VT VT - Brianna Maitland, 17, Montgomery, 19 March 2004

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Was catching up on MM's thread and thought of BM. In reading the past few threads, it strikes me that it seems like BM's case is similar to Holly Bobo's if the theory that she was held against her will is correct
 
UCLAEigenguy said:
I've seen it mentioned once, and only once, that a coworker was seen at the driver side window talking to Brianna before she drove off. He could have given her a drink (doubtful), could have planned to meet her later, or could have ended up riding in the car with her. There is some skepticism among readers of that blog about how the coworkers seemed so positive they saw her get in her car and drive home; it isn't something that is usually noticed so adamantly. In most cases, something like this would be implied: "I didn't see her get in her car but I imagine she went home since that's what she said."
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If she was sick, perhaps it was morning sickness. If she was visibly upset about something, perhaps she had told the person who got her pregnant and he didn't take it well. Numerous men have killed women in order to avoid paying child support. That's just one scenario.

I actually think Ramon Ryans killed her. Maybe he was motivated by lust. Maybe someone else put him up to it. As a non-local, he probably would have sought help for disposing of her body.
 
:welcome:

Welcome to Ws. Lisaj007!
 
Furthermore, I believe Brianna may have been given something (some type of drug) which may have rendered her immobile relitavely quickly and possibly produced vomit (whilst still in her car before being moved or manhandled into the other car). She may have snorted or drank something they provided her thinking it was something else. This would have prevented her from struggling too much during transportation. I believe she was eventually killed many miles away from the abduction site, I do not believe she survived, sadly. Did I read somewhere lime was found on her car? This could have been used to disguise the taste of Ghb (for example), in a beer bottle or other alcohol beverage or water bottle. Any bottles found at the scene needed testing for any substances, I'm unsure this was done. I definitely feel she was drugged.
 
Mari2013 said:
Another thought I've had about this case relates to the paychecks on the seat. What if Brianna DID owe someone money? I don't really care about the reason except that I think if it was owed for drugs, this would make more sense because of the type of people she would have been dealing with.
So, say she does owe money, and she was being hassled for it? What would she have told the dealer? "My payday is on March 19, and I can give you the money then."
So maybe the person she owes sees her at the mall and reminds her, and this is why she's suddenly upset or agitated and needs to get ready for work so quickly, so she can get to work, get her checks, get them cashed, or whatever. Maybe she's running behind, so maybe she thinks she could show the dealer the checks to prove that she can get the money quickly, or thinks she can just give the checks to the dealer. We all know dealers don't take checks, so this could have led to a conflict, especially if the dealer was riding her hard to get the debt settled THAT DAY.
When I think about something like this happening, I am not judging Brianna. I couldn't care less what she owed money for, if she even did, but her naivete could have gotten her in trouble thinking she could "show" that she's "good for it."
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I thought that was the generally accepted theory. She went to the Dutchburn barn to meet someone for drugs. Or met someone in a car outside the barn. She refused to pay, or owed money and refused to pay. People chased her. She got in her car, but because of the adrenaline and the darkness, I think she hit reverse instead of drive, so her car backed up into the barn and she was stuck. The car wouldn't move.
 
the main question i have is, how they got into the car. She backed into the barn, and no doubt they surrounded the car. But, the windows aren't broken, so how did they get her?

My assumption is that she rushed to get into the car to escape, and didnt have time to lock the door. Or left one of the other doors unlocked.
 
heresjohnny said:
the main question i have is, how they got into the car. She backed into the barn, and no doubt they surrounded the car. But, the windows aren't broken, so how did they get her?

