weekend discussion: discuss the trial here #139

[Dana]

That's simply not true. In fact, Jodi's journal was not much help to her.

The majority of the evidence is Jodi and Travis talking back and forth, all day, every day, for months.

Plus interviews with friends, family, former boyfriends, former girlfriends, Travis journals, Travis blogs.

Like she kept saying, she did not need one word from Jodi Arias herself to arrive at her conclusions.

I think because you have never seen what she has seen you might think it doesn't exist. For some reason, the court is not allowing us to see it. But, it exists. That was made clear.

IMO

BBM

What interviews? ALV saw no one but JA. Testimony yes, interviews no.

 

[MickyTwoShade]

Ok, I guess my question then is how you define "temper," is it a quality in anyone who ever gets angry for any reason?

Ha, I would say a temper would be somebody who might be more likely to 'snap' or get, and remain, heated.

 

[You'reKidding Right?]

Well, all I can say is, I'll be glad to see the back of Alyce's head as she returns home for good. And I mean that in the nicest possible way.:blowkiss:

 

[Schuby]

Ha, I would say a temper would be somebody who might be more likely to 'snap' or get, and remain, heated.

Okay.

 

[AngelWings444]

This is my, likely, unpopular opinion.

Given the criteria, it's very likely Travis could be classified as verbally abusive. Do we know what teed him off? No, but his word choice was exceedingly harsh. There's also evidence to suggest Travis WAS a bit of a player...

I don't think one has to believe Travis was perfect to want justice for his horrific murder.

The problem is when AV uses that as a spring board to corroborate the far less likely facts: that Travis was physically abusive and a pedophile. There's so little to suggest anything of the sort; it just doesn't carry weight.

Now, was Arias a wallflower? No. What comes across to me is that while Travis did seem like a bit of a player, he wore his emotions on his sleeve. A sociopath he was not. Arias was likely far more manipulative and conniving in evoking these emotions in him. There's nothing in Arias' personality, IMO, that suggests she was trapped in an abusive relationship. I think she knew Travis' buttons and pushed them, especially when she started to realize she wasn't his one and only.

BBM: I agree with everything you said, but the BBM. We do not know that Travis was verbally abusive based on these text messages! Yes, he was abusive in this message, and may have had a damn good reason for being so upset! If someone hacked my phone, email, bank records, sent messages to other people pretending to be me, illegally violated my right to a private sex call, and threatened to use that as blackmail, I would NOT have been as calm as Travis!

I won't go into detail, but in the past, regarding a certain incident, I sent some well deserved scathing text messages to an individual. If someone only had my side of the conversation, they would convict me of murder, if the person was dead.

We do not have Travis's side of the story and quite frankly, given the circumstances so far, he was justified in his "tone" with JA. She WAS the worst thing that ever happened to him. :furious:

:moo:

 

[MickyTwoShade]

What are everyone's thoughts on sentencing... if Arias doesn't get death, will you be disappointed? Will that be seen as a loss for Juan?

 

[molly333]

It depends on the context. You could be! I think everyone has the capability.

It's more important that there's NO evidence of physical abuse.

It's also important to look at the character of Arias in relation to the words spoken. Of course I don't have to tell you, but just watching her go head to head with Martinez-- she held her own incredibly. That's not a woman who can be verbally abused. And she also played the victim: remember her ridiculous "men like you yelling at me" nonsense?

You don't need physical abuse to be in a battering relationship. Alyce was very clear about that. It's also true.

That's what the whole character assassination discussion was about. Soul murder.

Battering in her continuum was one step above abuse and one step below terrorism.

IMO

 

[Linda7NJ]

Rememeber:

Just because you tell a lie - that doesn't make you a liar. ~ Alyce LaViolette.

And it is really character assination if its true?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Cailin Rua]

I think it's one thing to ascertain and believe that Travis had a temper. I believe that.
.

Everyone has a temper.

I don't think ALV understands, or maybe she's just ignoring, the fact that when a fight-by-text occurs over a period of 3 hours or so it doesn't mean the parties are sitting there furiously texting that whole time. They are probably doing laundry, walking the dog, unloading the dishwasher.

