WA WA - Shantina Smiley, 29, & Azriel Carver, 8 (fnd deceased), Olympia, Mar 2010 - #7

['Ailina]

Occurred to me last night...what if...

Shantina & Azriel fell asleep in the van. Later, one of them wakens to find the van partially submerged. In a panic, Shantina opens all the doors so they can escape, but in doing so, water rushes in and sweeps Azriel away.

It's dark. She can't see her son in the water, but she frantically dives in after him to try to retrieve him. Maybe she's in the water for a long length of time trying to find him. Maybe her search takes her down the shore. She's unsuccessful.

In a further panic, she runs to the nearest house and bangs on the outside. She gets no response, so she runs back to the water to search for him in the dark.

Maybe she reenters the water and is swept away herself. Maybe she decides to drown herself once she realizes her son is gone. Maybe she develops hypothermia while she's in the water looking for him and succumbs herself.

Possible...

 

[SMK]

snipped:


I also cannot go with the idea that she ever meant to cause harm to her son. To be the den mother of A's cub scout group was a big commitment that she really seemed to want to do and enjoyed doing. So much you read points to her loving her son very much. In fact, so much also points to her just being very happy with her life, period, that I have a really hard time wrapping my mind around the idea that she could have been wanting to meet up with someone else or running from RS.

Of course, all I really know of SS is what I have learned about her through the media or reading this forum. So I'm sure I do not really have a complete picture of the person SS was.

I think I have just gotten far too obsessed about this case, where I am feeling like I "know" SS, and have become protective of her...Is this crazy of me??

No, not crazy at all. Certain people seem to touch us in a profound way, and SS and Az were such people. I have been obsessed with this case from the get go, and it is very unlike me ( I usually do not become too drawn in, and I have never posted on this kind of forum before). What bothers me, is the fear that the case will go "cold". I was just reading about the case years ago, in the 1980s, where those 2 girls got jealous of their highschool friend and killed her in the woods. For 3 years, there were no leads, no clues, and it was only when another girl came forward that it was solved. Had she not, it would have stayed cold forever. LE cannot work miracles, they can only go on what they have. Wish there were a break in this case. It is needed.....

 

[SMK]

Occurred to me last night...what if...

Shantina & Azriel fell asleep in the van. Later, one of them wakens to find the van partially submerged. In a panic, Shantina opens all the doors so they can escape, but in doing so, water rushes in and sweeps Azriel away.

It's dark. She can't see her son in the water, but she frantically dives in after him to try to retrieve him. Maybe she's in the water for a long length of time trying to find him. Maybe her search takes her down the shore. She's unsuccessful.

In a further panic, she runs to the nearest house and bangs on the outside. She gets no response, so she runs back to the water to search for him in the dark.

Maybe she reenters the water and is swept away herself. Maybe she decides to drown herself once she realizes her son is gone. Maybe she develops hypothermia while she's in the water looking for him and succumbs herself.

Possible...

Yes, quite possible. I had really envisioned this exact scenario, almost to a tee, in the beginning. Then, with Chief Chamberlain making the comments about the objects being carried, I began to think foul play. Now I think maybe a combo of both???:waitasec:

 

[Calliope]

I still think it would be a good idea for the family to get some volunteers together and search that uninhabited island across the passage from where the van was abandoned. It's just slightly north of the beach, and Azriel's body traveled north. With the currents described as "turbulent" it's entirely possible she ended up there.

 

[SMK]

Occurred to me last night...what if...

Shantina & Azriel fell asleep in the van. Later, one of them wakens to find the van partially submerged. In a panic, Shantina opens all the doors so they can escape, but in doing so, water rushes in and sweeps Azriel away.

It's dark. She can't see her son in the water, but she frantically dives in after him to try to retrieve him. Maybe she's in the water for a long length of time trying to find him. Maybe her search takes her down the shore. She's unsuccessful.

In a further panic, she runs to the nearest house and bangs on the outside. She gets no response, so she runs back to the water to search for him in the dark.

Maybe she reenters the water and is swept away herself. Maybe she decides to drown herself once she realizes her son is gone. Maybe she develops hypothermia while she's in the water looking for him and succumbs herself.

Possible...

I still think it would be a good idea for the family to get some volunteers together and search that uninhabited island across the passage from where the van was abandoned. It's just slightly north of the beach, and Azriel's body traveled north. With the currents described as "turbulent" it's entirely possible she ended up there.

Oh, wish someone could do this....

 

[powayparent]

Yes, quite possible. I had really envisioned this exact scenario, almost to a tee, in the beginning. Then, with Chief Chamberlain making the comments about the objects being carried, I began to think foul play. Now I think maybe a combo of both???:waitasec:

I don't think she'd be able to open the front doors if the water level was high enough to sweep away a 100 lb child. I think the water level rose, one or the other woke up, they exited the van in water that was 1-2 feet deep, one or both got disoriented and ended up in deeper water and they drowned.

