Who Could Get Kyron Out of School More Easily (Unseen)? Terri or another person?

[gitana1]

ETA to SmoothOperator

Exactly, nothing has to be complicated...unless Kyron didn't want to go with someone, like a stranger. I am not getting the elaborate means needed for him to leave with TH or go seperately to the truck...none! I can also understand why nobody would notice. I see simple, where others don't...doesn't mean one is more right than the other & we don't know what the others have said or IF there are other, not that you are saying that...just adding that.

I believe TH is responsible for whatever befell Kyron. But this aspect of the case has always bothered me. Sure, TH could have easily taken Kyron quickly and quietly from the school without being noticed. I think another person, whether stranger or not, could have as well because Kyron was known as a quiet, shy child. best kind of kid for a predator to snatch because they don't fight.
However, assuming TH set this up, it makes little sense because even though she (if guilty) got him out of there, possibly unnoticed, how could she have known no one would see her? She couldn't. Very risky plan IMO.
Nevertheless, it would be even riskier for a stranger because if spotted, someone could try to stop him, he could be caught. But if someone spotted TH and she was aware that they did, she could simply abort the plan and say she was taking Kyron to the doctors.
In any event, I believe that eventually we will find out how it happened. I also believe we will find that somehow, it was TH who did it or arranged it.

 

[STEADFAST]

Just a reference pic of the landscaping that someone could use as cover:

http://news.opb.org/article/7528-schols-make-changes-search-7-year-old-student-continues/

 

[Kimster]

The terrain isn't as thick as it looks in the above pic. After walking around the school grounds today, I have to say that it seems a bit difficult to get out of there without being seen. I have to wonder if LE has witnesses that say they saw Kyron leave with TH now and haven't updated us with that information?

http://s876.photobucket.com/albums/...August 2010/?action=view&current=100_1460.jpg

There are large bushes around, as in the pic above. But they are separated by well maintained open areas too.

 

[STEADFAST]

The terrain isn't as thick as it looks in the above pic. After walking around the school grounds today, I have to say that it seems a bit difficult to get out of there without being seen. I have to wonder if LE has witnesses that say they saw Kyron leave with TH now and haven't updated us with that information?

http://s876.photobucket.com/albums/ab324/sym4sar/Kyron%20-%20August%202010/?action=view&current=100_1460.jpg

There are large bushes around, as in the pic above. But they are separated by well maintained open areas too.

Thanks for the pics, Kimster. It was hard to find non-aerial pictures of the school.
I've wondered also about whether they've got witnesses to much more that happened at the school and its grounds and parking area than we know of. They did say in the June 13 presser that they would not need to find Kyron in order to make an arrest.

 

[pufnstuf]

The terrain isn't as thick as it looks in the above pic. After walking around the school grounds today, I have to say that it seems a bit difficult to get out of there without being seen. I have to wonder if LE has witnesses that say they saw Kyron leave with TH now and haven't updated us with that information?

http://s876.photobucket.com/albums/...August 2010/?action=view&current=100_1460.jpg

There are large bushes around, as in the pic above. But they are separated by well maintained open areas too.

I do believe that's so. Not based on anything more than my opinion and the fact that Gates said that LE wouldn't release anything of investigative importance unless it would help with the case.

My feeling is that they don't need any more help with that part of the case. They've not asked for help on that since the first Terri questionnaire went out, if I remember correctly.

 

[Calliope]

What has been verified? Certainly not all of Terri's alibis that day are verified (unless they are verified as being false). So, not only the ones we're privy to, but what else have LE been told about her day that they have been in the process of sussing out?

I guess it is verified that part of of Terri's Travels that day include a trip or two to FM. (The fact that she had a receipt from at least one FM store COULD mean she was the one making the purchase of whatever, whenever). She was seen at one FM by a woman who is now a Grand Jury witness, and she apparently went to the gym with her sick baby.

That leaves hours unaccounted for. I have faith in LE that these unverified times are being filled in with the truth; not the ridiculous and weak explanations that Terri has tried to put forth.

My OPINIONS

bbm

when taking travel time to and from the FM to skyline area where she meandered around to soothe baby and then back to gym, according to Free that shaves about 40 minutes off her time driving about.

So we're not talking about 'hours' unaccounted for, but rather less than one hour.

 

[Calliope]

Was anyone toting around a large bin or duffel bag that day (ostensibly to transport a project)? Is it possible this was an accident committed by someone else, and realizing Kyron was obviously dead, they covered it up?

While we're considering possibilities...What if Kyron was killed at the school and removed later but before the searches? Were cadaver dogs used inside the school?

sbm

How long does it take cadaver scent to appear after death? What circumstances and conditions would delay or disguise it?

 

[PaulaF513]

I'm not sure we know that to be true.

I believe that TP said he saw TH leaving without Kyron

 

[AbbieNormal]

I think Terri got Kyron out of that school without a care in the world and drove off with him in the truck. It was a chaotic day and I think people might have been around but didn't really notice them. She was supposedly a frequent presence in the school, therefore "not really noticeable", as in standing out. Nothing unusual about a mom walking her kid to heir own car. Nothing anybody would question. I think Terri knew this and brazenly just walked him out. Or asked him to meet her at another door so it appeared *advertiser censored* if she left alone. JMO

 

[jadejazzkayla]

I think Terri got Kyron out of that school without a care in the world and drove off with him in the truck. It was a chaotic day and I think people might have been around but didn't really notice them. She was supposedly a frequent presence in the school, therefore "not really noticeable", as in standing out. Nothing unusual about a mom walking her kid to heir own car. Nothing anybody would question. I think Terri knew this and brazenly just walked him out. Or asked him to meet her at another door so it appeared *advertiser censored* if she left alone. JMO

first bbm...i just can't imagine anyone who would kidnap a child - knowing kyron's face would be all over the news by the next day - thinking that no one would remember them.

second bbm....i also can't buy that a kidnapper would trust a 7 year to "not be seen" waiting at an exit door. "hey kyron, why are you standing near that exit door.?"

