Was BR involved? #2

[Mountain_Kat]

OK. My second thought in regards to the ID show....
I find it so shocking that leaving out bits and pieces of a crime and changing the layout of the house (In the ID "replay" they show Patsy reading the note on a regular stair case.
See... The devil is in the details. Not the bigger picture. It could be easy to step over a note on a regular staircase. But not on a spiral staircase. See my point? When they redo this crimes for a show they need to be sure to act it out exactly as it happened. That actress wouldn't have picked it up and she couldn't have stepped over it without almost falling. She would have had a hard time reading it upside down too. If you go by PR and JR half truths that is. It just tells me more and more that it was all staged.
If they acted it out verbatim and on a spiral staircase viewers would see how this wasn't possible.

ALSO this might be geared for the more long term sleuths but... and this might be a stupid question but again the devil is in the details....
where did the pineapple come from?
Was it canned? Fresh? in the fridge? In the house before the attack at all? In what form was it?
See the reason I ask is, if it was canned I doubt JBR would be able to open it with a can opener. Not quite sure BR would either.
Neither would be able to cut it fresh either.
See where I'm going with this?
Pineapple when you think about it is a strange item to eat. It's not like cereal. Or cookies. Or a sandwich. And the glass of tea too. Not something a kid would normally drink. and not that way either.
It is all so weird....
JMOO

I'm posting before reading through the rest of the thread, so I apologize in advance if I'm answering something someone has already answered.
The pineapple was fresh pineapple, the kind you buy in the produce section already cut into chunks.

 

[chlban]

At this point the only possible justice is a truthful confession, unless the Boulder DA finds a charge against JR for which the statute of limitations hasn't expired.

Right now they can't prove JR did anything beyond a reasonable doubt. That's a very high standard of proof, and the touch DNA evidence muddles everything. Thanks to Mary Lacy, many people are still under the impression that the DNA clears the parents.

Even IF Burke confessed, and I am not convinced he has anything to confess, all John has to do is say he had nothing to do with the staging and he never knew Patsy did that.

If Burke suddenly blurts out that he thinks Patsy did it, in a fit of rage, which is my number 1 theory, once again all John has to do is say he never knew.

There will be no justice. Sadly, I don't think there will be any answers either, but still I follow.

 

[Luckymanuh]

When they were playing replays of J & P first interview and she started to cry while talking the look on JR's face spoke volumes. I would hope my husband if in that situation would out his arm around me. Not keep looking straight ahead.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

So Burke got the electric train that Christmas?! He says when he came to the tree he saw an electric train and bike. So that's what John and Burke were putting together when they came home. I always thought it strange they gloss over what they were putting together that night.

Burke also says that both he and JB got bikes that year. That's not correct. JB and PR got bikes.
He says that JB got a big dollhouse. That's not correct. She got a My Twin doll.
I have seen a partial list of Ramsey gifts that year. There was no mention of an electric train.
It's been 20 year since that Christmas Day. Understandable that memories of various Christmas's might get jumbled in his memory. I don't think we can assume anything wrt which toy JR and BR were putting together when they returned from The White's party.
JMO

 

[chlban]

Who leaves a ransom note for 118,000 dollars, and then takes the victim to the basement and leaves her there dead?

Someone trying to cover up the murder and make it look like there was an intruder?

 

[Luckymanuh]

Chlban now seeing all this evidence strung together I totally agree.

 

[rob]

I hope I can ask this ?!

Has it ever been said that Burke has learning difficulties or was slow for his age as I know no 9 year old that would stay in bed when everybody is frantically Running around or screaming for a kidnapped member of the family. Children more than adults are more curious and naturally want to know what's going on.

So how could he just stay in bed and not wonder what the hell was going on?!

Maybe children in the UK are more socially aware as his behavior is not normal imo

I can't believe a 9 yr old would stay in bed, or the parents of one child missing would let the other stay upstairs in that out of the way bedroom alone, UNLESS he did it, he saw what happened, or he was terrified of one of the parents.
He doesn't act right in the interview, not like a 29 yr old man. That constant smiling, even on the hard questions, the non-committed answers, the whole thing. I think he didn't want to do the interview, his father is making him, he has been practiced on what to say, and when a question comes up that wasn't practiced, he rolls his eyes around and tries to decide what to say that won't make his dad mad.
If I were BR, I would change my name, never had been on tv, moved to another state or maybe even country, and try to forget everything I ever knew about my family, UNLESS I was a major player in this whole thing. then I still would.
If he is innocent, and a nine yr old would be,( even if he cracked her in the head,) when his father dies, I'd spill my guts and tell everything I know.
He may have been sexually abused along with his sister, you never know.
all MOO only

We had a thunder storm yesterday during the show and our direct tv kept freezing up. I wanted the rain but I sure was bent about the timing.

