What facts point to Kaine's lack of involvement in Kyron's disappearance?

[Haeve]

IF this is what happened or the reason for the RO then that would be considered a medical issue so that would give the justification not to release the 911 tapes.

I take it 911 tapes fall under HIPAA?

 

[NewsMuse]

The email to his fellow employees and his body language during the pressers made me feel there could be control issues. (Wonder what Desiree could say about this?)

My ex was a control freak and verbally abusive, and I can usually spot the victims a mile away. (As a matter of fact, that used to be part of my job in patient counseling prior to a procedure -- the observation and documentation of signs of possible abuse. For example: I always spoke TO the patient and she might look at husband/s.o before answering or HE would answer for her.)

Not knowing any more than I know now and seeing the way TH acted in public during the pressers took me back and made me wonder if that was how I looked or acted in public with ex. I knew that when we left wherever we were, I would be lectured the whole way home on every single thing HE thought I did wrong.

I do believe TH knows much more but is afraid to speak out. It's interesting to remember that her own bio-son moved out 6-7 months ago. I remember 16-17 yo as the beginning of the "tough" years with the boys; and possibly with a step-dad who might be a control freak and maybe verbally abusive, someone (?) felt it was best for him to live elsewhere (especially if he was trying to stick up for his bio-mom). Again, just tossing stuff around and MOO.

There are so many other little nuances I observed during the pressers , but it could just be guilt. Or maybe Kyron's daddy thinks he's so much smarter than LE. I also wondered, well, it's a delicate topic -- TH's looks have changed a great deal since her body-building days. I just remember that being a huge issue with my ex, the lack of control he had over that part; thus the verbal abuse.

With the divorce papers and RO done and sealed in the manner they were, it makes me wonder if they were in the works for a while except to sign and date. An engineer is a planner. I wonder what info (besides the poly, I mean) came to light so suddenly to convince the judge to seal? Also is this info enough for a wiretap and some type of listening/recording devices in the home and also with bio-dad? I wouldn't think LE would rule out any of the immediate family (given what we know today).

Again, JMHO (am a bit biased on the control issues area). I just want Kyron home and def more time with his bio-mom if possible and appropriate.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Here is proof that LE doesn't think Kaine is dangerous and therefore, was unlikely to have harmed his child:

A judge signed off on a restraining order allowing Kaine to be the only adult who has unrestricted parental rights to his toddler.

The judge could have ordered Child/Youth Services to put the toddler in protective custody when Kaine applied for a RO if LE had suggested that Kaine was dangerous to his children.

Most cases LE has nothing to do with getting the initial emergency restraining order.

They probably never even knew he was doing that.

 

[razorback]

I take it 911 tapes fall under HIPAA?

If it has anything to do with a medical issue yes.

 

[PortlandMama]

I don't know if anyone remembers this , it may be nothing, or I may even have got it wrong. Im pretty sure it was the interview with DY and KH.

When KH said that he and TH went to the bus stop to get Kyron. Kyron didn't get off the bus. This is where Im unsure-- I thought I heard KH say that he began to walk to the school with the baby,(thinking that Kyron may have misunderstood and was waiting at the school) and realized TH was talking to the bus driver, the bus driver called the school, and then they ran home.

How far is the bus stop from the school ? How long would it take to walk there from the bus stop? Anyone find it strange that KH didn't panic at first but that it was TH that asked the driver to call the school?

I think this is what you're referring to: http://www.kgw.com/video/featured-videos/Raw-Kyrons-parents-talk-about-bus-stop-97168909.html

I interpreted it to mean he started walking with the baby up the road back to their house to get in the car to drive to the school, and as he overheard her talking to the bus driver he suddenly understood that Kyron was really missing altogether, not just waiting for them at the school in a misunderstanding about where they would leave from for their ice cream treat. So then he broke into a run toward the car in a panic. It would be a very, very long walk to the school from the house so I'm 99.9% sure that's not what he was referring to.

 

[human]

[/B]

LE would not have been involved in the RO hearing, all it would take was Kaine testifying to the judge why he felt he needed to get the baby out of there. He would not need backup for his story at that point to get the emergency RO. Now when they do go to court on the RO she will be there and can testify and he could use any backup then.

I think if the judge sealed the RO because it might impact an investigation, the judge called LE. I don't think a judge would make a determination to take the three children from Terri's ability to see them unless he had a darn good reason.

