Was Burke Involved # 5

[UKGuy]

Translation: I, UKGuy, am incapable of rebutting any of your points.



Poon is slang for female genitalia. It’s called using free-association but, sadly, you don’t seem to be able to understand it.



Did I address the long johns in my post, yes or no?



Do you think it would have been normal for Burke, nearly 20 years later, to be on the Dr Phil Show lying on the floor, curled up in a fetal position, wailing and sobbing, yes or no?

icedtea4me,
Yes, Yes, Yes, No.

 

[icedtea4me]

icedtea4me,
Yes, Yes, Yes, No.

I did not address the long johns in post #362.

 

[icedtea4me]

*snip*Also JonBenet's blood was found on the Pink Barbie Nightgown, how come if it magicked itself out of the dryer and after JonBenet was either assaulted or asphyxiated, i.e. the staging was mostly complete?

What if the Barbie nightgown hadn't been in the dryer? What if that was what JonBenet was wearing that night and was redressed in her white Gap shirt and Burke's long johns after the bash to the head and prior to the strangulation? What if this was done to make it look like she was immediately put to bed?

There are two bloodstains on her nightgown and white shirt. She had two rust-colored abrasions on her back. I say the blood is from the abrasions.

 

[UKGuy]

What if the Barbie nightgown hadn't been in the dryer? What if that was what JonBenet was wearing that night and was redressed in her white Gap shirt and Burke's long johns after the bash to the head and prior to the strangulation? What if this was done to make it look like she was immediately put to bed?

There are two bloodstains on her nightgown and white shirt. She had two rust-colored abrasions on her back. I say the blood is from the abrasions.

icedtea4me,

What if the Barbie nightgown hadn't been in the dryer? What if that was what JonBenet was wearing that night and was redressed in her white Gap shirt and Burke's long johns after the bash to the head and prior to the strangulation? What if this was done to make it look like she was immediately put to bed?

Yes, that is a more plausible explanation than static cling. So who redressed her in her white gap top, etc? The source for the bloodstain is interesting, since its either an abrasion or via her internal assault.

I would go for the internal assault, since I view an abrasion as more a friction tear than a cut.

.

 

[icedtea4me]

icedtea4me,

Yes, that is a more plausible explanation than static cling. So who redressed her in her white gap top, etc? The source for the bloodstain is interesting, since its either an abrasion or via her internal assault.

I would go for the internal assault, since I view an abrasion as more a friction tear than a cut.

.

There was enough friction on the skin's surface to cause it to break and bleed.

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/abrasion?s=t

Answer 2:
Blood is red ordinarily because the oxygen-containing compound, hemoglobin, contains iron, iron that becomes iron oxide (aka rust) when it combines with oxygen in the air.

http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=1329

 

[Userid]

The amount of blood is perplexing to me. We only have "drops" of blood, correct? And they are only found on 3 items: the Bloomies, the nightgown, and her bedsheet, correct?

 

[icedtea4me]

The amount of blood is perplexing to me. We only have "drops" of blood, correct? And they are only found on 3 items: the Bloomies, the nightgown, and her bedsheet, correct?

Yes, there is only a very small amount of blood on the underwear, nightgown, blanket, and white shirt. (See post #383 in this thread.)

 

[UKGuy]

The amount of blood is perplexing to me. We only have "drops" of blood, correct? And they are only found on 3 items: the Bloomies, the nightgown, and her bedsheet, correct?

Userid,
There was also an alleged bloodstain on JonBenet's bedroom pillow, as the investigators asked Patsy if JonBenet ever had nosebleeds, etc?

Also:
2004-01-14: The Bonita Papers-1999

"After the physical evidence had been collected at the autopsy and from the search of the residence, the next step was testing by the Colorado Bureau of Investigations. Blood had been found on the long-sleeved white top and the "Wednesday" underwear worn by JonBenet, the blanket and nightgown found in the wine cellar, and the duct tape found in the cellar which John reported to have removed from JonBenet's mouth. CBI Agent Kathren Dressel, a DNA and serological testing expert with 25 years of experience, performed the DNA testing on these items and positively matched the blood to JonBenet.

