WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #6

[Calliope]

Calliope I am borrowing your link on body float information for another thread, great find.

Thanks. I found it on another forum, not related to this case.

 

[AmandaReckonwith]

http://s296.photobucket.com/albums/mm166/crankycrankerson/Shantina%20Smiley%20-%20Azriel%20Carver/

The archive album has about as much as I can find, until Shantina is found.

Going by the water temp chart, she should have surfaced. It has been 26 days.
Unless she is caught up in branches or something.

 

[houndstooth]

Was due diligence done in searching for her? I really don't understand why when Az was found that the search for her ended. I think there is much more to come. There is no one on this forum at the moment but me. I trust that there is a search going on still but it is not for a body at this point.

I've read that something like 50,000 to 100,000 people go missing in the U.S. in any given year. That it is very hard to calculate because of the varied circumstances that people of all age ranges and backgrounds go unaccounted for. Will she fall between the cracks?

 

[RubyRed]

Yes, the Shantina thread has become very quiet.

 

[gibby207]

I'm from WA and I think she's in the Sound. There's my answer.

 

[Jani]

I'm from WA and I think she's in the Sound. There's my answer.

I'm from WA and that's my answer, too.

 

[yosande]

Right: Their scent was never found, leading a reasonable person to surmise that someone was with them.

LE said they found no footprints, which also makes no sense, unless they are discounting the homeowners, and any family, friends, or business people who could have left footprints, but whatever....

In any case, my suggestion is that if there is no evidence that anyone knocked on the house, as the homeowners heard, does LE think they imagined it, or called in false information? Is it also possible someone threw 4 rocks at the house to make it sound like someone was knocking 4 times?

just wondering......

 

[yosande]

Right, in my past work as a news reporter, most interviews are conducted via phone. I think the Chief Criminal deputy has really turned the case, perhaps without knowing it, or at least without much fanfare....For me, in my unprofessional opinion (as I am merely a writer; I claim to nothing else ) everything hinges on this new clarity about the items not washing but depositing (as in dropping?) at this location 50-60 yards down the incline of the Grimmer house which reported the 1 am banging on the side of the house (a rural home on NE Island View Drive)---this so, so puts to rest the sleeping and swept away by high tide scenario, and makes me envision a chase down the beach on foot, during some kind of confrontation with a third party--I don't know why, but this really "turned a key" for me, in my own thinking....

imo, smk, one would not gather the articles, aside from perhaps the inhaler though no meds were found, and carry them down the beach, if one was being chased.

However, it does makes sense that one might drop some of the items, like the wine, not the inhaler or the plastic ball, to head up the steep steps.

jmo

 

[fullofsecrets]

it's been mentioned before in earlier threads that it was super windy that night and there is a chance that the banging was tree branches knocking against the house. on the other hand, soft earth and rain could have made any footprints difficult to see or wash them away...

I too find it odd that the water search/anysearching for SS has seemingly ceased. It is a long time to just wait around and hope she surfaces.

 

[elf69]

Was due diligence done in searching for her? I really don't understand why when Az was found that the search for her ended. I think there is much more to come. There is no one on this forum at the moment but me. I trust that there is a search going on still but it is not for a body at this point.

I've read that something like 50,000 to 100,000 people go missing in the U.S. in any given year. That it is very hard to calculate because of the varied circumstances that people of all age ranges and backgrounds go unaccounted for. Will she fall between the cracks?

I don't believe due diligence was used in searching for her. There have been extensive searches coordinated by volunteers of other missing persons but not for Shantina. I find that odd. And, my personal opinion is that she is still alive.

 

[PaulR]

imo, smk, one would not gather the articles, aside from perhaps the inhaler though no meds were found, and carry them down the beach, if one was being chased.

However, it does makes sense that one might drop some of the items, like the wine, not the inhaler or the plastic ball, to head up the steep steps.

jmo

Why would they carry a plastic ball with them?

Inhaler? Sure. But a ball? Not to mention the wine.

 

[yosande]

There were reports of videos showing her passing through this market both to and from the Williams'.

Does anyone know if she is able to be seen in both videos, or just her van, ie, could someone else have been driving it at that time, and wanting it to be captured on video? I'm not saying that happened, I just keep wondering is all...