 

[LCoastMom]

Heartbreaking....my prayers are with RS and his children. The death of Azriel must be difficult enough, but in some ways, not knowing what happened to SS has to be even harder. I hope someday they have some answers (and some closure).

I can't imagine the pain of never knowing. My imagination would keep getting the best of me and I'd end up sitting in a corner, banging my head to knock out the horrible images...

Good to hear, it seems like he's pressuring LE for answers!! I pray he continues until they find her so that family can have closure and finally learn what happened that night

He needs to keep it up. I hope LE listens to whatever possibilities exist. That post of the person at MIchelleS who believed s/he saw her, made sense until they made it sound like they stared a hole in her head for quite sometime, followed her to the RR more than once then waited until later to call LE... But have there been any other possible sightings?

Yes, I too wonder about this backpack this new article speaks of.

How did they ascertain that there indeed was a backpack--was one found nearby along with the items? Or was one missing from the home?

If they are right that they had been in a backpack, why wouldn't the items have been found still intact inside the pack? Backpacks are generally kept zipped, aren't they?

Then again, if it is so that the orange ball had been loose on the van's floor for a while, how does that necessarily rule out that it wasn't picked up by AC and put in a backpack or pocket.

When on a road trip without all their usual toys, kids will sometimes play with things they normally would pay no attention to, out of boredom and necessity, don't you think?

Just my thoughts.

Maybe that's what she was doing when they came out of HP and she opened the front passenger door and was messing with something on the floor.


That picture of Az looks more like K or 1st grader to me, do we have a date on it? Those kiddie back packs are cute but it is my experience with all three of my kids they seldom make it thru a school year intact.

The ball on the floor washing out in the tide makes sense. A wine bottle and a back pack, (and not the wallet) do not. I wouldn't have even been surprised if the base ball came from their van too, dropped by a friend or on a cub scout outing - left under a seat or something. But all of the pieces were found in the same-ish place, how? Why would he take a ball out of the car in the dark of the night, one that had been left behind in the car?

 

[LCoastMom]

Occurred to me last night...what if...

Shantina & Azriel fell asleep in the van. Later, one of them wakens to find the van partially submerged. In a panic, Shantina opens all the doors so they can escape, but in doing so, water rushes in and sweeps Azriel away.

It's dark. She can't see her son in the water, but she frantically dives in after him to try to retrieve him. Maybe she's in the water for a long length of time trying to find him. Maybe her search takes her down the shore. She's unsuccessful.

In a further panic, she runs to the nearest house and bangs on the outside. She gets no response, so she runs back to the water to search for him in the dark.

Maybe she reenters the water and is swept away herself. Maybe she decides to drown herself once she realizes her son is gone. Maybe she develops hypothermia while she's in the water looking for him and succumbs herself.

Possible...

This is good, but in the dark she wouldn't have known where he went, he could have just been pulled away from the car but ended up further down the beach. She couldn't have seen what direction he went in. She wouldn't have known for sure he drowned in that dark of night with no moon - unless she knew he drowned

Wouldn't a panicking mother mother scream her lungs out? Especially if she went up to a house and pounded on the door BANG, BANG, BANG, BANG... then the lights came on. Why not go towards the light????

Did they say they turned on the lights when they looked out the front door?

 

[Jules71]

He needs to keep it up. I hope LE listens to whatever possibilities exist. That post of the person at MIchelleS who believed s/he saw her, made sense until they made it sound like they stared a hole in her head for quite sometime, followed her to the RR more than once then waited until later to call LE... But have there been any other possible sightings?

What possible sighting - I must have missed this. Do you have a link?

 

[LCoastMom]

Oh, wish someone could do this....

How many WS do we have in the area?We have been involved with searches (unofficially) in the past. I wonder if anyone in the family has notified a group like TES?

 

[Jules71]

I don't think she'd be able to open the front doors if the water level was high enough to sweep away a 100 lb child. I think the water level rose, one or the other woke up, they exited the van in water that was 1-2 feet deep, one or both got disoriented and ended up in deeper water and they drowned.

I don't think the front doors were open. I think the side sliding door and the back hatch were open. That makes me think they were opened when the tide was in - otherwise, why wouldn't the front driver's side door be open?

 

[SMK]

What possible sighting - I must have missed this. Do you have a link?

DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH CREDENCE I GIVE THIS.......
http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/
Curious says:
April 3, 2010 at 12:15 pm
I wasn’t going to post this, but since her body still has not reappeared I will share. About two weeks after this story hit the news I was out with a friend during happy hour at a local establishment which is at a marina. I contacted the detective working the case as I felt strongly that I had seen this woman. I was so sure It was her I followed her to the restroom on one of the many occasions she got up to go to the restroom. While standing at one point behind this woman in the restroom I observed a tattoo on the back of her neck. I observed this woman as she sat in the lower part of the seating area where my friend and I sat. She was with a young guy they seemed very somber and sad, pretty down and yet intense. My friend said she thought she heard them say they were breaking up, nonetheless I couldnt help but stare at this woman as she was the identical twin of the woman on the news….. I described the tattoo nearly identical to that of the missing woman, however detectives do not seem to be following this tip from what I can tell. I do feel this situation was staged. Why were they both wearing red that night? was it so they were certain to be seen on surveilance? HMMM I really hope some closure comes soon.

 

[Jules71]

DO NOT KNOW HOW MUCH CREDENCE I GIVE THIS.......
http://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/
Curious says:
April 3, 2010 at 12:15 pm
I wasn’t going to post this, but since her body still has not reappeared I will share. About two weeks after this story hit the news I was out with a friend during happy hour at a local establishment which is at a marina. I contacted the detective working the case as I felt strongly that I had seen this woman. I was so sure It was her I followed her to the restroom on one of the many occasions she got up to go to the restroom. While standing at one point behind this woman in the restroom I observed a tattoo on the back of her neck. I observed this woman as she sat in the lower part of the seating area where my friend and I sat. She was with a young guy they seemed very somber and sad, pretty down and yet intense. My friend said she thought she heard them say they were breaking up, nonetheless I couldnt help but stare at this woman as she was the identical twin of the woman on the news….. I described the tattoo nearly identical to that of the missing woman, however detectives do not seem to be following this tip from what I can tell. I do feel this situation was staged. Why were they both wearing red that night? was it so they were certain to be seen on surveilance? HMMM I really hope some closure comes soon.

Very interesting.

 

[LCoastMom]

What possible sighting - I must have missed this. Do you have a link?

ttp://www.michellesigona.com/2010/03/shantina-smiley-still-missing-remembering-azriel/

snipped

About two weeks after this story hit the news I was out with a friend during happy hour at a local establishment which is at a marina. I contacted the detective working the case as I felt strongly that I had seen this woman. I was so sure It was her I followed her to the restroom on one of the many occasions she got up to go to the restroom. While standing at one point behind this woman in the restroom I observed a tattoo on the back of her neck. I observed this woman as she sat in the lower part of the seating area where my friend and I sat. She was with a young guy they seemed very somber and sad, pretty down and yet intense. My friend said she thought she heard them say they were breaking up, nonetheless I couldnt help but stare at this woman as she was the identical twin of the woman on the news….. I described the tattoo nearly identical to that of the missing woman, however detectives do not seem to be following this tip from what I can tell.

I can't believe it wasn't followed but worse, why sit there all that time and not call LE?

 

[SMK]

I can't believe it wasn't followed but worse, why sit there all that time and not call LE?

I agree, if she really thought it was SS, she ought to have called, so that LE could have checked it out themselves. But think about it: We see what we are thinking about. When I was younger, any guy I had a crush on, I would see everywhere. Shantina's hairstlyle is worn by many young women. So are her glasses. Many young women have those roman style tattoos. I had a student in one of my college classes a few years back, who had the "Shantina" look. The other night, I was in Walmart, and there was a guy who looked just like Robb. Only I am near New York City. I think LE knew it was this type of thing. SS would NOT be in a public place when her child drowned and her face is ALL over national news, without wearing a long blonde wig, sunglasses, long sleeves and turtleneck to hide tattoos.....:crazy:

 

[lilcatt]

How long does it take a body to rise to the surface. I thought it would have surfaced by now.

 

[brandi]

How many WS do we have in the area?We have been involved with searches (unofficially) in the past. I wonder if anyone in the family has notified a group like TES?

I'm there! I mean, I would try to show up if someone coordinated it

 

[Calliope]

How long does it take a body to rise to the surface. I thought it would have surfaced by now.

I posted a link to a site that has that info, dependent upon water temp and other variables. I'll see if I can find it again. But you also have to consider the tides, currents, and any debris below the surface that could have entangled her body. And also, if someone was involved in this, she could have been weighted down in some fashion.

 

[SMK]

How long does it take a body to rise to the surface. I thought it would have surfaced by now.

I was just reading up on this. Have to go back into my web history, to find the link I was at. There can be cases where the body is entangled in underwater brush and debris. It could have drifted far on currents, and surfaced where no one sees it. Let me try and find the link..............

 

[Calliope]

I was just reading up on this. Have to go back into my web history, to find the link I was at. There can be cases where the body is entangled in underwater brush and debris. It could have drifted far on currents, and surfaced where no one sees it. Let me try and find the link..............

I think it was on the last thread.