weekend discussion: discuss the trial here #154

[tomato]

Quick question: why did Dr. Carp withdraw from the case? according to Dr. DeMarte, Dr. Carp evaluated JA before her, Dr. Samule and Alyce.

 

[G&AMom]

Quick question: why did Dr. Carp withdraw from the case? according to Dr. DeMarte, Dr. Carp evaluated JA before her, Dr. Samule and Alyce.

Health reasons. Something quite serious, the rumor mill says.

 

[AstroKitty]

Does anyone know if her finger is *actually* mangled? I ask this because I rarely see it and I'd imagine it would make writing rather difficult. I know she states it happened in Jan and the prosecutors allude to it most likely happening the day TA was murdered. I'm thinking it could not be there or have happened in jail. Hasn't she been in a fight?

 

[ClosArgs]

You can make fun of me, Clos -- anything to keep the humor flowing! It's the best part of my day sometimes.

Thanks G&A, I was getting depressed. Make fun of me too. I was wanting to make a joke about JA's closet story comparing it to the wire work in Crouching Tigers and Hidden Dragon, but on second thought I'm sure the mods would approve.:rocker:

 

[AstroKitty]

I think Jodi is purposefully losing weight. I think she has had lots of time to read in Prison. She is going to try to escape. She has probable read the books about ted bundy and his escapes. She also thinks so much of herself she would never suicide out. Her narcissistic and BPD makes it such she that she thinks she was jsutified in killing Travis and she did not wrong, or justified. She will be a dangerous prisoner for sure. The only solice we will get is if she goes to deathrow there are only 2 females on deathrow in her state and it will be very quiet there for her. Noone to stimulate her mind nor take her cr*p any more. She will be watched like hawk

I normally don't take any offense to what others opinions are of BPD but .. we don't walk around justifying our actions because we have BPD. It has nothing to do with it. We are social outcasts and are more likely to self harm than harm anyone else. Her narcissism though would explain her inability to commit suicide. She cries wolf about that because she knows people will cave to her desire as they don't want to set her off. :moo:

 

[Mellinyce]

Quick question: why did Dr. Carp withdraw from the case? according to Dr. DeMarte, Dr. Carp evaluated JA before her, Dr. Samule and Alyce.

I believe I read because she got ill.

 

[BeachGirlFromPA]

The one issue that troubles me about this case is JA was understood by her lover Travis and her friends as being different. She did things that were not normal. Yet she was used as a three hole wonder.
Who is responsible here? Did Travis ever meet JA's parents? Was anyone ever contacted when JA's behavior became symptomatic? JA was a perfect storm ready to erupt having a relationship go terribly wrong.
To sit back after the fact and call her a monster and all the names I have heard doesn't solve this problem.

I don't think the identity of the person was revealed, if so, I've missed it, but in JA's mother's interview with LE, she spoke about getting a phone call from a male 'friend' of JA's who stated she was acting out so badly that he had called a hotline and was notifying her family of her outrageous behavior. Apparently someone had their eye on the ball.
JA kept her life and TA private, in ridiculous ways, according to her mother.
Monday morning quarterbacking those who didn't prevent her from killing Travis doesn't solve anything either. IMO.

 

[indycornstalk]

Do they really have to be replaced after 10 years? Is this what they called planned obsolescence? Keeps the docs in business for decades to come?

I've got a pacemaker. It has to be replaced about every 7 years. NOT looking forward to it (later this year). I can see getting implants, but not if I had to do it over and over again.

I hope the taxpayers of AZ don't have to pay for her to have them replaced. They better just remove them all together and let her be deflated. Not gonna matter on Death Row anyway.

 

[G&AMom]

Does anyone know if her finger is *actually* mangled? I ask this because I rarely see it and I'd imagine it would make writing rather difficult. I know she states it happened in Jan and the prosecutors allude to it most likely happening the day TA was murdered. I'm thinking it could not be there or have happened in jail. Hasn't she been in a fight?