 

[spiral]

Does anyone know if she is able to be seen in both videos, or just her van, ie, could someone else have been driving it at that time, and wanting it to be captured on video? I'm not saying that happened, I just keep wondering is all...

I don't know, but that's a good question. I also wonder if LE looked at video footage from the Gull Harbor Mercantile earlier that evening -- from the time she could have arrived in the Olympia area. It's possible she drove out there before, and someone could also have been with her.

 

[spiral]

I don't believe due diligence was used in searching for her. There have been extensive searches coordinated by volunteers of other missing persons but not for Shantina. I find that odd. And, my personal opinion is that she is still alive.

I agree. I had hoped for a more thorough canvassing of the surrounding area and of Boston Harbor. Someone could have seen something that night/morning. Imo, there were relatively few local news reports. Many locals I've talked to had not even heard of this case, which is concerning to me.

I have not seen any fliers posted in the Olympia area, and I travel the area daily and frequent a number of businesses, office buildings, etc. If fliers have been posted here, there were/are not enough ~ jmo

 

[yosande]

Why would they carry a plastic ball with them?

Inhaler? Sure. But a ball? Not to mention the wine.

Why would an 8 year old boy not carry a ball with him, especially a light weight plastic ball?

The steps are steep, so drop the heavier stuff, keep the lightweight stuff, and the medical stuff, of course.

Men might not drop any of it, but a woman would seriously reconsider what is worth the journey up a steep flight of stairs.

So, stumbling upon the steps, and taking a step or two, SS discovers it's going to be a steep climb, it's late, they're tired, so, what are we carrying with us, what do we need, what can we let go of;

drop the baseball, keep the light weight plasitc one, drop the wine, hold onto the inhaler for sure.

jmo, of course.

Regardless, my original post on this subject to smk was to point out that most of these items would not have been gathered to take with them if they were being chased in the first place, except for the inhaler, jmo, but if they weren't being chased, an 8 year old boy would take the baseball and the plastic ball.

however, imo, those items were likely placed there for staging purposes to cause LE to think they went up those stairs, the knocking on the house leading them in that direction. Finding Aziel very likely clears the stairs as the obvious route they might have taken that night, at least Aziel's route. moo

 

[yosande]

I agree. I had hoped for a more thorough canvassing of the surrounding area and of Boston Harbor. Someone could have seen something that night/morning. Imo, there were relatively few local news reports. Many locals I've talked to had not even heard of this case, which is concerning to me.

I have not seen any fliers posted in the Olympia area, and I travel the area daily and frequent a number of businesses, office buildings, etc. If fliers have been posted here, there were/are not enough ~ jmo

I find this information very disturbing

 

[yosande]

I don't believe due diligence was used in searching for her. There have been extensive searches coordinated by volunteers of other missing persons but not for Shantina. I find that odd. And, my personal opinion is that she is still alive.

Due to the insane amount of negative publicity toward SS, ie, csd reports, differing statements about her possible relapse (from the same person, though stating he hadn't actually seen her drink) though he may not have trying to put her in a negative light, plus the video purchase of wine, and finally the pic from LE of the wine bottle, and statement it was half gone, I don't find it all that odd, though I do find it disturbing. The fb comments posted make clear that, except for two, friends and family do not think SS would harm AC regardless of her state of mind, Of the two that might differ, one is a JC family member, and borders on being hostile, and the other, an SS relative, offers SS unconditional acceptance.

Imo, information lacks clarity as to whether she was reaching out to peeps she hadn't had contact with for years, or if the relationships were ongoing albeit distant. If she was reestablishing contact with others, there is some concern in my mind as to her mental health, if she was suicidal, and clearing up past ties, forgiving, and seeking forgiveness. It is unclear to me as to whether she had been in the Castle Rock area two weeks previous, and/or had an ongoing though distant relationship with her exhusband, or other old friends from that area.

Also, imo, information lacks clarity as to whether she was suffering from some sort of depression, which might have led her to suicidal thoughts, ie, it has been said she was taking anti anxiety medication, though none was found in the van, or on the beach, and since she hasn't been found, it can't be confirmed via tox reports. No doctor has come forth confirming a prescription.

