Wendy Murphy: Klonopin + pineapple?

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"Zonked out",yes, thanx,that makes a lot of sense.It sounds like she was more than just asleep,or so the R's would have us beleive.
Someone mentioned the My Twinn Doll as well.I wonder if that was what was used to hit her on the head with,instead of the flashlight,and maybe that's why PR asked for it back and it mysteriously disappeared.I wonder if the head of a doll being large like the end of a flashlight,while the body being slim like a flashlight,could have caused the same type of injury?This is only speculation on my part.But since JB wasn't really all that thrilled with it,perhaps it was a point of contention between them.
 
halycon said:
I heard Wendy Murphy on a radio talk show recently. She had just read through the police questioning of the Ramseys and asked some interesting questions. I don't know this case as well as the rest of you, so I will throw this open. I love Wendy on TV and know she's a victim's advocate and former prosecutor, so I'm guessing she may know more than the average bear.

Wendy began by stating that the undigested pineapple is the most important evidence in this case.

She said since JB had undigested pineapple in her belly, we know it means she ate it within approximately two hours of death and that no pineapple was served at Fleet White's party. A bowl of pineapple was found on the dining table in the Ramsey home when police arrived on the 26th.

So her first point: We can assume the contents of the pineapple bowl were tested because there was undigested pineapple in the child's belly, even though the results of this test have never been made public.

Her next, more subtle point: Why would both John and Patsy Ramsey adamantly insist that they did NOT give JB pineapple? Patsy's and Burke's fingerprints were on the bowl, yet both claim if anyone gave the child pineapple, it had to be the intruder. John was zealous in proposing this excuse to explain how JB might have had an opportunity to eat the fruit after the got home that night around 9:30. In fact, he came up with it on the day AFTER he was first asked about the pineapple and he explained that he got the idea from his attorney.

Wendy continued with: Given that there is nothing sinister about giving a child pineapple, and given the obvious connection of that bowl, Patsy's fingerprints and the undigested pineapple in JB's belly, it's more than apparent that their firm resistance to admitting that they gave the pineapple to JB is that they KNEW it contained a sedative (something we would know was NOT true if it WERE untrue).

This sedative idea is not speculative because in the same general location of the police interrogation of John Ramsey, John was also asked about drugs in the home -- in particular, whether he was aware that Patsy was taking Klonopin.

John said no, but the interesting thing about Klonopin is that it can cause seizures in kids.

Wendy added that she doesn't believe there were no drugs in the JB's system -- it isn't even reasonable to believe there was ONLY one toxicology exam because some screening tests only look for certain drugs, and then more tox screens are done subsequently to look for additional specifically identified drugs. So it may very well be the case that drugs were found -- and I'm guessing they found evidence of Klonopin -- or at least some type of anti-depressant/anti-anxiety drug given the vast number of questions asked of both Rams during their 1998 police interviews.

Wendy continued with: How does asking them about the meds they were taking translate to the police found drugs in JB's body? The short answer is: Any reasonable lawyer would easily instruct their client to refuse to answer such a probling question and easily persuade the police not to ASK such an intrusive question -- unless the information was truly important and highly relevant to the investigation. Thus, the very fact that they were asked and answered all the questions about the drugs they were using in telling.

Wendy's last point: Why on earth would the Rams drug the child prior to the abuse and accidental strangulation?

She offered this obvious answer -- kiddie *advertiser censored* victims are often sedated to make them compliant -- and to be sure, sedation would be especially necessary if the *advertiser censored* was going to be S&M style that night, which the garrote and cords around her wrists suggest.

I believe that there is a much simpler explanation for the Ramseys to lie about the pineapple: it would have destroyed their time line of alleged events.
For their initial explanation was that JB had been asleep when they got home, and that they put her to bed asleep. Imo when putting together their story, they had no idea that the ingested pineapple would turn out to be a silent witness, disproving their allegations.
 
englishleigh said:
Wendy may be onto something here, but I personally think she is baiting Lin Wood and John Ramsey to sue her, and then she is going to refuse to settle with them, and force John Ramsey into a court of law where tough questions are going to be asked of him. Go, Wendy!!!!!