 

[UKGuy]

There was enough friction on the skin's surface to cause it to break and bleed.

http://www.thesaurus.com/browse/abrasion?s=t

Answer 2:
Blood is red ordinarily because the oxygen-containing compound, hemoglobin, contains iron, iron that becomes iron oxide (aka rust) when it combines with oxygen in the air.

http://scienceline.ucsb.edu/getkey.php?key=1329

icedtea4me,
A bloodstain on the White Gap Top and the Pink Barbie Nightgown should match on both for location with an abrasion on JonBenet?

Show this and it could demonstrate that White Gap Top arrived after the Pink Barbie Nightgown?

.

 

[Userid]

Userid,
There was also an alleged bloodstain on JonBenet's bedroom pillow, as the investigators asked Patsy if JonBenet ever had nosebleeds, etc?

Also:
2004-01-14: The Bonita Papers-1999

Thanks. So does that make you believe the crime occurred in her bedroom then?

And also, was the source of the stain found on the carpet in JBR's bedroom (I believe police cut out the section) ever confirmed/released? Was it blood?

 

[UKGuy]

Thanks. So does that make you believe the crime occurred in her bedroom then?

And also, was the source of the stain found on the carpet in JBR's bedroom (I believe police cut out the section) ever confirmed/released? Was it blood?

Userid,

The results of testing the carpet section cut out have never been released.

Yes, it was more likely to be her bedroom. Although it could have started in BR's bedroom, with her being moved to her bedroom for staging?

If Kolar is correct regarding BR's pajama bottoms being on JonBenet's bedroom floor then I reckon the case is definitely BDI All. With Burke redressing JonBenet in his long johns and those size-12's.

.

 

[otg]

otg, Burke Ramsey's touch dna was matched to a sample on the Pink Barbie Nightgown. They are saying a minimum of two individuals, since they know they have a mixture of Ramsey dna. There might be three or four. Unlike John B. Ramsey, John Andrew Ramsey, and Melinda Ramsey who are excluded they have not excluded Patsy Ramsey!

Actually the report saying he "could not be eliminated as the contributor" is not the same as saying his DNA "was a match." I know though that the odds tell us that it most likely belonged to Burke.

My point about Patsy was that even though her DNA didn't eliminate her as a contributor, her gender did. The report says the sample was "a mixture of at least two individuals including the victim and at least one male contributor." That eliminates Patsy.

The important feature is BR's touch dna, I would not be surprised to see Patsy's dna since I suspect her of the wine-cellar staging.

It shouldn't be surprising to find DNA belonging to any one of the four Ramseys (or all four) in the basement. They all lived in the house.

Of all the places in the house, the last place I would expect to see BR's touch-dna is in the wine-cellar, that is simply too coincidental for it not to be relevant?

Possibly, but not necessarily.

Also JonBenet's blood was found on the Pink Barbie Nightgown, how come if it magicked itself out of the dryer and after JonBenet was either assaulted or asphyxiated, i.e. the staging was mostly complete?

I can't answer that one as I'm not of the opinion that the nightgown was attached to the blanket because of static cling.

 

[icedtea4me]

JBR wearing his pants when found dead.

Longjohns (free association)= long John= John was long= John had an erect penis that night

He was downstairs, alone, after he thought everyone was asleep.

Phil: I think your dad had said he used the flashlight that night to put you to bed that night and then you snuck downstairs to play.
Burke: yeah. I had some toy I wanted to put together. I remember being downstairs after everyone was kind of in bed...

http://www.topix.com/forum/news/jonbenet-ramsey/TAJER8FBVT9VK4JDP/burke-on-phil

There are other things that can be done in bed other than sleep.

His gifts were in the WC.

Yes, gifts for his upcoming 27 Jan birthday were in the wine cellar, which is more logical than Patsy having kept them in his bedroom closet.

 

[AdMademoiselle]

Ambitioned,
That's Burke trying to act normal, big cheesy smiles, false show of confidence, etc. As a child he does not realize how his behavior will be interpreted.

All he knows is I Got Away With It

.