 

[txsvicki]

There doesn't seem to be anything that points to Kaine in the disappearance, but a few things have stood out as to what might have been going on in the home before. The statement that Kyron was "actively being worked with to listen and obey" was strange wording. If Terri is so unstable as to need a restraining order now against seeing her kids then what was she like a few months ago. I wonder if there were disagreements about how to handle the kids, if her education was considered expert in child rearing, and if he made her do it all knowing that there were big problems. I can't help but wonder if Kyron was pretty harshly disciplined.

 

[Emma Peel]

I think this family has a secret.

I think that secret is so big the RO is nothing compared to it. It is not enough to make someone talk.

I think the grounds he got the RO were threats of suicide by TH.

I think she will get the child back in court.

emma likes secrets but only if she knows them.
so spill!
:angel:

 

[Mylou]

Thanks PortlandMama, I tried to find that link and was finding everything but....
You are correct it does appear he may have meant walking to the car, which I assume was at home, and not walking to the school. Thanks!

 

[human]

If TH was threatening suicide, she would have been taken to a hospital for observation at the very least.

I don't think in this situation, people would have shrugged it off, if they ever do.

 

[CarmelEyesD]

If he already suspected at that point that Terri was responsible, then it wouldn't surprise me if he seemed "freaked out". He certainly knew that he was not free to say anything to that effect, and yet if that's what he was thinking, it was surely the number one thing on his mind. Plus I'm sure he (and Terri and Desiree and her husband) had been given a dizzying set of "don'ts" by LE, re details that should not be revealed in the press conference, and that would make anyone nervous, even it wasn't a situation where their thoughts were consumed with the recent disappearance of their child. Look what happened to the school principal when he said one "wrong" word in a press conference -- LE practically tackled him to get him away from the mike.

Is there a link to that? I missed it...TIA

 

[Dr.Fessel]

I think if the judge sealed the RO because it might impact an investigation, the judge called LE. I don't think a judge would make a determination to take the three children from Terri's ability to see them unless he had a darn good reason.

They do it everyday across the country in these emergency restraining orders. All you need to do is get up in front of a judge and swear to stuff that might be true or a lie but the judge has to grant it as long as you say the right thing.

Now in the hearing coming up on the restraining order both sides will have to give evidence to their side of the story.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

If TH was threatening suicide, she would have been taken to a hospital for observation at the very least.

I don't think in this situation, people would have shrugged it off, if they ever do.

The police would ask her, are you suicidal or are you having suicidal thoughts. If she said no and then said all I said was I feel like I could kill myself but I never meant it and am not going to they probably would not take her.

Just want to remind people we have no idea what he said to get the restraining order and I am just guessing on the possible suicide threat.

 

[human]

They do it everyday across the country in these emergency restraining orders. All you need to do is get up in front of a judge and swear to stuff that might be true or a lie but the judge has to grant it as long as you say the right thing.

Now in the hearing coming up on the restraining order both sides will have to give evidence to their side of the story.

Well, I don't know how easy it is. I tried to get one against a teenager once and nothing happened. He was climbing into my house by a second story deck, among other things. The kid was quite well connected in my city-his uncle was a big time judge. Maybe that's why.

Anyway, this one has been sealed because it might impact an investigation. That is so totally different.

I would think that a judge would have to ask LE some questions before doing something like that. But how would I know for sure? I don't.

 

[human]

The police would ask her, are you suicidal or are you having suicidal thoughts. If she said no and then said all I said was I feel like I could kill myself but I never meant it and am not going to they probably would not take her.

Just want to remind people we have no idea what he said to get the restraining order and I am just guessing on the possible suicide threat.

Then there would be no need for an RO based on her suicidal thoughts, would there.

I don't think LE are qualified to make judgments about someone being suicidal or not.

I just don't buy the suicide thing at all.

 

[Pensfan]

The email to his fellow employees and his body language during the pressers made me feel there could be control issues. (Wonder what Desiree could say about this?)

My ex was a control freak and verbally abusive, and I can usually spot the victims a mile away. (As a matter of fact, that used to be part of my job in patient counseling prior to a procedure -- the observation and documentation of signs of possible abuse. For example: I always spoke TO the patient and she might look at husband/s.o before answering or HE would answer for her.)