On one level I don't really understand people who text, text, text constantly, but on another level I do understand that that's how younger people seem to conduct relationships now. I think ALV is very behind the times on these things and it showed in her testimony.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I think we're talking about two different things here. The hearing involving Ms. Wong is pretty clearly just a continuation of the public mistrial hearing about Juan and the autographs, etc. The defense filed two motions that were very similar on the "circus atmosphere" issue, and at least one of them has been posted here. The other was summarized in great detail in news articles and probably posted as well. Those motions are no big secret, and no one is pretending they are secret.

The "issue" regarding ALV seems to be something separate. There is nothing filed with the clerk's office to look at regarding the "issue." And there have been a whole lot of sealed in-chambers meetings involving ALV. If the "issue" to be heard Tuesday has anything to do with the sealed in-chambers meetings, then the hearing will probably not be in open court--and even if it is, the judge has very likely ordered everyone involved in the sealed meetings not to discuss it until then. And even if she hasn't, the attorneys at least would be aware that you can't disclose things discussed in sealed meetings with the judge.

BBM - Yes - The Judge referred to it as an "Issue" - I think the Judge purposely is dealing with it SEPARATELY.

 

[Pink Panther]

She just started to lose it after juror questions. It surprised me because I always assumed she knew this was a hopeless case. Apparently not because when she got up after juror Q's she was in a nervous panic. It was so bad that after about 10 minutes the judge called a 10 minute recess so she could collect herserlf.

Please...I've seen most of the day but I completely missed JW on warp speed and I can't find it! Can someone please post a link!

:blushing:

 

[Mellinyce]

BBM: I agree with everything you said, but the BBM. We do not know that Travis was verbally abusive based on these text messages! Yes, he was abusive in this message, and may have had a damn good reason for being so upset! If someone hacked my phone, email, bank records, sent messages to other people pretending to be me, illegally violated my right to a private sex call, and threatened to use that as blackmail, I would NOT have been as calm as Travis!

I won't go into detail, but in the past, regarding a certain incident, I sent some well deserved scathing text messages to an individual. If someone only had my side of the conversation, they would convict me of murder, if the person was dead.

We do not have Travis's side of the story and quite frankly, given the circumstances so far, he was justified in his "tone" with JA. She WAS the worst thing that ever happened to him. :furious:

:moo:

Far better said than I could have...Thank you!:rocker:

 

[Lorelilly]

I'm not so sure of that. An attorney here stated that expert witnesses are not admonished to not watch media or speak with others about the case. She says she hasn't been privy to any of the trial testimony, but she said nothing about any other or secondary exposure. She has apparently familiarized herself with what's going on and being said by the public on the internet, in forums, and on twitter at least. That is in the motion filed by the defendant for a mistrial claiming some witnesses in the case are being affected by those things, and apparently why, as was reported by the media, she was in the emergency room recently, being treated for a panic attack and palpitations. Am I understanding this correctly?

Yes she ended up in the ER claiming anxiety. Whether she is reading message boards or facebook or whatever I have no idea. If she reflected for one minute about her 9 days (?) on the stand, perhaps she might have a clue as to why parts of the public are upset with her. Trouble is, she outright LIED on the stand today in regards to a jury question and when she was called out on it, she was her same old dis-respectful, refuse to budge an inch, person. So, I guess self reflection isn't in her bag of tricks. What a train wreck.

 

[Schuby]

BBM: I agree with everything you said, but the BBM. We do not know that Travis was verbally abusive based on these text messages! Yes, he was abusive in this message, and may have had a damn good reason for being so upset! If someone hacked my phone, email, bank records, sent messages to other people pretending to be me, illegally violated my right to a private sex call, and threatened to use that as blackmail, I would NOT have been as calm as Travis!

I won't go into detail, but in the past, regarding a certain incident, I sent some well deserved scathing text messages to an individual. If someone only had my side of the conversation, they would convict me of murder, if the person was dead.