Wendy represents an absurd excuse for a lawyer. But that is what tier-four law schools often produce.

If Wendy was ever taken to Court for libel and/or slander and/or defamation, she would lose huge.

Wendy's recent defamation of John Ramsey would almost assuredly come under the "per se" provision (statutory presumption of damage). Wendy would have to establish the truth behind her slanderous and mindless statements, and she could never do that.

Because she is a lawyer, the Judge would bury her.
 
SuperDave said:
Did anyone read the side effects of Klonopin?

Outbursts of anger...agitation...bizarre behavior...etc.

I may be wrong... (My husband says that he thinks he remembers that I was wrong once...but that was back in 1968...:p ), but from rereading the PR transcripts last evening, I got the impression that ativan was used by PR prior to and after JBR's murder, but that she didn't begin the Knopopin until after the murder... When this caffine roller coaster running through my brain settles down I will go back and double check the transcripts....
 
I agree wholeheartedly with you Wudge. Anybody wonder what Wendy Murphy is on?
Amy

Wudge said:
Wendy represents an absurd excuse for a lawyer. But that is what tier-four law schools often produce.

If Wendy was ever taken to Court for libel and/or slander and/or defamation, she would lose huge.

Wendy's recent defamation of John Ramsey would almost assuredly come under the "per se" provision (statutory presumption of damage). Wendy would have to establish the truth behind her slanderous and mindless statements, and she could never do that.

Because she is a lawyer, the Judge would bury her.
 
rashomon said:
I believe that there is a much simpler explanation for the Ramseys to lie about the pineapple: it would have destroyed their time line of alleged events.
For their initial explanation was that JB had been asleep when they got home, and that they put her to bed asleep. Imo when putting together their story, they had no idea that the ingested pineapple would turn out to be a silent witness, disproving their allegations.
:banghead: I just hate it when the simplest of answers is right in front of my face and my 'anal'ytical brain goes around the World in search of a more Difficult answer. :doh:

;) Thank you for this post, rashomon!
 
Googled for side effects of Klonopin:

Found:
1 Genitourinary:
Dysuria (Painful or difficult urination), dysuria may also reflect inflammation of the vagina (vaginitis)
Enuresis (bedwetting

So maybe all those genitourinary tract complaints that Patsy took JonBenet to see Dr Beuf didn't have the innocent (bubblebath, not wiping properly, 25% bedwetting rate amongst 6 year olds) explanations after all?

2 Respiratory:
Chest congestion, rhinorrhea, shortness of breath, hypersecretion in upper respiratory passages.
Dr. Beuf says he last saw JonBenet Ramsey in November 1996, and that was a checkup for a sinus infection.

He also treated her for stuffy nose, bad breath which he put down to 'allergic rhinitis' and treated with benadryl. Maybe it wasn't that at all - just another side effect of Klonopin?

I don't suppose investigators tried to correlate the appearances of these symptoms in JonBenet with the business trip absences of her father did they?
 
LaMer, I don't know the radio station. I was driving cross country. Satellite maybe? It was all I could do to scribble down what she was saying.
 
Klonopin (or clonizapem) is dispensed as an anti-depressant and/or sedative, but it is actually a medication originally designed as an anti-seizure medication, according to the PDR. My mom takes it, and I've researched it in a lot of resources and web sites.
 
Abrasive intercourse can also cause inflammation of the urethra, which is common among women, causing frequent and painful urination.
 
I like to keep it simple... Google... Stevie Nicks Klonopin.

I am afraid for all who take this dangerous drug.
 
halycon said:
I heard Wendy Murphy on a radio talk show recently. She had just read through the police questioning of the Ramseys and asked some interesting questions. I don't know this case as well as the rest of you, so I will throw this open. I love Wendy on TV and know she's a victim's advocate and former prosecutor, so I'm guessing she may know more than the average bear.

Wendy began by stating that the undigested pineapple is the most important evidence in this case.

She said since JB had undigested pineapple in her belly, we know it means she ate it within approximately two hours of death and that no pineapple was served at Fleet White's party. A bowl of pineapple was found on the dining table in the Ramsey home when police arrived on the 26th.

