They had looked everywhere but the septic tank.

It seems to have become a tactic lately in some police jurisdictions to file lesser charges on those they suspect are guilty of a higher crime.

I think they did this so that the parents wouldn't be out scott free walking around in the community and meanwhile they will have ample time to await the full AR. I do think they suspect that Noah was drugged and that is why they are waiting for toxicology.

So I full expect for additional charges to be added as soon as they have the AR results along with forensic results they may have also found in the home or around the tank itself.

It will be interesting if murder charges are filed on just his mom and not the father or if they will charge both of them.

I do think this will become a murder case.

IMO
 
No bond cuz they haven't been arraigned yet, right? They should have an arraignment hearing sometime tomorrow - anyone know when?

Sent from my KFTT using Tapatalk
 
oceanblueeyes said:
There seems to have been no tip. This Sheriff seems pretty blunt and straight forward and for him to publicly deny there was any tip I think is the truth. It may have been a process of elimination. They had looked everywhere but the septic tank.
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Could LE have pretended to have had a tip, so the parents didn't suspect they were onto them at that point? Perhaps also to make each parent question if the other one had given something away. If mum and dad were the only ones involved in disposing of poor Noah, then if LE say they received a tip to look there, wouldn't they wonder how anyone else could know. Did they talk about it to each other? House bugged? Maybe the reward was a set up too - to make them suspect that someone would rather have the money than keep quiet?

I guess after 5 days of searching turning up nothing, no witnesses seeing Noah outside and the scent dogs being unable to find any scent leaving the property, the septic tank was the only place Noah could be. But maybe LE didn't want the parents to know they'd worked that out themselves.
 
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