VA - Scott Fricker, 48, & Buckley Kuhn-Fricker, 43, slain, Reston, 22 Dec 2017 *daughter’s bf charged*

[courtney2662]

All you have to do is look at the schools website the kids at that school are sent from their local public school district. It's common for east coast states to do this.

The kids in this school appear to have issues, some might have OCD, etc. and it's easier for them to learn in very small classroom situation - they probably got "lost" in larger classes, weren't learning. I've seen what are reported to be his tweets - and he's not disabled, he's quick to retort, but very misguided, very very angry, bitter, prejudiced, anti-semitic. and sexist - very much in to the neo-nazi sites, most of his twitter if not all, are also neo-nazi.

 

[Jennifer17]

I don't disagree that I'd not want my daughter dating a Nazi sympathizer. I just don't think he killed her parents b/c of some Nazi ideology. I think they were two very troubled kids who were NOT going to be separated. He was there with her for awhile. If the family hadn't heard them, we'd not be here today. Though, we might be here later down the road, if they got caught...

If he was there just to spend time with her, why did he have the gun?

 

[courtney2662]

I don't hyphenate, but, so that folks know who I am, on social media, I use my maiden name, as my middle name. When signing my name, I use my first name, and my spouse's surname.

She has a son from previous relationship who goes by her maiden name Kuhn, which is probably why she used both.

 

[borndem]

As the parent of a kid with 'troubles' - I don't blame the parents - too many times we are singled out by others to be ineffective, weak parents - those who haven't walked in our shoes have absolutely NO idea - I'm much stronger than the average parent. The parent of an average, no issues child has it easy. No idea at all do they understand what we go through. That being said, I know with my son there was another kid in the class with an older brother who burned down their house 3 x (yes 3 times - I'm friends with their insurance agent, they can no longer get homeowners insurance) and killed the neighbor's cat, stuffing him in the neighbor's mailbox. Stay away from those kids at all costs - even though my son was once in that younger boy's class I never let them have a friendship outside of school, ever. I think any kid who idolizes Nazis is a monster. Its called "antisocial personality disorder" - there is no treatment for it, just keep your children and loved ones away from them.

bbm

I know I am very, very fortunate not to have been in your shoes, but looking at this particular case here, I have to sadly but completely agree with your post.

I do wonder when her parents realized that she was developing a relationship with this type of individual. Did it take 6 months for her to make startling remarks about him and begin to talk positively about nazis and negatively about Jewish people? Did she hide it that well? Or did the relationship only get "serious" for only a couple or three weeks before the murderous confrontation? Were her poor parents concerned early but knew or were afraid that "cornering" her on it would only encourage her feelings for him and her estrangement from them? Did the school mention anything about the blooming relationship? Did her parents ask? (please know this is not a slam against the parents, but I do wonder if anything was mentioned about the "boyfriend" by school personnel).

What about his parents? What did they know and were they alarmed, if they did know, that his situation was becoming more radical? Were they afraid of him? Did the school mention anything serious in their conferences about him? His "girlfriend"?

Maybe we will find out.

And kudos to you for somehow figuring out what would work with your situation, and thanks for the info and perspective you've given us.

 

[rsd1200]

Maybe the mother knew more about him than we know. And he pretty much did turn out to be a monster to them.

I just think she went about it wrong, and misjudged her own daughter's capacity to continually disobey her, too. Her daughter had her snowed. I think this was on a path of destruction no matter what the political beliefs of their parents. That's what I'm trying to get across. This is beyond politics. Maybe the parents didn't want to speak because of differences in opinions, but these kids saw something in each other and clicked. No matter how fabulous a person her mother was, and how caring and loving she was, against all of her parent's wishes, she let him inside. She loved him.

 

[courtney2662]

Memorial Service for both Buckley and Scott will be tomorrow, Saturday. News report also says that the police are investigating the "suspect's alleged neo-nazi connections".

https://www.restonnow.com/2017/12/29/memorial-service-set-for-couple-murdered-in-reston/

 

[rsd1200]

If he was there just to spend time with her, why did he have the gun?