We do not have Travis's side of the story and quite frankly, given the circumstances so far, he was justified in his "tone" with JA. She WAS the worst thing that ever happened to him. :furious:

:moo:

He was belligerent, he wasn't abusive. Abuseive is an adjective that characterizes a relationship, how two people interact over time.
This was an explosive episode of which there is no evidence it characterizes their relationship.

 

[AngelWings444]

No. Jodi's journals had nothing in them, remember?

Narry a mention of DV except for the occasional comment on his cruelty or harshness about some argument or her growing depression.

IMO

Yet, the fact that JA didn't mention any abuse or bad stuff in her journals about Travis, is proof that there was abuse and bad things happened. Alrighty then... :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[Linda7NJ]

What are everyone's thoughts on sentencing... if Arias doesn't get death, will you be disappointed? Will that be seen as a loss for Juan?

I'll be happy with LWOP or death.... Nothing less


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[molly333]

BBM: I agree with everything you said, but the BBM. We do not know that Travis was verbally abusive based on these text messages! Yes, he was abusive in this message, and may have had a damn good reason for being so upset! If someone hacked my phone, email, bank records, sent messages to other people pretending to be me, illegally violated my right to a private sex call, and threatened to use that as blackmail, I would NOT have been as calm as Travis!

I won't go into detail, but in the past, regarding a certain incident, I sent some well deserved scathing text messages to an individual. If someone only had my side of the conversation, they would convict me of murder, if the person was dead.

We do not have Travis's side of the story and quite frankly, given the circumstances so far, he was justified in his "tone" with JA. She WAS the worst thing that ever happened to him. :furious:

:moo:

Remember she kept using the word, pattern.

She was looking at intensity and frequency over time.

This is not a few events here and there.

IMO

 

[MickyTwoShade]

BBM: I agree with everything you said, but the BBM. We do not know that Travis was verbally abusive based on these text messages! Yes, he was abusive in this message, and may have had a damn good reason for being so upset! If someone hacked my phone, email, bank records, sent messages to other people pretending to be me, illegally violated my right to a private sex call, and threatened to use that as blackmail, I would NOT have been as calm as Travis!

I won't go into detail, but in the past, regarding a certain incident, I sent some well deserved scathing text messages to an individual. If someone only had my side of the conversation, they would convict me of murder, if the person was dead.

We do not have Travis's side of the story and quite frankly, given the circumstances so far, he was justified in his "tone" with JA. She WAS the worst thing that ever happened to him. :furious:

:moo:

You're definitely right regarding the last bit.

I guess my broad feelings on this is that it's OK to concede Travis wasn't a perfect guy. It doesn't give any credence to him as a "pattern abuser" or pedophile or any other character assassination like that.

 

[katydid23]

I have a question for all you WS's...How is it that a verbal "rant" cannot be shorter than a "rant" in text form? Are you kidding me? His 3 hr long "rant" wasn't taking place for literally 3 hours was it? I can't believe she would really think that in a conversation this "rant" wouldn't be much shorter...

THat was so bogus for ALV to contend that Travis was 'raging for hours on end.'

She has ZERO experience with emails, IM's and texts. So she does not understand how the 'social media' generation uses this medium.

I've watched how my kids do this. They will be FaceBooking, texting, listening to I-tunes, IM'ing several friends, and looking at Instagram, SIMULTANEOUSLY.

If my DD is arguing with her BF by text, it might span a few hours. But she is not sitting there fuming and ranting from 7pm until 10. She might send him an angry text, then talk about it on IM with her friend, send a funny picture to another friend on instagram, download a few songs, then look to see if he replied. She is not sitting there in a rage. This generation MULTI-TASKS.

But that is where ALV got this all wrong. She assumes that just because Travis sent the killer a laundry list of insults, that means that he was sitting at the computer, enraged, in an all consuming hatred, and he did nothing for hours but insult poor Jodi. She knows nothing about social media, and has admitted that many times under oath.

 

[Mellinyce]

Reserved VIP seating I think


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh: