Victim - Melissa Barthelemy

[fieldnotes]

@Fieldnotes

Sorry to take this a bit OT for a moment ... do you happen to know if the Gilberts visited CPH in the morning or afternoon of Mothers Day, May 9. I'm just curious as it relates to CPH's admitted 12:06 pm call to SG's sister on that date. Thanks !!

I don't know. Why what's your thought ??

 

[Sillybilly]

I don't know. Why what's your thought ??

Just that .. If they were there in the morning, he could have been provided the sister's number by the sister or family member. IF they didn't arrive until afternoon, then how did he have the sister's phone number before having met them? IMO, CPH just seems to skip over that rather lightly in his letters to 48 Hrs

Sorry, this should be in the SG thread, but I saw you here

 

[fieldnotes]

Just that .. If they were there in the morning, he could have been provided the sister's number by the sister or family member. IF they didn't arrive until afternoon, then how did he have the sister's phone number before having met them? IMO, CPH just seems to skip over that rather lightly in his letters to 48 Hrs

Sorry, this should be in the SG thread, but I saw you here

I see what you're saying. But again I don't know. I haven't heard much of a fuss about it so I guess I kinda assume he got the number from Alex and MP and/or the sister called him first that day to let him know they had arrived in OB and he called it back. But this is purely speculation on my part. Again, if there was something suspicious about him having it and calling it I would assume it would have been brought up IMO.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I know the difference between masochists and sadists Peter, but does it not occur to you that we could possibly be dealing with a sadomasochist here?

Well, if there would be a thing like a sadomasochist, i.e someone who at the same time wants to cause pain and receive pain AND would be at the same time dominant and submissive, it would probably easier occur to me.

 

[Peter Brendt]

I'm not convinced LE has used all the available resources and I feel like the FBI and Homeland Security should have taken more of a lead role from the start due to their expertise in surveillance technology. Here is a question I have - have they utilized "tower dumps" and cross referenced the results using computer software? In other words, if the LISK used a disposable phone there is a possibility that his regular "real world" registered cell phone was with him and turned on and would be pinging and showing up in the tower dumps. If it shows up more than once - BINGO!! The problem is as far as I've come to know the cell carriers only keep these tower records for a finite period of time and it would have had to be done right away. But there are multiple instances where tower dump data should have been mined IMO. Including when MBB's phone pinged on OP. But I'm no expert in this area whatsoever so if anyone can add something please do.

Honestly? Those guys were not even able to pull some traffic cam tapes before they expired. What makes you think, they got tower dumps before the data was deleted?
I mean, yep, you're entirely right and the way, you describe it, would be like an intelligent person would do it, but then, that is exactly the poitn, where you overestimate SCPD.

 

[Sillybilly]

Well, if there would be a thing like a sadomasochist, i.e someone who at the same time wants to cause pain and receive pain AND would be at the same time dominant and submissive, it would probably easier occur to me.

Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Sadomasocism is a combination of both ... "in particular the deriving of pleasure, especially sexual gratification, from inflicting or submitting to physical or emotional abuse".

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sadomasochism

sadomasochism
Psychiatry. a condition of disturbed and destructive personality marked by the presence of both sadistic and masochistic traits. — sado-masochist, n. — sadomasochistic, adj.

 

[LINative13]

How about they trace the phone calls to ambers phone? Find out where that phone was bought. Even if you buy a burner you have to fill out some kind of documentation (even if you put a fake name and address) then you will have a hand writing sample as well. Possibly a photo of the buyer from the stores camera? (which I doubt by now).

 

[waltson]

:rocker:

How about they trace the phone calls to ambers phone? Find out where that phone was bought. Even if you buy a burner you have to fill out some kind of documentation (even if you put a fake name and address) then you will have a hand writing sample as well. Possibly a photo of the buyer from the stores camera? (which I doubt by now).

SK surely sends someone to buy the phones for him

 

[LINative13]

Then you get him.....and up the ladder.

 

[Peter Brendt]

Just because you don't know about it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
Sadomasocism is a combination of both ... "in particular the deriving of pleasure, especially sexual gratification, from inflicting or submitting to physical or emotional abuse".

http://www.thefreedictionary.com/sadomasochism

If you would have read the complete article, you linked, you would may have figured out, that "sadomasochism" is a rather generic term for both, "sadism" and "masochism". As the article points out, some of the practitioners consider themselves to be something of a "switch" when interviewed, but in reality this doesn't work, because the role of the sadist is a dominant one and the role of a masochist a submissive one and since it's entirely impossible to be both at once, such a switch can be only forced by circumstances and is temporary and thus not touching the orientation. So please, read the article you linked completely, before telling me, what I allegedly don't know.

 

[Sillybilly]

If you would have read the complete article, you linked, you would may have figured out, that "sadomasochism" is a rather generic term for both, "sadism" and "masochism". As the article points out, some of the practitioners consider themselves to be something of a "switch" when interviewed, but in reality this doesn't work, because the role of the sadist is a dominant one and the role of a masochist a submissive one and since it's entirely impossible to be both at once, such a switch can be only forced by circumstances and is temporary and thus not touching the orientation. So please, read the article you linked completely, before telling me, what I allegedly don't know.

<bbm>

Don't know what article you are referring to. I provided the definition in response to your statement "if there would be a thing like a sadomasochist". The definition was to substantiate that the combination of sado and maso does exist, not necessarily that both dominant and submissive exist at precisely the same time in the same individual.