Not knowing any more than I know now and seeing the way TH acted in public during the pressers took me back and made me wonder if that was how I looked or acted in public with ex. I knew that when we left wherever we were, I would be lectured the whole way home on every single thing HE thought I did wrong.

I do believe TH knows much more but is afraid to speak out. It's interesting to remember that her own bio-son moved out 6-7 months ago. I remember 16-17 yo as the beginning of the "tough" years with the boys; and possibly with a step-dad who might be a control freak and maybe verbally abusive, someone (?) felt it was best for him to live elsewhere (especially if he was trying to stick up for his bio-mom). Again, just tossing stuff around and MOO.

There are so many other little nuances I observed during the pressers , but it could just be guilt. Or maybe Kyron's daddy thinks he's so much smarter than LE. I also wondered, well, it's a delicate topic -- TH's looks have changed a great deal since her body-building days. I just remember that being a huge issue with my ex, the lack of control he had over that part; thus the verbal abuse.

With the divorce papers and RO done and sealed in the manner they were, it makes me wonder if they were in the works for a while except to sign and date. An engineer is a planner. I wonder what info (besides the poly, I mean) came to light so suddenly to convince the judge to seal? Also is this info enough for a wiretap and some type of listening/recording devices in the home and also with bio-dad? I wouldn't think LE would rule out any of the immediate family (given what we know today).

Again, JMHO (am a bit biased on the control issues area). I just want Kyron home and def more time with his bio-mom if possible and appropriate.

Some people become control freaks to control/manage their anxiety. By trying to control others, they are fighting their own feelings of helplessness. Everyone manages anxiety differently just like everyone grieves differently.

 

[BlOnDe_GuRrL]

Something stinks about Kaine... I've been thinking that since the first PR. He just looks painfully guilty of something.... not saying he did anything to Kyron... but I'm willing to bet he's done or knows something. I'm leaning more towards the affair rumor, but it's just that.

I also still do not suspect Terri... can't quite put my finger on why not... but I think her resistance and shadiness has something to do with the "dark secret" and not Kyron.
I hope she sues the crap out of the SO/media if this turns around and she's proven innocent. Also, I think the RO was probably taken out against her because she snapped. If I was being accused of something so horrible, I would've snapped long ago... and probably threaten to shoot the next person that points a finger... just sayin'

 

[Pensfan]

Then there would be no need for an RO based on her suicidal thoughts, would there.

I don't think LE are qualified to make judgments about someone being suicidal or not.

I just don't buy the suicide thing at all.

bbm No, but they have the authority to take people to be assessed by a health practitioner for involuntary commitment and they do so on a pretty frequent basis (at least in my city).

If Kaine had wanted Terri to get a few days in the locked psych unit, he could have told LE that Terri was suicidal. LE would take her or send her in an ambulance to the ER associated with that ambulance service. If Kaine could convince the ER doc or Nurse Practitioner that Terri was suicidal, she would have been involuntarily committed for 48-72 hours.
http://www.suu.edu/hss/psychology/practicum/InvoluntaryCommitmentLaws.html

 

[scandi]

Was there ever an explanation given by the media as to why the two switched vehicles that morning? It has been speculated on here that Terri needed the truck to transport Kyron's project, I think. So, when were they supposed to switch vehicles again, if in fact they did. I think it is interesting that it was reported by media that a friend said Terri told her that she had done everything that Kaine had told her to do from the beginning of this case. I know that is hearsay, but so much we hear in the media is hearsay or totally erroneous information about this case. I agree with others that Kaine's behavior has been somewhat suspicious.

No, I just wondered what was up with that. I think you have learned much more than I, even if from the media. I hadn't heard that. Hmmmmmmmm xox

 

[human]

bbm No, but they have the authority to take people to be assessed by a health practitioner for involuntary commitment and they do so on a pretty frequent basis (at least in my city).

If Kaine had wanted Terri to get a few days in the locked psych unit, he could have told LE that Terri was suicidal. LE would take her or send her in an ambulance to the ER associated with that ambulance service. If Kaine could convince the ER doc or Nurse Practitioner that Terri was suicidal, she would have been involuntarily committed for 48-72 hours.
http://www.suu.edu/hss/psychology/practicum/InvoluntaryCommitmentLaws.html

Yup, I totally agree.

That's what I meant about LE not being qualified to make a determination. They let the medical profession decide that.