My assumption is that she rushed to get into the car to escape, and didnt have time to lock the door. Or left one of the other doors unlocked.
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There's so many scenarios that could've happened. Just off the top of my head at the moment, a few possibilities come to mind:
- She was chased (or ran) back to her car to try to drive away but before she could get anywhere someone/they opened her door, possibly causing her to throw the gear into reverse in the process.
- She could've been chased off the road by another car, hit an ice patch and slid backwards into the barn. The car could've gotten stuck and while trying to maneuver it or rock it out sent it further backwards hitting the barn.
- And if she had gotten stuck, or the car was malfunctioning in some way, perhaps she put on the cars' hazards (and only one was in working order?) and then set out on foot to try to hitchhike back into town or home, and in doing so was spotted and picked up by someone/people who had it out for her.
Remember her boyfriend (I'm a little rusty on the details as it's been a long time, so correct me if I'm wrong about it being her BF or her ex-be or whatever) did say he saw her car that night while he was driving past the barn, and in such a small, unpopulated area, this is likely one of the main roads that most everyone drives on at one time or another during a 24-hour period.... However, I've always thought it rather uncanny that her BF didn't stop to see if she was by her car or not, or at least stop to take a look at the car to see if there was something amiss. But maybe he just thought he'd see her walking further down the road or he, himself had been drinking etc and didn't want to draw any attention to himself by getting out and risk being caught with a DUI..... All said, it still strikes me as peculiar, and a bit too coincidental.
Just thinking out loud and throwing out ideas.


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I still think about this case and hope they find answers. I wish the Vermont PD would reach out to the Cold Justice team. I would love to see them rattle some cages.
 
The people she was associating with must have gone in and out of prison in these past ten years. Is there really no way to cut any of these guys a deal in exchange for the truth of what happened that night? Are they really all as tight as they were ten years ago? No falling outs or anything? I doubt it. I think the police know exactly who did it but because they have no body they are not able to make an arrest. This is one of the reasons I am so baffled as to why many people think that this case and the Maura Murray just have to be related. It's rather clear to me that the police don't consider the Maitland case to be a mystery - they have rather good idea as to what happened to her.
 
Oh man, I just had a creepy dream about this last night.

I only vaguely have heard of the Brianna case. Today is the first day when I really looked into the details.

Last night I had a dream that I went out in search of a girl named Brianna. I didn't really make the connection becuase I follow a girl on Tumblr named Brianna so I only assumed I was dreaming about her. I don't know any other Brianna in real life. In the dream, I traced her to some underground lair chained up. The people who had kidnapped her sold her to some monsters that lived underground. The monsters could only be described as a mix of zombies and surreal abominations. I carried her on my back and snuck out, but on my way out the ground opened up and hundreds of hands tried to stop me. I realized that they were dead victims of the monsters. They asked me to save them but I apologized and said I had to leave.

I later reunited Brianna with an ex-boyfriend. The funny thing is that after I woke up and thought about this dream, I knew that the only Brianna I knew of from Tumblr never had a boyfriend. But now I read Brianna Maitland's case for the first time and read that she had an ex-boyfriend, who is mentioned in the case as having noticed Brianna's vehicle - which is super creepy.

Maybe I've been watching too much Twin Peaks lately.

The Ceaser's Atlantic City "sighting" gave me chills. I go there frequently since I live in NJ. Granted I was only like 16 at the time of the supposed sighting. Had I been the one who thought that was her, I would have pretended to be drunk or something and asked if she was the missing person Brianna.

I just realized though that it was most likely not Brianna. You need to be 21 to gamble in NJ casinos. She would have only been 19 at the time.

Unless she had access to a really good fake ID.
 
Mari2013 said:
Another thought I've had about this case relates to the paychecks on the seat. What if Brianna DID owe someone money? I don't really care about the reason except that I think if it was owed for drugs, this would make more sense because of the type of people she would have been dealing with.
So, say she does owe money, and she was being hassled for it? What would she have told the dealer? "My payday is on March 19, and I can give you the money then."
So maybe the person she owes sees her at the mall and reminds her, and this is why she's suddenly upset or agitated and needs to get ready for work so quickly, so she can get to work, get her checks, get them cashed, or whatever. Maybe she's running behind, so maybe she thinks she could show the dealer the checks to prove that she can get the money quickly, or thinks she can just give the checks to the dealer. We all know dealers don't take checks, so this could have led to a conflict, especially if the dealer was riding her hard to get the debt settled THAT DAY.
When I think about something like this happening, I am not judging Brianna. I couldn't care less what she owed money for, if she even did, but her naivete could have gotten her in trouble thinking she could "show" that she's "good for it."
Click to expand...