 

[chlban]

As a psychologist and amateur graphologist, I would say there is no way, especially now having seen more of BR now and then in videos, he would have used terms such as "foreign faction" (shameless plug for my screenname), or the other phrases and words, never would have called JR "John," nor really know about the exact amount to put down as a ransom.

I really don't see any evidence that could convince me that ANYONE OTHER THAN PR could have written that stupid, meandering, longest-ever-ransom-note-in-history BS note.

ITA. It was Patsy.

 

[mrseeker]

Someone trying to cover up the murder and make it look like there was an intruder?

I think it was PR writing the note to try and convince JR to leave the house the AM and not call police so she could get rid of the body undetected. Ithink JR made PR call the police before he figured it out. Then he decided to go with the coverup

 

[nona's mum]

I hope I can ask this ?!

Has it ever been said that Burke has learning difficulties or was slow for his age as I know no 9 year old that would stay in bed when everybody is frantically Running around or screaming for a kidnapped member of the family. Children more than adults are more curious and naturally want to know what's going on.

So how could he just stay in bed and not wonder what the hell was going on?!

Maybe children in the UK are more socially aware as his behavior is not normal imo

Nothing has ever been confirmed but a lot of people feel Burke displays traits associated with spectrum disorders like Autism, although I don't believe that would be classed as a learning difficulty (feel free to correct me if that's wrong). I must say, I find your comment about UK kids a little odd though (I'm from the UK too).

 

[Hatfield]

On DP show yesterday there was one clip he showed where he previously must have interviewed JR a long time ago. JR convincingly and firmly denies killing JBR. And he is probably truthful in that regard because it probably was not at his hand.

I have noticed both JR and PR are careful in wording their answers to direct questions like this and I think that is how they came across so convincingly to investigators and others in their interviews. A lot of the times there was some truth in their answers because it may have not been themselves particularly but either the spouse or BR for the specific question.

And even in some of the questions where maybe PR was lying if she felt in her mind that things were an accident then she could honestly answer in her mind that she did not murder JBR.

Kind of like when PR firmly states something like "No I did not murder my child"
No, she may not have. BR could have done it. Or she may have just accidentally on purpose did something that caused JBR to slip and fall and hit her head on the edge of a table which caused her to get a cracked skull.

I think they were able to sound convincing a lot of the times because of this sort of thing.

 

[BBB167893]

I personally don't think he was scared of her but I am largely basing that off the family portrait he drew where he made her smaller than him.

But I wouldn't doubt if he thought she was irrational and half crazy though. I'm sure as a pageant mom he saw her go psycho plenty of times.

Sent from my SM-G928P using Tapatalk

When asked, he said he'd never seen her like that. But the way he said "going psycho" implies this wasn't new for him. Maybe that's just my prejudices.

 

[rob]

I hope I can ask this ?!

Has it ever been said that Burke has learning difficulties or was slow for his age as I know no 9 year old that would stay in bed when everybody is frantically Running around or screaming for a kidnapped member of the family. Children more than adults are more curious and naturally want to know what's going on.

So how could he just stay in bed and not wonder what the hell was going on?!

Maybe children in the UK are more socially aware as his behavior is not normal imo

His behavior is not normal, not even for spoiled rich kids.

MOO

 

[rob]

On DP show yesterday there was one clip he showed where he previously must have interviewed JR a long time ago. JR convincingly and firmly denies killing JBR. And he is probably truthful in that regard because it probably was not at his hand.

I have noticed both JR and PR are careful in wording their answers to direct questions like this and I think that is how they came across so convincingly to investigators and others in their interviews. A lot of the times there was some truth in their answers because it may have not been themselves particularly but either the spouse or BR for the specific question.

