**Verdict Watch** 3-2-2012; deliberations started at 1016am

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't follow your logic. Certainly highway mpg is better than city, but the numbers still don't add up. I'm actually quite impressed with the 20mpg. I once owned a 2005 Explorer and never averaged close to that. I agree with you though, I hope there are smart people on jury.

My husband has always been a "Ford Man" and he has never had a truck that got 20 MPG....not even on the road and he keeps his vehicle well maintained.

IMO

 

[jrb0124]

This would go to the 2nd degree idea, but it cancels out a lot of the pros. case-in-chief and my theory that it was assisted/accompliced.

My theory too. IMO, the accomplice(s) theory with JY coming to check things out after the fact is a better fit for the evidence and testimony than both the State and DT theories:

Gracie accurate (check)
CB & FH accurate (check) - accomplice(s) returning CY? "fixing crime scene"?
time frame of trips back and forth to HI with only a brief stop back in Raleigh (check)
size 12 HP Shoeprint is JY (check)
size 10 Franklin accomplice (check)
CY not identifying other doll as "Daddy" (check)
No evidence in JY car (check) - probably plenty in accomplice car
CY taken away and cleaned up outside the house, then returned (check)
Cameras messed with (check)
$4m insurance payout (check) - more than enough to share w/accomplice(s)

The issue for the State would be tying in the vehicle seen at 5:20 (occupied) and 6:15 (unoccupied) with JY and the murder - but given the linkage of coincidence they are asking for with the just JY theory, I don't see a difference. In fact with the accomplice theory, CB & FH would fit right in.

 

[cody100]

Keep in mind that the trip from Raleigh to the Hampton Inn is virtually ALL FREEWAY. Average miles per gallon was not the right measurement to use (although, I see why they did use it), as this wasn't an "average" trip - this trip as 98% freeway. The fuel efficiency driving the freeway is much better than just average - it would have been at the maximum fuel efficiency. You can go 20 miles on the freeway and your "miles to empty tank" is only reduced 10 miles in that distance.

Hopefully, the jurors are smart enough to realize that "average" miles per gallon was not the right measure. Certainly, if there are any engineers on the jury, they will know this.

The highway mileage for 2004 ford explorers was listed at 20 mpg. That is the best mileage. Perhaps someone can find a better mileage for highway somewhere.

 

[fifteen89]

Sometimes murderers do get off, so there's no reason for JY to give up hope yet. It is possible he covered his tracks just enough...

Still, though he can have some hope, he's got to be worried the jury will see through all the lies and, if they aren't the kind to think every prosecution is a crusade against an innocent man, then he may not get away with it after all.

I hope not.

I was thinking this morning it would be interesting to play jurors and go through the circumstantial evidence and write next to each item the explanation(s) from the opposing side. Would be interesting to see how it all looks to us when written in black and white.....and to see how much you have to accept to get to each verdict.

 

[Stella5]

At "this" trial... he was really emphasizing the this, when addressing that JY did not testify at "this" trial.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I think the PT should have addressed the issue about the mileage instead of saying they werent going to get into that.

IMO

 

[fifteen89]

If that were true though, it still doesn't support 2nd degree. There's no way he drove back 2.5 hours and killed her and its 2nd degree. If you plan the murder even for a moment it is 1st degree. The only way it is 2nd degree is if he came back to argue and it got out of hand. That's the only way 2nd degree would have worked in the BC case.

I can't see any scenario that is 2nd degree. I agree with the defense it is 1st degree or nothing. Also, the PT pitched that as well, since they again focused on the planning.

If JY came back to argue, there wouldn't have been the door propping etc. Guilty doesn't make sense unless it is 1st degree, to me.

That 2.5 hour drive says it all, doesn't it.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

At "this" trial... he was really emphasizing the this, when addressing that JY did not testify at "this" trial.

That caused me to be a little uncomfortable, Stella, because the Judge is going to tell the jury that they cannot hold it against JY because he did not testify.

IMO

 

[fifteen89]

The more Collins played that VM to the home on 11-3, the more the jury was able to hear it was an obvious alibi cover. "Hey, this is Jay"...rattled off several details he wanted the cops to hear. It was really creepy to hear, knowing he just slaughtered his wife hours earlier.

Like the 911 calls that say "I just got home, I was at walmart shopping and we stopped for dinner, we got home about 30 minutes ago and the back door is wide open and there's stuff strewn all over the house, oh, and my spouse is bleeding in the bedroom....."

Talk about burying the lead.

 

[Stella5]

That caused me to be a little uncomfortable, Stella, because the Judge is going to tell the jury that they cannot hold it against JY because he did not testify.

IMO

He's addressing that now... I think he was emphasizing to relay that it cannot be held against him. Not that he's guilty because he didn't. They know he did testify since the PT played it. IMO if I were a juror it wouldn't bother me that he did not testify, as that is his protected right.

Dang... hailing again! Hopefully my connection remains up!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

He's addressing that now... I think he was emphasizing to relay that it cannot be held against him. Not that he's guilty because he didn't. They know he did testify since the PT played it. IMO if I were a juror it wouldn't bother me that he did not testify, as that is his protected right.

Dang... hailing again! Hopefully my connection remains up!

OMG...please stay safe Stella. We are supposed to have severe thunderstorms today too.

IMO

 

[traveler]

Cut and Paste from Dmaxphil
"6) If he makes trip in 2.5 hours, JY had 1 hour to strangle and beat MY to death, tear apart closets, throw around ebay and progress papers, grab jewelry, put CY in bathroom, probably get dog out of the way, change clothes, bag all dirty items, clean CY, drug CY, tie up loose ends at scene, and discard dirty clothes somewhere between Raleigh & Hillsville."

If he leaves Hillsville at midnight - he arrives at 2:30am. He has until 4 am to make it back and push up the camera in hotel at 6:30 am, IMO.

 

[Stella5]

OMG...please stay safe Stella. We are supposed to have severe thunderstorms today too.

IMO

Thanks, this has been going on since 4:30 a.m. and will continue throughout the day ... I'm kinda done with it. Just praying it doesn't damage our roof again. And hoping the doggie downers kick in so my neurotic dog will pass out, instead of freaking out & peeing on my floor!

You stay safe too! This weather has been NUTS! It is still winter!

 

[fifteen89]

Just like athletes get stronger and faster, criminals can get smarter. I cannot wrap my head around all the smart criminals (i.e. the ones who are aware of hard physical evidence vs. CE) receiving a free pass...in effect, being rewarded. As criminals get smarter, juries must too.

Yeah. It's feels like almost giving them a silver star and saying 'go on, take what you've learned here and try to do better if there's a next time and we'll give you a gold star next time'. The dots aren't hard to connect. The image in the puzzle is more than there. imo

 

[~n/t~]

:rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose: :rose:

 

[terminatrixator]

Having condoms in his luggage can be argued both for the prosecution and defense, imo.

Prosecution: He had no love for Michelle and was only interested in other women. Michelle being pregnant and perhaps a divorce in the near future and having to support her and 2 children goes towards motive. In addition, there was the insurance. 2 million, I believe.

Defense: Proves JY planned on having sex with other women on the road like he's done many times before. He had no plans on murdering his wife. You can say he's a jerk, cheater, but not a murderer.

It could also mean he wasn't going to be going back home and he felt the condoms were more important to him than his wife and unborn son that he just bludgeoned. Maybe he thought he would get some sympathy sex after everyone found out his wife was murdered and he wanted to prepare in advance.

 

[raisincharlie]

At "this" trial... he was really emphasizing the this, when addressing that JY did not testify at "this" trial.

A little twist on this, JMO the mere fact that JY chose not to testify at this trial, after hearing Ms. Holt point out that his only statements about the entire crime came after he had access to all the evidence, certainly would make me wonder as a juror why he couldn't bother to testify again. I know the judge says it can't be held against him, but a reasonable human is still going to wonder why. Seems to be a glaring issue to me, rightly or wrongly.

 

[Just the Fax]

Yep, based on the evidence and using common sense, it is their duty to return a verdict of 1st degree murder.

 

[pjcitizen]

Just like athletes get stronger and faster, criminals can get smarter. I cannot wrap my head around all the smart criminals (i.e. the ones who are aware of hard physical evidence vs. CE) receiving a free pass...in effect, being rewarded. As criminals get smarter, juries must too.

Great thought. It's easy to use a surveillance video of a crime or a bloody fingerprint to find guilt or innocence. The hard part is using the old noggin for logical inferences made from all of the CE and/or DE.

 

[CarolinaMoon]

They CAN use his prior testimony to determine his truthfulness. PT did poke holes in it.