We don't know that he didn't pack all the time when he was out of school. I'd really not doubt that he didn't. He may have been there to kill them but it was said he'd been there an hour before they heard anything.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

The kids in this school appear to have issues, some might have OCD, etc. and it's easier for them to learn in very small classroom situation - they probably got "lost" in larger classes, weren't learning. I've seen what are reported to be his tweets - and he's not disabled, he's quick to retort, but very misguided, very very angry, bitter, prejudiced, anti-semitic. and sexist - very much in to the neo-nazi sites, most of his twitter if not all, are also neo-nazi.

Fairfax county has a very good system in place for kids who have mild problems and need some assistance. This is a high income area, the schools are excellent, and the average high school has a couple thousand students. The schools have a *lot* of resources in place for children who need them. The typical child with OCD, Asperger's or high functioning autism, mild anxiety, mild learning disabilities, etc... These kids are *not* pulled out of the campus. There is a very strong focus on giving assistance where needed, in place, so that the children are able to succeed in a normal environment. Heck, the colleges around here have support services for those students who need help.

Dominion is *not* for kids with mild issues. You can't tell from a tweet whether someone has severe emotional or social problems. Dominion requires *daily* counseling, and requires *family* counseling. No one goes through mandatory family counseling unless there are major issues, and kids with some OCD do not get, nor do they need, daily counseling.

My sons have had classmates who are blind, deaf, autistic, wheelchair bound, social anxiety... And those are just the ones I've personally interacted with. The schools are *very* accommodating, they will provide assistants, special classes, will allow a child with mild issues to attend another school in the county if that works better for that child.

Then there are places like the Keller Center, and a few others, where a student with issues can attend half days, or a couple days a week, and stay in their regular school the rest of the time.

There is a strong belief in assisting children to succeed in a normal environment, plus it is far cheaper for the county to use the myriad of on campus public school resources. Getting Fairfax to pay for a private school like Dominion is *not* easy. Fairfax generally will not agree to pay for a non-public placement until every possible public school resource is exhausted, and even then it's a battle to get them to agree to a private special ed school and to get them to pay.

So, yes, as a local with children in the Fairfax schools, and having dealt with some of the above, it is very pertinent that these kids were in Dominion, in terms of understanding them, their family dynamics, and the events leading up to this tragedy.

I'll sit on my hands about the possibility of another person being involved in the way this unfolded, but without a doubt there is a lot more to this situation and the family dynamics (of both families), which we (rightfully) will never be privy to.


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[beandawgs]

Fairfax county has a very good system in place for kids who have mild problems and need some assistance. This is a high income area, the schools are excellent, and the average high school has a couple thousand students. The schools have a *lot* of resources in place for children who need them. The typical child with OCD, Asperger's or high functioning autism, mild anxiety, mild learning disabilities, etc... These kids are *not* pulled out of the campus. There is a very strong focus on giving assistance where needed, in place, so that the children are able to succeed in a normal environment. Heck, the colleges around here have support services for those students who need help.

Dominion is *not* for kids with mild issues. You can't tell from a tweet whether someone has severe emotional or social problems. Dominion requires *daily* counseling, and requires *family* counseling. No one goes through mandatory family counseling unless there are major issues, and kids with some OCD do not get, nor do they need, daily counseling.

My sons have had classmates who are blind, deaf, autistic, wheelchair bound, social anxiety... And those are just the ones I've personally interacted with. The schools are *very* accommodating, they will provide assistants, special classes, will allow a child with mild issues to attend another school in the county if that works better for that child.

Then there are places like the Keller Center, and a few others, where a student with issues can attend half days, or a couple days a week, and stay in their regular school the rest of the time.

There is a strong belief in assisting children to succeed in a normal environment, plus it is far cheaper for the county to use the myriad of on campus public school resources. Getting Fairfax to pay for a private school like Dominion is *not* easy. Fairfax generally will not agree to pay for a non-public placement until every possible public school resource is exhausted, and even then it's a battle to get them to agree to a private special ed school and to get them to pay.

So, yes, as a local with children in the Fairfax schools, and having dealt with some of the above, it is very pertinent that these kids were in Dominion, in terms of understanding them, their family dynamics, and the events leading up to this tragedy.

I'll sit on my hands about the possibility of another person being involved in the way this unfolded, but without a doubt there is a lot more to this situation and the family dynamics (of both families), which we (rightfully) will never be privy to.