Funny...I read the whole thread to see if someone would focus on the paychecks. SPEC: Doesn't it seem a little strange someone would have a couple paychecks lying around at midnight in plain view in their car, considering the other circumstances in play? To me, it weakens the whole 'voluntary disappearance' angle. Even though it does look like BM had something of a self-storage approach to her vehicle (food and other items in the back), the checks lying out seems irregular - why not stuff them in a glovebox, if storing for future handling? This wasn't a first week at a first job - she wouldn't have been "admiring" them. Point being - my theory is yours: they were out for a reason - and the reason was to buy time on a debt. And the offer wasn't accepted.

Some other ideas:
-->It was interesting the narco players at the 'drug farm' all stipulated to knowing her. FACT: "Low" Jackson was an associate of hers - having been introduced to her housemate, Jillian Stout and the Stout father (according the Slam Dunk blog) prior to the disappearance. SPEC: the Stout dad being part of it makes the involvement seem more extensive than a quick 'oh hey man...and meet my friend Jillian", as at a party. It would seem more plausible Low came over. Only point is to infer she knew at least some of them pretty well.
-->SPEC: Maybe she had a surprise passenger waiting for her at Black Lantern, but the passenger wasn't hidden. Maybe she didn't feel highly threatened at the time and was guided to the Dutchburn location. It's a bit of a stretch, but a passenger quietly waiting for her could have gone unnoticed by colleagues and BM wouldn't have raised a commotion. Also plausibly links back to shopping trip with Mom - maybe a "creditor" found her and demanded immediate payment...she is guided or self-directed to DB.
-->SPEC: Things are quiet once they arrive at Dutchburn. Could explain headlights on. Covered space on other side of house could have housed another vehicle with lights off, not highly visible. The parties talk for a while. When it drags on, she is ordered to shut off vehicle and turn lights off, and complies. She tries checks, but gets rejected. Threats start to get scary - maybe "other ways" to pay debt. She panics, tries to bail, but accidentally throws it into R, or maybe other hands grip controls...in car &/or thru the door - backs right up from edge of the road, crashes into house, hard enough to put it on the frame and disable the car, blinker on from struggle. She's pulled out. It's a physical struggle, with change falling out, necklace is pulled off and broken...into the other car. Someone has sense to come back, pull her keys, which stops blinker. Vehicle #2 leaves.

What bothers me...if any of theorized timeline is right...do they have physical evidence from the vehicle, or the Dutchburn location? Chain of custody problems?
 
Oh, I had a thought about the paychecks before but forgot but now I remember.

Does anyone know if they were direct deposit?

If they were direct deposit, then they were just statements and there was nothing the supposed perpetrator could do about them. We are also assuming BM left the paychecks lying around. What if she didn't? What if the perp snatched them, realized they were direct deposit, and just threw them back in?

Another question: Was the Dutchburn barn in the direction of her living quarters or not? Just a slim chance here but let's say that the barn is in the completely opposite direction of going back home - then she definitely met up with someone at a prearranged time and place. If not, it's possible then that she could have been surprise-attacked. Someone maybe knew her schedule and stopped her in the middle of the road.

If we assume someone hid in her car theory, let's say she realized someone was there, screamed and backed up into the barn. The crash could have shocked them for several minutes, which would explain the number of people that passing by and seeing the headlights still on and a turn signal on. They could have been in shock from the crash and recovered minutes later. Maybe BM even suffered some whiplash. It wouldn't have been enough to seriously injure either of them since there's no blood - but that doesn't mean they didn't suffer any physical trauma.
 
ScottyMcGee said:
Another question: Was the Dutchburn barn in the direction of her living quarters or not? Just a slim chance here but let's say that the barn is in the completely opposite direction of going back home - then she definitely met up with someone at a prearranged time and place. If not, it's possible then that she could have been surprise-attacked. Someone maybe knew her schedule and stopped her in the middle of the road.
Click to expand...