UK,
I couldn't agree with you more.
This is what BR reminds me of with his plastic, inappropriate, and plastered-on smile.
Then add in his strange eyes darting back-and-forth.
So very callous and odd.

 

[SlappyMc]

(1) if you are one that believes that the boy has some involvement here, could you please specifically state the conduct at issue

(2) if the head injury, the autopsy report provides for an 8.5 inch part linear, part comminuted fracture of the skull, with an associated underlying brain contusion 8 inches in length. Was the boy strong enough to inflict such a wound?

(3) if you posit only the head injury being caused by the boy, then why the need for any coverup? Remember here that is a closed head injury and even the medical examiner was not aware of the nature of the head injury until the skin was opened, and since the examiner also opined that head injury was first and manual strangulation after, then she's alive, they can't discern just how bad the injury is, other than she is likely unconscious, and so he got angry and hit her, and that's perhaps a short CPS intervention and that's about it, so, again, why some need for some coverup for the boy?

(4) by the way, Patsy did nothing here, at least initially, since she doesn't make the 911 when she did if she's involved, also means, by the way, that she didn't write the note.

(5) the Ramseys gave their house key to everyone and her/his cousin, ten times removed, and so if we're going with staged scenes, someone entered when they weren't home, then did the evil thing, then staged the scene, and then walked out the front door. And no biggie, since Keppel remarks in his The Riverman, everyone is always running around asking, did you see anything unusual, when the question instead ought to be, what did you see that was usual? Hiding in plain sight and all that. And lord knows what the scheme is in Boulder, but may be possible to have the house plan on file somewhere, from when the place was originally built, and for permitting purposes, and maybe perhaps even in connection with the real property tax assessment. And don't recall where I read it, but they were apparently part of some open house Christmas tour program two year or so prior. And so adding that all up, you essentially have to investigate everyone who might have ever had access to a door key. I mean, I'm not a big fan of the whole beauty pageant thing for the young 'uns, but she was famous among a certain crowd, and so if you wanted, you work for someone who had access, borrow the key when no one's looking, and viola, you've now got access. And re the not apparently vicious nature of any sexual assault itself, i.e., the genital injury, which could go assault or not, but if so, picture someone like Chikatilo sans the mutilation.

(6) lastly, when some ask for a fresh look, well, if they find anything, rather likely because some were blinded on that long dark road called Confirmation Bias Drive.

(7) almost forgot, but back to the matter of injury, while I have substantial doubt as the boy's ability to inflict the head injury, let me say that the manual strangulation would have been easier, except for the means used, i.e., from whence would he have come up with that idea?

(8) for another almost forgot, owing to the dollar amount demanded, some have said that if intruder(s), had to be someone who was familiar with Mr. Ramsey and wanted to cause him a great deal of pain (as if the murder of his one child wouldn't have been enough pain and never mind the note), but to me an equally plausible argument would be, first make it look like someone in the family did it, and if not, then someone who knew Mr. Ramsay and wanted to cause him pain.

(9) and now for third time's the charm, you'd have to have a Mt. Everest of evidence to convince me that Patsy did anything wrong. First, there is the 911 call, which you simply don't make when she did, if coverup is the plan, and second, some have said that sometimes the one parent knows and allows it, and that's true, but far more often than not is someone rather dependent on the other and the other usually doesn't have gazillions of dollars for you take in the divorce case. Let me put that this way, he was every gold-digger's dream. So no reason to not bail out when the need for the same arose.

 

[k-mac]

(1) if you are one that believes that the boy has some involvement here, could you please specifically state the conduct at issue

(2) if the head injury, the autopsy report provides for an 8.5 inch part linear, part comminuted fracture of the skull, with an associated underlying brain contusion 8 inches in length. Was the boy strong enough to inflict such a wound?

(3) if you posit only the head injury being caused by the boy, then why the need for any coverup? Remember here that is a closed head injury and even the medical examiner was not aware of the nature of the head injury until the skin was opened, and since the examiner also opined that head injury was first and manual strangulation after, then she's alive, they can't discern just how bad the injury is, other than she is likely unconscious, and so he got angry and hit her, and that's perhaps a short CPS intervention and that's about it, so, again, why some need for some coverup for the boy?