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Right on spot - you don't get to a school like Dominion without something very, very serious happening. I think the original poster "Courtney" doesn't understand Sped- the law requires children to be educated in the least restrictive environment - every opportunity to be educated at your home school has to be exhausted and then some. To get an out of district private placement is very difficult. Very.

 

[borndem]

Thanks for bringing forward your earlier post.

Just such a horrible, horrible thing... The 10 yo boy, the other relatives in the house... No one should see their loved ones die like that. So many lives ruined.

I hope they are able to get the right counseling. They'll need PTSD therapy, as well as grief therapy, probably meds. Our family experienced a traumatic event, and we had a terrible time finding the right people to help us. There's not a lot of therapists doing good trauma/PTSD work.

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You make good points -- experience can be a tuff teacher. I'm very sad & sorry that you and your family had to experience a traumatic event, and I'm glad you all survived together.

How many nightmares has that 10-year-old already had? Are/were he and his sister close? Is he afraid to even go to sleep at night? And whether she was angry at her parents or not that night, she will never forget the sight of them being shot dead and bleeding on the floor, or wherever they where, and the sounds of it all. The funeral. The clean-up. And the place where it happened. And the guilt. Yes, serious counseling for how long -- months? Years? And who will stay & take care of them? Will she return to TDS? Detectives. Investigators. Affidavits.

And if the boyfriend recovers, and if he recovers with his mental faculties intact, I assume he will be arrested and jailed and then all that legal "stuff" will begin to happen. She will probably wonder if people are talking about her and looking at her in a different way. Paranoia. Anger. Grief. The flight instinct. Blame. Guilt. Wanting to be anywhere else. I can't begin to imagine.

Does she even know how she really feels about it all? Does she still "love" him? She needs to be closely watched for her own safety, self harm, IMO -- what kinds of thoughts is she having about it all?

Enuff. Please excuse the ramble.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

Here's a court case where the parents failed in their suit to force FCPS to reimburse them for Dominion.

https://law.justia.com/cases/federal/district-courts/FSupp/960/89/1458354/


And an example of the high quality support that the district provides...

https://www.fcps.edu/mentalhealthwellnessconference



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[strawberry]

Yes, I wondered when I read the obituary if the donation was a noble nod to their killer’s problems. Now that we know more about their daughter, it makes even more sense.

Same


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[Gardenista]

The kids in this school appear to have issues, some might have OCD, etc. and it's easier for them to learn in very small classroom situation - they probably got "lost" in larger classes, weren't learning. I've seen what are reported to be his tweets - and he's not disabled, he's quick to retort, but very misguided, very very angry, bitter, prejudiced, anti-semitic. and sexist - very much in to the neo-nazi sites, most of his twitter if not all, are also neo-nazi.

Can you give the link to his twitter please?

 

[courtney2662]

Fairfax county has a very good system in place for kids who have mild problems and need some assistance. This is a high income area, the schools are excellent, and the average high school has a couple thousand students. The schools have a *lot* of resources in place for children who need them. The typical child with OCD, Asperger's or high functioning autism, mild anxiety, mild learning disabilities, etc... These kids are *not* pulled out of the campus. There is a very strong focus on giving assistance where needed, in place, so that the children are able to succeed in a normal environment. Heck, the colleges around here have support services for those students who need help.

Dominion is *not* for kids with mild issues. You can't tell from a tweet whether someone has severe emotional or social problems. Dominion requires *daily* counseling, and requires *family* counseling. No one goes through mandatory family counseling unless there are major issues, and kids with some OCD do not get, nor do they need, daily counseling.

My sons have had classmates who are blind, deaf, autistic, wheelchair bound, social anxiety... And those are just the ones I've personally interacted with. The schools are *very* accommodating, they will provide assistants, special classes, will allow a child with mild issues to attend another school in the county if that works better for that child.

Then there are places like the Keller Center, and a few others, where a student with issues can attend half days, or a couple days a week, and stay in their regular school the rest of the time.

There is a strong belief in assisting children to succeed in a normal environment, plus it is far cheaper for the county to use the myriad of on campus public school resources. Getting Fairfax to pay for a private school like Dominion is *not* easy. Fairfax generally will not agree to pay for a non-public placement until every possible public school resource is exhausted, and even then it's a battle to get them to agree to a private special ed school and to get them to pay.