And even in some of the questions where maybe PR was lying if she felt in her mind that things were an accident then she could honestly answer in her mind that she did not murder JBR.

Kind of like when PR firmly states something like "No I did not murder my child"
No, she may not have. BR could have done it. Or she may have just accidentally on purpose did something that caused JBR to slip and fall and hit her head on the edge of a table which caused her to get a cracked skull.

I think they were able to sound convincing a lot of the times because of this sort of thing.

That's funny, because I never thought they sounded convincing.

 

[BBB167893]

The average person is looking only at what people like Lou Smit is saying and taking that as gospel. I think it has become pretty common knowledge of the average person that the Ramsey's were cleared of any involvement by Mary Lacy and that DNA evidence does nothing but prove Lou Smit to have been right all along. These specials have done nothing to dispel those myths.

Sad, but true, andreww. The RST knows their history. I don't just mean the Josef Goebbels stuff about a lie becoming truth if it's told enough. Back in the Cold War, the Soviets had something called "active measures," the deliberate creation of disinformation. This was done to cover their dirty deeds and blacken their enemies at the same time. That's what the RST is doing with this stuff.

 

[IBsleuthin]

Please enlighten me - what is the significance of the pineapple in this?

I don't know I just learned about this today. Quite honestly I haven't followed this since it all happened way back.

Apparently the mother and father both are adamant about there NOT being any pineapple on the counter when they went to bed. JonBenet was found to have pineapple in her stomach on autopsy.

BR's fingerprints and 'touch DNA' were found on the pineapple bowl. So from what I saw on the DP trailers was the big cliff hanger that BR was going to 'Break his silence' and expose the pineapple.

I don't have time for all this!!! All this cliff hanging nonsense.

I just read that the whole dang family was cleared completely due to DNA evidence that was tested many years ago so WHY is there this big mystery now? Why bring BR forward with this cloak of mystery if DNA cleared him?

Sigh. This is why I'm not in Hollywood. I could not stand all the showboating.

 

[nona's mum]

I think it was PR writing the note to try and convince JR to leave the house the AM and not call police so she could get rid of the body undetected. Ithink JR made PR call the police before he figured it out. Then he decided to go with the coverup

Thats an interesting point! I'd never thought of it like that before

 

[PositiveLight]

I don't know I just learned about this today. Quite honestly I haven't followed this since it all happened way back.

Apparently the mother and father both are adamant about there NOT being any pineapple on the counter when they went to bed. JonBenet was found to have pineapple in her stomach on autopsy.

BR's fingerprints and 'touch DNA' were found on the pineapple bowl. So from what I saw on the DP trailers was the big cliff hanger that BR was going to 'Break his silence' and expose the pineapple.

I don't have time for all this!!! All this cliff hanging nonsense.

I just read that the whole dang family was cleared completely due to DNA evidence that was tested many years ago so WHY is there this big mystery now? Why bring BR forward with this cloak of mystery if DNA cleared him?

Sigh. This is why I'm not in Hollywood. I could not stand all the showboating.

AMEN. I'm like :waiting::waiting::anguish::nevermind:

 

[johnjay]

I don't think so, maybe. Have we seen how he wrote then?

As I understand it, the police handwriting experts cleared both John and Burke of writing the note back in 1997

 

[nona's mum]

I don't know I just learned about this today. Quite honestly I haven't followed this since it all happened way back.

Apparently the mother and father both are adamant about there NOT being any pineapple on the counter when they went to bed. JonBenet was found to have pineapple in her stomach on autopsy.

BR's fingerprints and 'touch DNA' were found on the pineapple bowl. So from what I saw on the DP trailers was the big cliff hanger that BR was going to 'Break his silence' and expose the pineapple.

I don't have time for all this!!! All this cliff hanging nonsense.

I just read that the whole dang family was cleared completely due to DNA evidence that was tested many years ago so WHY is there this big mystery now? Why bring BR forward with this cloak of mystery if DNA cleared him?

Sigh. This is why I'm not in Hollywood. I could not stand all the showboating.

DNA hasn't cleared them, technically. It's a myth the media like to peddle. The pineapple was significant because PR and JR said they didn't feed JB any pineapple but it was found in her stomach at autopsy. BR and PR fingerprints were found on the bowl but JB's were not. Which begs the question, how did it get in her stomach?!