Yes, it is in the same direction as her going home.
 
ScottyMcGee said:
Oh, I had a thought about the paychecks before but forgot but now I remember.

Does anyone know if they were direct deposit?

If they were direct deposit, then they were just statements and there was nothing the supposed perpetrator could do about them. We are also assuming BM left the paychecks lying around. What if she didn't? What if the perp snatched them, realized they were direct deposit, and just threw them back in?

Another question: Was the Dutchburn barn in the direction of her living quarters or not? Just a slim chance here but let's say that the barn is in the completely opposite direction of going back home - then she definitely met up with someone at a prearranged time and place. If not, it's possible then that she could have been surprise-attacked. Someone maybe knew her schedule and stopped her in the middle of the road.

If we assume someone hid in her car theory, let's say she realized someone was there, screamed and backed up into the barn. The crash could have shocked them for several minutes, which would explain the number of people that passing by and seeing the headlights still on and a turn signal on. They could have been in shock from the crash and recovered minutes later. Maybe BM even suffered some whiplash. It wouldn't have been enough to seriously injure either of them since there's no blood - but that doesn't mean they didn't suffer any physical trauma.
Click to expand...

I am as far from expert as possible - I have no qualifications to analyze...but I did read this whole thread and "case file", so I'll take a stab at your questions:

Question #1: The Slam Dunk blog refers to them as "uncashed paychecks" - could be author's 'literary liberties', but that's what it says.
Question #2: Answer is yes, it was in the direction of her living quarters. By the facts, the Dutchburn location is on the 118, northwest of where the Blank Lantern Inn was. BM was living in Sheldon, VT, with JS and father (which is west of Montgomery as crow flies, NW then W by road). The 118N heading in that direction looks like a natural route to the 105W, which would have taken her to Sheldon (as her note indicated was her plan). The Dutchburn structure can be found easily online. The address is approx. 3400 N. Main St., Montgomery, VT. As of May, 2012, the building was still there (and viewable today in a GMap).

Now, my totally unqualified speculation.
SPEC: I believe I read the "hid-in-car" theory has been somewhat debunked, as it would infer some level of premeditation/preparation to exit the scene. Likely outcomes would have included her car disappearing along with BM, or a second actor to transport the stowaway. I think the premeditation thought was raised to respond to idea it was random, but also begs the question - if not random, why hide? Calling someone in would not be implausible, but I believe there have been statements about poor cell phone reception there (to bring someone in) and difficulty of the short timeline to bring in another actor and leave undetected.
SPEC: Not sure about "stun" angle, as I don't remember seeing that type of crime scene evidence discussed...I wonder how much they even marked wheel movement, speed, trajectory, etc. But a benchmark of damage to both car and structure wouldn't lead you to believe it was that forceful...when baselined to equate force of impact with level of harm to occupants.
 
How much did BM make at the inn? She worked dishes, right? I can't imagine it's a lot of money. Assuming BM was in some sort of money deal, maybe that's why the suspect didn't take the checks, because they were petty cash, too low to really be worth anything. Even if it was like $20 or something, the suspect figured they shouldn't take them because then investigators would realize this could be money-related. Leave the money there - it raises more questions.
 
Hi everyone, I'm new here.

I won't give out any private information about myself but I will say that I have been looking at this case personally and closely for the past 6 months or so. This all happened close to where I live so it really hit home. If anybody knows ANYTHING that could help me in my research, no matter how trivial the tip may be, please contact me here in PM. I'm an independent investigative reporter, I love information, I feed on that. This is not a joke, I really have been working on this case, I have some information and I think I can find further information needed to figure out what happened to Brianna and who is responsible. If someone should choose to contact me, rest assured that your information will remain secret and confidential based on the reporter's privilege law (the law about the protection of sources).

I hope to hear from you guys soon, please don't hesitate to get in touch with me. Any tip or information at this point is welcomed.
 
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