There appears to be no reason for her to be anxious, as RS hadn't gotten word that he was horribly sick, nor has it been confirmed from friends or family that they had set a near date for a wedding, so anxiety at that point in time appears premature, imo.

Imo, though alcoholics do relapse, those who do choose to abstain, usually are committed to their choice, and are aware of the suffering that was caused by their drinking, and years into recovery, with a bright future ahead, though not a sudden one, as she had steadily worked toward, and she was continuing to work toward it getting brighter and brighter, from what we have heard. Therefore, it appears to me anyway fwiw, there is no reason for her to take a sudden nose dive.

I'm not discounting RS's possible negative diagnosis, but I did read on her myspace, iirc, that she herself had suffered a possible cancer scare two years previous, which tests came back negative, so imo, she had a rational reasonable ability to hold off jumping to devastating conclusions before the test results were back.

There is a possibilty im my mind, that b/c she left her cell phone at home, his charger was not found in the van, nor has her overnight bag been found, and d/t the final resting place of the van, that she might have been attempting to escape her relationship with RS. There seems to me little other explanation for her behavior that night with the lack of clarity of information as stated above, therefore, I too think it's possible that she is still alive.

I seriously considered that her behavior may have been d/t ingesting antianxiety meds, one dose at a time, as that would account for the long lapses in time between stores. Antianxiety meds such as Ativan for instance might make her drowsy, so she might have stopped to rest, fall asleep for a short time, wake up to coninue her journey, become distressed again d/t being lost, take another dose, not realizing that she was increasing her toxicity level with each new dose, which also increased her becoming disoriented, which in turn increased her anxiety, thus cycling into the the darkness that they found themselves in. This would also explain her drowisness at the diner, and her falling down. The main problem with this theory is the stop at the Williams' home, where she was able to cognitively remember ther grandparents phone number, whether that was the folks in Brinnon, or Castle Rock, idk, and tell them she was lost, had had an accident of sorts, but was ok, and would soon reach her destination, though I have no idea why she would feel, think, or say that since she had been lost for hours at that point. Clarity as to who exactly she called from that home would be extremely helpful imo, and what exactly she said, from their perspective only.

The accident of sorts is baffling to me, and I have as yet read or heard any reasonable explanation as to what she meant by that, with the one exception of the possibility that she was referring to a possible alcohol consumption that night. I personally have no reason to think she relapsed before that night, as imo, RS may have been attempting to explain away the video of her purchase that night, thus hoping to save her reputation, though this is of course pure speculation on my part, but is a reasonable explanation to consider, d/t his fear of where she might be, and if she was alive, his hope that the negative publicity would not hinder her coming home, or calling, though hope would have been dimmed after Az was found, I'm sure.

All this is moo.

 

[SMK]

imo, smk, one would not gather the articles, aside from perhaps the inhaler though no meds were found, and carry them down the beach, if one was being chased.

However, it does makes sense that one might drop some of the items, like the wine, not the inhaler or the plastic ball, to head up the steep steps.

jmo

I guess you have a good point there. I was buying into the account that I had read, in which the idea that these items were being used as throwing objects, to ward off an attacker. (Running away from someone, and hurling the bottle of wine, the shoe, etc.). I suppose reading this account left that impression in my mind.

 

[SMK]

LE said they found no footprints, which also makes no sense, unless they are discounting the homeowners, and any family, friends, or business people who could have left footprints, but whatever....

In any case, my suggestion is that if there is no evidence that anyone knocked on the house, as the homeowners heard, does LE think they imagined it, or called in false information? Is it also possible someone threw 4 rocks at the house to make it sound like someone was knocking 4 times?

just wondering......

I agree, this has never made sense to me: No scent, no footprints, so what did LE conclude, then?

 

[SMK]

Why would they carry a plastic ball with them?

Inhaler? Sure. But a ball? Not to mention the wine.

I think I imagined that those items were in a bag: And then, if a confrontation and a chase ensued , the child may have hurled some of the items in desperation. (One does tend to throw things if one is being chased; as a child, I would do this even if it was fun chasing, to be tickled, etc.) But then, I got this idea from reading someone's theory, and it sort of "stuck". Also, if those items were "left" there to give the impression they went up the stairs (as someone suggested) why would they feel all of those items should be left???