Probably everybody will weigh in on this and all have different opinions.

IMO that finger is definitely mangled (a good description). I believe it had to have been caused by some type of cutting and could not possibly be from Travis kicking her.

But there's theories that she's double jointed, etc., etc. Don't suppose we'll ever really know.

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

If you all noticed she immediately did the "If I was" to preface statements. anything she starts that way is "I DID IT". She's not that good of a liar as far as the context of her statements. She's a good liar as far as her eyes don't even expose her. I notice that on the stand, when she touches her face or covers her mouth - she's lying. Those are dead give aways for almost all people. She doesn't however do the eye's up or looking to the side (searching for information). To learn how deviant she is, look online for a tutorial in ready body languages.

I took this crazy course 2 summers ago in NY with an ex who's a magician. He's pretty stable in this field and booked everywhere. Why is he so good? Because he can read faces, eyes and body language. The man who held this course is an FBI consultant. It's amazing what you learn!

after I took the course I began looking at past documentaries of serial killers or mass murderers and watching their faces / bodies. Bundy, Ridgeway and a few others show no emotions when lying. That's (according to the course instructor) a psychopathic trait. Only a person that's a psychopath can pull that off. Again, it's not a diagnosis that Dr's like to give (it's seen as a sensational statement, the same with sociopaths). That's why you'll hear "She has psychopathic idealizations" or similar statements. It's so that she's not given a sensational title and the diagnosis isn't looked as being an attention grabber. Right now BPD is getting a lot of attention because most people are unaware of what that even means. Just like aspergers was given legs of it's own with Sandy Hook shooting. If she were a man - I wonder if she would have been given an aspergers title (avoidance, inability to know boundaries, incredibly detailed and obsessive). Women and men are always given different labels when it comes to actions like this.

There is a cathartic feeling for those who are true psychopaths who harbor anger from a deprived childhood, to act out in anger. It's absolute and controlled. People who have no control over their lives, they tend to find things they can control. For some it's food intake,sex or drugs. others it's violence on small children, animals or people who are rendered helpless. Jodi made TA helpless somehow and with that she made control over him. First she used sex (and the way she tells it, it was anal and oral copulation. IE pleasuring him and getting no pleasure but feeling PAIN (her way of feeling is through painful anal intercourse) She also knew that most women aren't giving those two things away out the gate. I'm guessing she did the anal for attention because it's "unusual" (and more so to a person who dates virgins) and for awhile it held him over. When that no longer worked, she had to do more and more.

Now, the issue with a murderer who has anger issues is that there are 3 stages: incubation, violence and relief. She would have absolutely reoffended at some point, because she knows there is relief for her after. This is why I don't think she HASNT done this before. If this was her first murder, there is definitely a dog or cat before him. I don't think it stopped with the dog she does admit to.

There was a dog named doggy boy that she kicked when she was thirteen, and she said he moved a few feet and never seen again. She kicked him in anger when he tore up the trash that had her brother and sisters diapers and she had to pick them up. She told Detective Flores that it changed her world. The way she looked at the world had changed. I think she killed him and her parents took him off.

 

[Renee110]

I agree with you.

What do you think her true motive was?

I think that whatever he was threatening to expose her with was the catalyst that drove her to kill him. It just seems that after those texts where he calls her a sociopath, tells her she's evil and he wants her to know he thinks that, and that he is going to tell everyone (something), the grandparent's gun was stolen 2 days later and he was dead a week later.

I don't think a trip to Cancun drove her to murder him. That is just really extreme.

I really really really wonder what he found out. I don't believe I would call someone a sociopath or evil because a ring was stolen. He was obviously shocked, devastated and done with her. He had put up with her crazy behavior for so long (showing up unannounced, tires slashed, snooping, lying) and you would think he had sort of accepted that of her, since he stayed in the relationship. He kind of got used to the behavior and probably inured to it. I think he discovered something huge that freaked him out, and whatever it was, Jodi killed him to prevent him from exposing it. Maybe it wasn't ever discussed in writing (text, email etc..) and only discussed on the phone, and that is why we don't know what he was threatening to expose. Maybe she did succeed in that objective and that particular secret is safe. I do believe though that there is more to the story.

 

[Wolfpack Fan]

Jodi told Detective Flores that she hurt that finger in the fight with the ninjas. She showed the finger to him and told him to feel it. At the end of that interview, Flores told her he knew how she hurt it. He said that the knife slipped when she got blood on her hands. He said that he had seen that many times.

 

[AstroKitty]

Probably everybody will weigh in on this and all have different opinions.

IMO that finger is definitely mangled (a good description). I believe it had to have been caused by some type of cutting and could not possibly be from Travis kicking her.

But there's theories that she's double jointed, etc., etc. Don't suppose we'll ever really know.

Ah okay I didn't even consider "double jointed". I did try to lift that finger and bend it without moving the other fingers - totally freaking impossible. Cognitively I cannot do it. I just didn't notice it in the interrogation or her interviews. She uses her hands a lot when she speaks so that's what I was looking at, not the photos. Maybe she cut her finger and the muscles are weak?

I still don't understand how she over powered him and also how she didn't get cut way worse.

 

[Mellinyce]

I'm not double jointed but to constantly and voluntarily have to keep that finger in that "mangled" position every single day cuz she know WE ARE WATCHING...wouldn't that be hard to do? I think she cut it while viciously stabbing Travis...that's it..period..finito

 

[G&AMom]

I don't think the identity of the person was revealed, if so, I've missed it, but in JA's mother's interview with LE, she spoke about getting a phone call from a male 'friend' of JA's who stated she was acting out so badly that he had called a hotline and was notifying her family of her outrageous behavior. Apparently someone had their eye on the ball.
JA kept her life and TA private, in ridiculous ways, according to her mother.
Monday morning quarterbacking those who didn't prevent her from killing Travis doesn't solve anything either. IMO.

Supposedly it was Bobby Juarez that made that call. I don't have a link or anything, so obviously you should take that with a grain of salt.

O/T I'm listening to my local Fire/EMS radio scanner (because my son is a volunteer EMT but he didn't have to answer this call) and they just had to answer a call to a suicide, a jumper. A lot of radio traffic making sure the responders are okay. When you think of all the time, attention & money that is lavished on JA, it just breaks your heart.

 

[inthedark14]

Nope. Not if part of her master plan is to die.

I guess prison is not one of the "1000 places to see before you die" eh? :giggle:

I don't honestly think that she ever planned to die...I don't think she has that in her...I don't doubt for a second that should couldn't have pulled that off in jail all these years, if she really wanted to. Those who want to die can find a way.

 

[kaRN]

True but our good old system wouldn't let her starve herself, they'd insert a feeding tube.

How pleasant for her and very deserving. Can I put it in? Can I????? :whipper:

 

[kaRN]

I believe I read because she got ill.

Cancer I believe.

 

[tomato]

Health reasons. Something quite serious, the rumor mill says.

Thanks! I thought Dr. Carp dropped out from the case because she did not want to testify for JA. :drumroll:

 

[ClosArgs]

The one issue that troubles me about this case is JA was understood by her lover Travis and her friends as being different. She did things that were not normal. Yet she was used as a three hole wonder.
Who is responsible here? Did Travis ever meet JA's parents? Was anyone ever contacted when JA's behavior became symptomatic? JA was a perfect storm ready to erupt having a relationship go terribly wrong.
To sit back after the fact and call her a monster and all the names I have heard doesn't solve this problem.

I don't understand this line of thought. Are you saying JA has no responsibility for her own actions? This is a woman of above average intelligence, so how does it equate to TA and friends being responsible for her behavior? She was not psychotic and she was not low intelligence. How do you hold TA as responsible for her decisions?