With all due respect Peter ... regardless of what the practitioners themselves say in describing themselves as "switchable" (without any indication from them of timeframes involved, i.e. 5 seconds/minutes/days etc), you then conclude that "in reality this doesn't work" because it's impossible to be both at once. I didn't claim the traits exist both at once, but IMO, the term switchable certainly indicates both traits occur, not necessarily simultaneously, but certainly within the same individual.

WRT your statement that sadomasochism is a generic term, you are right ... but it is also used to define those individuals who possess both the dominant and submissive traits.

 

[Peter Brendt]

<bbm>

Don't know what article you are referring to. I provided the definition in response to your statement "if there would be a thing like a sadomasochist". The definition was to substantiate that the combination of sado and maso does exist, not necessarily that both dominant and submissive exist at precisely the same time in the same individual.

With all due respect Peter ... regardless of what the practitioners themselves say in describing themselves as "switchable" (without any indication from them of timeframes involved, i.e. 5 seconds/minutes/days etc), you then conclude that "in reality this doesn't work" because it's impossible to be both at once. I didn't claim the traits exist both at once, but IMO, the term switchable certainly indicates both traits occur, not necessarily simultaneously, but certainly within the same individual.

WRT your statement that sadomasochism is a generic term, you are right ... but it is also used to define those individuals who possess both the dominant and submissive traits.

There is light and there is darkness. Often you can combine those terms under "illumination". Still, the term "illumination" doesn't mean it's bright and dark at the same time. Generic term.
And the article you posted was the Wikipedia article.

However, as Fran posted in the other thread, this is all opinion and therefore there is no need to discuss anymore.

 

[Just K]

If J Terry lived with MB, where was he in the days after MB went missing. Why is it that MB's landlord was alerted to something being wrong because MB's many cats were crying and scratching at the door of her basement apartment?

 

[Theforeigner]

If J Terry lived with MB, where was he in the days after MB went missing. Why is it that MB's landlord was alerted to something being wrong because MB's many cats were crying and scratching at the door of her basement apartment?

I´m pretty sure they did NOT share that appartement.

And you are right about the cats issue.

 

[Just K]

I´m pretty sure they did NOT share that appartement.

And you are right about the cats issue.

So, if he didn't share the apartment with her, then why would he feel it was significant enough to add that she did not tell him where she was going?

 

[Theforeigner]

ABOUT THE LISK in a July 13, 2011 newsreport :

"Barthelemy's then fifteen-year-old sister received a call from the killer while he had been using Barthelemy's cell phone.
Reports stated that he spoke softly, comfortably, and in a controlled manner.


ABOUT MY POI in a November 27, 2006 newsreport:"Xxxxxxxxx, smoking a cigar, shook Sliwa's hand
and spoke softly."



Add to that:

ABOUT THE LISK

Here are two different quotes from newsreports concerning where LE traced some of the calls the LISK made to Melissa Barthelemy's sister:

"The phones were tapped after the third call to places near Times Square, Port Authority, and the Empire State building."

"Investigators traced two of the calls to Manhattan near Madison Square Garden and Times Square"



ABOUT MY POI

My POI have posted facebook profile pictures, within the last 12 months from:

1. Empire State building

2. Madison Square Garden

So...My POI choose, even though he live in a different state than NY, to use two photos from two of the location that police have stated that they traced the Serial Killer's phone calls to Melissa Barthelemy's sister.
(My POI is origianlly from NY area (Brooklyn), and there has been several reports that he live there from time to time, he also have lots of friends and family on Long island)

 

[PreciousDust]

So...My POI choose, even though he live in a different state than NY

He does? What state?

 

[Emre E]

Theforeigner,

As far as I can see the shortest window for attack is in the Waterman case. (It's a Sunday) I'm running through the posts and Internet to narrow down Maureen's time of abduction, (Though we can ask Meltruth to give her own opinion) and it seems that Maureen was attacked on a Sunday.

Sunday seems like to apply for Melissa as well.

When it comes to Amber, things go hazy as Dave Schaller is. Actually, I'm not sure if DS got everything straight in his mind, including the no phone on Amber. (I actually think that we might be looking at several red herrings including the no phone issue and the burlaps)

She may have worked a few days out on her own. (Not studied that in detail) So perhaps Sunday applies for her too.

Do the above tell anything for you? (Personally, I'm not seeing anything worthy to discuss in detail about Sundays) But may be you can have some insight.

 

[Sillybilly]

As far as I can see the shortest window for attack is in the Waterman case. (It's a Sunday) I'm running through the posts and Internet to narrow down Maureen's time of abduction, (Though we can ask Meltruth to give her own opinion) and it seems that Maureen was attacked on a Sunday.

Sunday seems like to apply for Melissa as well.

<rsbm>

From an old post of mine with the days of the week ... i still find this interesting:

MBB - Monday 7/9/2007 (summer vacation)
MB - Sunday 7/12/2009 (summer vacation)
SG - Saturday 5/1/2010 (weekend)
MW - Sunday 6/6/2010 (weekend)
ALC - Thursday 9/2/2010 (weekday prior to start of school)

from:
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - NY-LI 10 bodies found on Beach-Poss. SrlKlr-12/10-4 id'd; more found 3/11 #7


Summer holidays and weekends ... am still thinking possibly teacher when I consider the dates.

 

[Theforeigner]

He does? What state?

He lives, most of the time he claims, in FL.
But he also:
From a April 6, 2011 newsreport:
"During the time of the Long Island and Atlantic City murders Xxxxxxxxx was traveling up and down the east coast looking for work as a carpenter, he said."

And FYI; He moved from FL to AC in 2003, was listed to an address there, but when he moved from AC I don´t know.

It has also been stated, by by familymembers of his, that he had a construction biz on LI.