(4) by the way, Patsy did nothing here, at least initially, since she doesn't make the 911 when she did if she's involved, also means, by the way, that she didn't write the note.

(5) the Ramseys gave their house key to everyone and her/his cousin, ten times removed, and so if we're going with staged scenes, someone entered when they weren't home, then did the evil thing, then staged the scene, and then walked out the front door. And no biggie, since Keppel remarks in his The Riverman, everyone is always running around asking, did you see anything unusual, when the question instead ought to be, what did you see that was usual? Hiding in plain sight and all that. And lord knows what the scheme is in Boulder, but may be possible to have the house plan on file somewhere, from when the place was originally built, and for permitting purposes, and maybe perhaps even in connection with the real property tax assessment. And don't recall where I read it, but they were apparently part of some open house Christmas tour program two year or so prior. And so adding that all up, you essentially have to investigate everyone who might have ever had access to a door key. I mean, I'm not a big fan of the whole beauty pageant thing for the young 'uns, but she was famous among a certain crowd, and so if you wanted, you work for someone who had access, borrow the key when no one's looking, and viola, you've now got access. And re the not apparently vicious nature of any sexual assault itself, i.e., the genital injury, which could go assault or not, but if so, picture someone like Chikatilo sans the mutilation.

(6) lastly, when some ask for a fresh look, well, if they find anything, rather likely because some were blinded on that long dark road called Confirmation Bias Drive.

(7) almost forgot, but back to the matter of injury, while I have substantial doubt as the boy's ability to inflict the head injury, let me say that the manual strangulation would have been easier, except for the means used, i.e., from whence would he have come up with that idea?

(8) for another almost forgot, owing to the dollar amount demanded, some have said that if intruder(s), had to be someone who was familiar with Mr. Ramsey and wanted to cause him a great deal of pain (as if the murder of his one child wouldn't have been enough pain and never mind the note), but to me an equally plausible argument would be, first make it look like someone in the family did it, and if not, then someone who knew Mr. Ramsay and wanted to cause him pain.

(9) and now for third time's the charm, you'd have to have a Mt. Everest of evidence to convince me that Patsy did anything wrong. First, there is the 911 call, which you simply don't make when she did, if coverup is the plan, and second, some have said that sometimes the one parent knows and allows it, and that's true, but far more often than not is someone rather dependent on the other and the other usually doesn't have gazillions of dollars for you take in the divorce case. Let me put that this way, he was every gold-digger's dream. So no reason to not bail out when the need for the same arose.

yikes
do yourself a favour. start with....
watch the ramsey depositions from the wolf case.
then come and play with us

 

[Ambitioned]

And then when you're finished with those, watch a few videos including this one:

http://www.cbs.com/shows/the-case-o...e-case-of-jonbenet-ramsey-blunt-force-trauma/

There was zero evidence of an intruder. IDI is dead.

 

[icedtea4me]

*snip*
If Kolar is correct regarding BR's pajama bottoms being on JonBenet's bedroom floor then I reckon the case is definitely BDI All. With Burke redressing JonBenet in his long johns and those size-12's.*snip*

The pajama bottoms were never collected into evidence to be tested; therefore, nothing will ever be known about them.

 

[UKGuy]

The pajama bottoms were never collected into evidence to be tested; therefore, nothing will ever be known about them.

icedtea4me,
You never know. The Pajamas might be sitting, overlooked in an evidence cage somewhere in Coloraodo State. They might appear sometime in the future, but with the chain of custody corrupted, yet all we want to do is decide are they BR's or JonBenet's?

JonBenet never wore those pajama bottoms the night before, i.e. 24th. So she must have worn them on or prior to the 23rd?

Looks like Kolar is offering an elliptical hint here, similar to the Partially Opened gifts. Might that is because it suits his theory, or he is onto to something?

.

 

[icedtea4me]

icedtea4me,
You never know. The Pajamas might be sitting, overlooked in an evidence cage somewhere in Coloraodo State.*snip*

Filled with feces as many BDIs claim? That's about as likely as a magical monkey flying out of my butt and handing me winning lottery numbers.