So, yes, as a local with children in the Fairfax schools, and having dealt with some of the above, it is very pertinent that these kids were in Dominion, in terms of understanding them, their family dynamics, and the events leading up to this tragedy.

I'll sit on my hands about the possibility of another person being involved in the way this unfolded, but without a doubt there is a lot more to this situation and the family dynamics (of both families), which we (rightfully) will never be privy to.


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Same here in NY, many accommodations are made in the public school system in order to mainstream as many students as possible. I don't know of any private school the state will pay for, leaving it to parents to pay if they wish to not avail themselves of public schools.

I have no doubt that the local LE are doing thorough investigation on this, checking all avenues, all of the tech equipment, emails, social media accounts etc. to ensure that any others who may have been involved, even peripherally, will receive justice.

 

[borndem]

Fairfax county has a very good system in place for kids who have mild problems and need some assistance.

>>>> respectfully snipped to save space <<<<

Dominion is *not* for kids with mild issues. You can't tell from a tweet whether someone has severe emotional or social problems. Dominion requires *daily* counseling, and requires *family* counseling. No one goes through mandatory family counseling unless there are major issues, and kids with some OCD do not get, nor do they need, daily counseling.

>>>> respectfully snipped to save space <<<<

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Thanks button not enuff -- thanks for the very informative post!

 

[courtney2662]

Can you give the link to his twitter please?

[FONT=&quot]https://twitter.com/AsherLangton/status/945502068277698561[/FONT]

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

You make good points -- experience can be a tuff teacher. I'm very sad & sorry that you and your family had to experience a traumatic event, and I'm glad you all survived together.

How many nightmares has that 10-year-old already had? Are/were he and his sister close? Is he afraid to even go to sleep at night? And whether she was angry at her parents or not that night, she will never forget the sight of them being shot dead and bleeding on the floor, or wherever they where, and the sounds of it all. The funeral. The clean-up. And the place where it happened. And the guilt. Yes, serious counseling for how long -- months? Years? And who will stay & take care of them? Will she return to TDS? Detectives. Investigators. Affidavits.

And if the boyfriend recovers, and if he recovers with his mental faculties intact, I assume he will be arrested and jailed and then all that legal "stuff" will begin to happen. She will probably wonder if people are talking about her and looking at her in a different way. Paranoia. Anger. Grief. The flight instinct. Blame. Guilt. Wanting to be anywhere else. I can't begin to imagine.

Does she even know how she really feels about it all? Does she still "love" him? She needs to be closely watched for her own safety, self harm, IMO -- what kinds of thoughts is she having about it all?

Enuff. Please excuse the ramble.

Thank you, and yes, agree, all of the above. My teenage sons would not sleep alone for months, and years later we still have meds, counseling, PTSD. And we had good trauma therapy. What those families are going through is undescribably horrific. And all the treatments, therapy, meds, etc, doesn't *really* help, it just allows you to function. And none of it is cheap.

They are all destroyed, both families. Holidays, especially Christmas, will be a struggle. The 10 yo will grow up without experiencing another normal Christmas. I'd be surprised if any of the adults ever even put up a Christmas tree again.

The girl... I can't even imagine. And so much depends on what her "issues" were. Why was she letting him in, and getting caught, rather than sneaking out of the house to meet him? Are there relatives capable of handling her, especially now? Will her issues get worse? How will she get past this? Was an ODD issue part of this whole mess, and if so how will that impact her recovery from this?

The boy has at least one sibling as well. More trauma, more lives destroyed.

Both families are going through unbelievable, indescribable pain, and that pain won't go away for years, if ever.

I don't care what any of them believed, whether they were right, left, pastafarians, druids, none of that matters. Dying for your beliefs sounds noble, but I've been through trauma, I've seen my children's lives destroyed, the effects of trauma, and the pain that is always there. Dying for my beliefs, at the expense of my children? No, never. It is not worth it. Not at the expense of my children. The trauma and pain that little boy is going through, my god, he's the one that is paying for this, the grandparents, the other siblings, the boy's family. They're paying every day of their lives from now on for the actions of a screwed up boy and all the adults who failed him. I'm including his parents in those adults, as well as the school because they certainly dropped the ball, and, yes, the woman who had her own experiences with her own disturbed daughter and knew the boy had severe problems and chose to take an aggressive and confrontational approach. Any of these adults could have chosen a different course of action and at a minimum prevented this tragedy, and perhaps could have moderated the boy's violent tendencies and beliefs and changed the course of his life.

I hurt for them all.

Especially the little boy, who every Christmas will have to see his friends and classmates getting excited about the holiday, talking about their presents, while he will always associate Christmas with his parents horrific deaths and will remember being led out of the house screaming.

<Sigh>

I'm sorry, I'm obviously identifying a bit too much with this case.

I really hope his name is reported in MSM soon.

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[Lilibet]

Thank you, and yes, agree, all of the above. My teenage sons would not sleep alone for months, and years later we still have meds, counseling, PTSD. And we had good trauma therapy. What those families are going through is undescribably horrific. And all the treatments, therapy, meds, etc, doesn't *really* help, it just allows you to function. And none of it is cheap.

They are all destroyed, both families. Holidays, especially Christmas, will be a struggle. The 10 yo will grow up without experiencing another normal Christmas. I'd be surprised if any of the adults ever even put up a Christmas tree again.

The girl... I can't even imagine. And so much depends on what her "issues" were. Why was she letting him in, and getting caught, rather than sneaking out of the house to meet him? Are there relatives capable of handling her, especially now? Will her issues get worse? How will she get past this? Was an ODD issue part of this whole mess, and if so how will that impact her recovery from this?

The boy has at least one sibling as well. More trauma, more lives destroyed.

Both families are going through unbelievable, indescribable pain, and that pain won't go away for years, if ever.

I don't care what any of them believed, whether they were right, left, pastafarians, druids, none of that matters. Dying for your beliefs sounds noble, but I've been through trauma, I've seen my children's lives destroyed, the effects of trauma, and the pain that is always there. Dying for my beliefs, at the expense of my children? No, never. It is not worth it. Not at the expense of my children. The trauma and pain that little boy is going through, my god, he's the one that is paying for this, the grandparents, the other siblings, the boy's family. They're paying every day of their lives from now on for the actions of a screwed up boy and all the adults who failed him. I'm including his parents in those adults, as well as the school because they certainly dropped the ball, and, yes, the woman who had her own experiences with her own disturbed daughter and knew the boy had severe problems and chose to take an aggressive and confrontational approach. Any of these adults could have chosen a different course of action and at a minimum prevented this tragedy, and perhaps could have moderated the boy's violent tendencies and beliefs and changed the course of his life.

I hurt for them all.

Especially the little boy, who every Christmas will have to see his friends and classmates getting excited about the holiday, talking about their presents, while he will always associate Christmas with his parents horrific deaths and will remember being led out of the house screaming.

<Sigh>

I'm sorry, I'm obviously identifying a bit too much with this case.

I really hope his name is reported in MSM soon.

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Hugs for what you and your family went through and for your compassion and clear thinking about these families. :heartbeat:

 

[courtney2662]

Thank you, and yes, agree, all of the above. My teenage sons would not sleep alone for months, and years later we still have meds, counseling, PTSD. And we had good trauma therapy. What those families are going through is undescribably horrific. And all the treatments, therapy, meds, etc, doesn't *really* help, it just allows you to function. And none of it is cheap.

They are all destroyed, both families. Holidays, especially Christmas, will be a struggle. The 10 yo will grow up without experiencing another normal Christmas. I'd be surprised if any of the adults ever even put up a Christmas tree again.

The girl... I can't even imagine. And so much depends on what her "issues" were. Why was she letting him in, and getting caught, rather than sneaking out of the house to meet him? Are there relatives capable of handling her, especially now? Will her issues get worse? How will she get past this? Was an ODD issue part of this whole mess, and if so how will that impact her recovery from this?

The boy has at least one sibling as well. More trauma, more lives destroyed.

Both families are going through unbelievable, indescribable pain, and that pain won't go away for years, if ever.