So her first point: We can assume the contents of the pineapple bowl were tested because there was undigested pineapple in the child's belly, even though the results of this test have never been made public.

Her next, more subtle point: Why would both John and Patsy Ramsey adamantly insist that they did NOT give JB pineapple? Patsy's and Burke's fingerprints were on the bowl, yet both claim if anyone gave the child pineapple, it had to be the intruder. John was zealous in proposing this excuse to explain how JB might have had an opportunity to eat the fruit after the got home that night around 9:30. In fact, he came up with it on the day AFTER he was first asked about the pineapple and he explained that he got the idea from his attorney.

Wendy continued with: Given that there is nothing sinister about giving a child pineapple, and given the obvious connection of that bowl, Patsy's fingerprints and the undigested pineapple in JB's belly, it's more than apparent that their firm resistance to admitting that they gave the pineapple to JB is that they KNEW it contained a sedative (something we would know was NOT true if it WERE untrue).

This sedative idea is not speculative because in the same general location of the police interrogation of John Ramsey, John was also asked about drugs in the home -- in particular, whether he was aware that Patsy was taking Klonopin.

John said no, but the interesting thing about Klonopin is that it can cause seizures in kids.

Wendy added that she doesn't believe there were no drugs in the JB's system -- it isn't even reasonable to believe there was ONLY one toxicology exam because some screening tests only look for certain drugs, and then more tox screens are done subsequently to look for additional specifically identified drugs. So it may very well be the case that drugs were found -- and I'm guessing they found evidence of Klonopin -- or at least some type of anti-depressant/anti-anxiety drug given the vast number of questions asked of both Rams during their 1998 police interviews.

Wendy continued with: How does asking them about the meds they were taking translate to the police found drugs in JB's body? The short answer is: Any reasonable lawyer would easily instruct their client to refuse to answer such a probling question and easily persuade the police not to ASK such an intrusive question -- unless the information was truly important and highly relevant to the investigation. Thus, the very fact that they were asked and answered all the questions about the drugs they were using in telling.

Wendy's last point: Why on earth would the Rams drug the child prior to the abuse and accidental strangulation?

She offered this obvious answer -- kiddie *advertiser censored* victims are often sedated to make them compliant -- and to be sure, sedation would be especially necessary if the *advertiser censored* was going to be S&M style that night, which the garrote and cords around her wrists suggest.
thats ridiculous imo- there is another explanation-patsy is on meds and has a very bad short term memory-she might not have recalled having given JBR pineapple-and i think in fact her meds effected alot of her decisions..
They test for drugs in her system and there were none..
the other possibility is burke gave JBR the pineapple
and didnt want to admit it at first-or did and the ramseys are covering up that part knowing how it could look and also knowing it was not an inside job
my point is argue for any position and its yours-thats why this forum exists-there are alot of positions
 
Patsy was put on Klonopin after JonBenet's death...and JonBenet did have toxicological tests done....nothing found. It's right there in the Autopsy report.

Let's get back to Earth and stop discussing Child *advertiser censored*...or Child *advertiser censored* Ring...it's ludicrous. The Ramseys did not sell their daughter to pedophiles! Good Grief!!!

JonBenet's death was an accident..and then turned into a coverup. Whomever was molesting JonBenet had access to her that day and possibly a few days before her death.

A six-year-old is sheltered by her parents and does not have the free will to go places...and to go with people without her parents approval or guidance. The only person I believe touched JonBenet is Burke...but I would call that "playing doctor"....that is what LHP said when she caught the two in the act. So it stands to reason that if they played doctor once, they'll play it again. Before I get sued by Burke...this is a statement by LHP, not me.

Enough of the Child Kiddie *advertiser censored* ring "bussiness"...it's getting old.
 
Toltec said:
Patsy was put on Klonopin after JonBenet's death...and JonBenet did have toxicological tests done....nothing found. It's right there in the Autopsy report.