I don't care what any of them believed, whether they were right, left, pastafarians, druids, none of that matters. Dying for your beliefs sounds noble, but I've been through trauma, I've seen my children's lives destroyed, the effects of trauma, and the pain that is always there. Dying for my beliefs, at the expense of my children? No, never. It is not worth it. Not at the expense of my children. The trauma and pain that little boy is going through, my god, he's the one that is paying for this, the grandparents, the other siblings, the boy's family. They're paying every day of their lives from now on for the actions of a screwed up boy and all the adults who failed him. I'm including his parents in those adults, as well as the school because they certainly dropped the ball, and, yes, the woman who had her own experiences with her own disturbed daughter and knew the boy had severe problems and chose to take an aggressive and confrontational approach. Any of these adults could have chosen a different course of action and at a minimum prevented this tragedy, and perhaps could have moderated the boy's violent tendencies and beliefs and changed the course of his life.

I hurt for them all.

Especially the little boy, who every Christmas will have to see his friends and classmates getting excited about the holiday, talking about their presents, while he will always associate Christmas with his parents horrific deaths and will remember being led out of the house screaming.

<Sigh>

I'm sorry, I'm obviously identifying a bit too much with this case.

I really hope his name is reported in MSM soon.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

I am so sorry for what you and your children have been through, and hope your continued path to better place is working, giving you all some level of peace and healing. I couldn't agree more that all those survivors have to be going through horrendous pain, and terror, haven't even contemplated their losses. Life as they knew it is gone, and a new world faces them, they're going to need tremendous support going forward. I think nobody ever looks at someone they love, especially their child, and wonders if they could commit a crime so violent as this. His parents very well may have thought that the girl's parents were way over-reacting, over-thinking it. Both families have such a difficult path ahead of them, just to survive the coming days, weeks, months. If there is to be a trial, that to will have to be borne. I hope they all receive the help and support they need.

 

[rsd1200]

Thank you, and yes, agree, all of the above. My teenage sons would not sleep alone for months, and years later we still have meds, counseling, PTSD. And we had good trauma therapy. What those families are going through is undescribably horrific. And all the treatments, therapy, meds, etc, doesn't *really* help, it just allows you to function. And none of it is cheap.

They are all destroyed, both families. Holidays, especially Christmas, will be a struggle. The 10 yo will grow up without experiencing another normal Christmas. I'd be surprised if any of the adults ever even put up a Christmas tree again.

The girl... I can't even imagine. And so much depends on what her "issues" were. Why was she letting him in, and getting caught, rather than sneaking out of the house to meet him? Are there relatives capable of handling her, especially now? Will her issues get worse? How will she get past this? Was an ODD issue part of this whole mess, and if so how will that impact her recovery from this?

The boy has at least one sibling as well. More trauma, more lives destroyed.

Both families are going through unbelievable, indescribable pain, and that pain won't go away for years, if ever.

I don't care what any of them believed, whether they were right, left, pastafarians, druids, none of that matters. Dying for your beliefs sounds noble, but I've been through trauma, I've seen my children's lives destroyed, the effects of trauma, and the pain that is always there. Dying for my beliefs, at the expense of my children? No, never. It is not worth it. Not at the expense of my children. The trauma and pain that little boy is going through, my god, he's the one that is paying for this, the grandparents, the other siblings, the boy's family. They're paying every day of their lives from now on for the actions of a screwed up boy and all the adults who failed him. I'm including his parents in those adults, as well as the school because they certainly dropped the ball, and, yes, the woman who had her own experiences with her own disturbed daughter and knew the boy had severe problems and chose to take an aggressive and confrontational approach. Any of these adults could have chosen a different course of action and at a minimum prevented this tragedy, and perhaps could have moderated the boy's violent tendencies and beliefs and changed the course of his life.

I hurt for them all.

Especially the little boy, who every Christmas will have to see his friends and classmates getting excited about the holiday, talking about their presents, while he will always associate Christmas with his parents horrific deaths and will remember being led out of the house screaming.

<Sigh>

I'm sorry, I'm obviously identifying a bit too much with this case.

I really hope his name is reported in MSM soon.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Tapatalk

I feel for them all too, and for you and your family. The younger siblings, of both families, have likely had to live in homes, that were very tense at times, with their brother, and sister, living there.

These had to be some very difficult to handle teens, but also pre-teens, and, possibly from early childhood, if they did have ODD, and we don't know that, but, if if one or both did, that's a tough diag. I know.

"Oppositional Defiant Disorder-The War At Home " reprinted with permission from Empowering Parents, by James Lehman, MSW
http://www.freeprintablebehaviorcharts.com/odd.htm