Let's get back to Earth and stop discussing Child *advertiser censored*...or Child *advertiser censored* Ring...it's ludicrous. The Ramseys did not sell their daughter to pedophiles! Good Grief!!!

JonBenet's death was an accident..and then turned into a coverup. Whomever was molesting JonBenet had access to her that day and possibly a few days before her death.

A six-year-old is sheltered by her parents and does not have the free will to go places...and to go with people without her parents approval or guidance. The only person I believe touched JonBenet is Burke...but I would call that "playing doctor"....that is what LHP said when she caught the two in the act. So it stands to reason that if they played doctor once, they'll play it again. Before I get sued by Burke...this is a statement by LHP, not me.

Enough of the Child Kiddie *advertiser censored* ring "bussiness"...it's getting old.
The one major reason I don't believe there was a *advertiser censored* ring or *advertiser censored* pictures is that Patsy definitely had JB in training for Miss America and there's no way she would have wanted or allowed pictures to exist that would have ruined JB"s chances of the Miss America title.
 
Hrrmmmm Aussie... I hate to say it but I am slowing coming around to your theory. Maybe not kiddie *advertiser censored* as such... but definitely something dodgy.
 
"As for Wendy Murphy... She is usually right on the money...I ususally give her "two thumbs up"...but I sure wish some intelligent Public Relations person would tell her she needs to turn the volume down on her vocal ranting...She hurts my ears!"

I love her! To be honest, some of her more speculative work is a little odd, but she never claims them to be facts.

"Wendy's recent defamation of John Ramsey would almost assuredly come under the "per se" provision (statutory presumption of damage). Wendy would have to establish the truth behind her slanderous and mindless statements, and she could never do that."

You may not like her, but don't ever underestimate her. She'd destroy Wood in a suit. She'd rip his spaldings off and hand them to him in a Tupperware container.
 
SuperDave said:
SNIP

She'd destroy Wood in a suit. She'd rip his spaldings off and hand them to him in a Tupperware container.


Dave, that comes across as naive kindergarten talk. Wendy has the same massive exposure as do people posting in this forum who state they know (or otherwise express absolute certainly) that one or more of the Ramseys murdered JonBenet or committed a heinous sex crime against her person. Even worse for Wendy would be the fact that she is a lawyer. The Judge would nuke her.

In a trial, Wendy or others would have to establish their statement(s) to be true. Do you really think Steve Thomas settled his libel suit by establishing his ridiculous defamation to be the truth?

For his defamatory efforts, Steve Thomas got whacked over his head with a hard reality check.

A lot of people should wise up.
 
Gozgals said:
Klonopin is used to treat Epilepsy and various seizure disorders too.

Just so everyone is aware this drug is used to treat various disease states.

GG
My son takes it for his epilepsy from time to time. But it is more for the anxiety that often accompanies his disorder.
 
"As for Wendy Murphy... :clap:

SuperDave said:
You may not like her, but don't ever underestimate her. She'd destroy Wood in a suit. She'd rip his spaldings off and hand them to him in a Tupperware container.
:clap: Good one, Dave!

And Wudge... I know you have a sense of humor lurking in there some where...

Your comment back to Dave actually reminded me of the old Satruday Nigh live skit... "Jane, You ignorant S---!..."

IMO, as 'ignorant' as some here might think it is, if you take the cameras off of Wendy Murphy and put her in a courtroom, she would be a force to be dealt with...
 
I believe the most logical explanation for why the Rams lied about the pineapple is that it would indicate that she died earlier rather than later. It obscures time of death. It is unlikely they fed her pineapple at, say, 3 am, thus putting t.o.d. at about 5. But if the death is set earlier, they are closer to being implicated.

As for the garotte, I've never thought that it was staging but was rather the initial cause of unconsciousness and then the blow to the head was to finish her off. The reason I think this is that I believe she was garotted before the ransom note was written. The note warns that if the Rams don't follow orders, she will be BEHEADED. What a strange thing to say. I think "they" thought that they might be cutting her head off to cover up the garotting (cut at the point of ligature). Something caused this plan to be aborted, either that they couldn't go through with it or ran out of time, or maybe someone called the damned police too early.
 

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