In either case - witnesses would only have to think back to the previous day and if someone remembered anything - the gig would be up.

 

[jadejazzkayla]

I think I do (at least an LE quote that Terri was not seen at the school after she was seen with Kyron), but I'm going to have to search for it, and I can't do that right now -- will get back to this later this evening.

steadfast - Did you find any links about these quotes? i searched and couldn't find a link that states - No one saw her (terri) leaving alone.

and i couldn't find a quote where LE says that Terri was not seen at the school after she was seen with Kyron either.

Calliope posted up in this thread that she thinks we don't know this is true either. (re: the first quote)

Maybe they are rumors. I'll check the rumor thread and see if the info is there. edit: the rumor thread was locked back in june. I didn't realize that. sorry.

 

[SurfieTX]

It would be easier for her. If the Turf guy is just now being interviewed, that means that no one mentioned him. He was on a mower. He STOOD OUT. She didn't and neither did Kyron.

 

[jadejazzkayla]

It would be easier for her. If the Turf guy is just now being interviewed, that means that no one mentioned him. He was on a mower. He STOOD OUT. She didn't and neither did Kyron.

I don't think we can assume that LE didn't interview the turf guy until recently and I don't think we can assume no one at the school saw the turf guy either.

and I can't buy that Terri and Kyron didn't stand out - when shortly after his kidnapping his face was all over the news. witnesses would only have to think back to june 4th.

 

[lynmaree]

I personally think it would have been much easier for Terri to get him out than anyone else...I too have to agree that we are overthinking this step and going around in circles...it is the entire premise of the term "hide in plain siight". Human beings only notice and make mental notes of things that stand out to them as strange or outside the norm... seeing a familiar face with a small child walking either in or out or around a parking lot on a busy day at a school is nothing that would scream red flag to anyone...its also very possible that as an aid or sub, Terri's arrival patterns at the school werent ever consistent. Im sure many many people saw her that day and just cant differentiate it in their minds from any other day....mornings are crazy at schools and parents are almost always rushed or have an agenda...I honestly think she could have walked out with K in plain site and no one would have been the wiser or given pause

 

[Calliope]

I believe that TP said he saw TH leaving without Kyron

Yes, he did.

 

[Etilema]

...I know Turf Guy was busy, but if you're about to abduct and either murder or hide a child, you don't want to risk your entire plan because of a Turf Guy. I think he probably served as a deterrent for anyone absconding with Kyron on the access road, and then there's the chain that would've delayed a quick getaway. Turf Guy was pretty observant, seeing the children come out the back door, etc. The probability that a vehicle pulled around that side of the school, managed to get Kyron into the vehicle, and then drove on the access road totally unseen by Turf Guy at any point, has to be rather astronomical, IMHO. We're talking someone won the lotto with luck on that one, IMHO....

The truck itself would have been parked pretty much out of view of where Turf Guy was, and outside the chain (so it would not have posed difficulty, even if it had been closed, which it would not have been during the time Turf Guy was there). If he was mowing way on the other side of the soccer field, I don't think he would particularly have noticed a parent and her kids walking along there, especially when there were various people coming and going on the property that day. It would have only taken a minute or less to get from the door to the truck, and if he were facing the other way during that time, it would not have been an issue, IMHO.

All speculation and opinion on my part.

 

[Etilema]

I believe that TP said he saw TH leaving without Kyron

Even if his account is accurate (which I am not convinced of), it could easily have been TH walking to the stairwell alone (where she would then wait for Kyron to join her).

JMO

 

[Emma Peel]

IMO, Kyron could get himself out unseen, if he was told which door to use when. Risky, but he could do it. LE searched for around 10 days on that theory.

 

[Etilema]

I have obviously been working off the theory that TH left with Kyron out the north door, walked along the path to meet the truck at the access road, all out of sight of the school or other witnesses.

But the same scenario could possibly have worked for an "other person". That is, someone could have loitered around that stairwell, waiting for an opportunity to grab a kid alone. Maybe he looks like (or is) someone who would be expected to be in the school that day (looks parental, for example), so if anyone should see him he doesn't look out of place. But he stands there, hidden from view, until a kid comes up or down the stairs alone (like Kyron on his way to his classroom, which is said to be at the top of those stairs). He quickly grabs him and goes out that side door and to his waiting truck on the access road. This scenario is even more plausible when we remember that this particular door was described as being unlocked on a regular basis.

Third possibility--the scenario in the previous paragraph happened, but it wasn't a stranger, it was an accomplice. That way TH is seen leaving alone, and Kyron is seen alone before he goes missing. Perhaps she left him in the downstairs hall, saying, "I have to get baby K some medicine, so I'm leaving. Go ahead on up to your class now," indicating that particular stairwell. Then watched him walk down the hall, to make sure he did, in fact go that way. Only problem I can think of with that is that TH would then have to get back to the truck...OR take the accomplice's car from the school to meet up and get her truck back later.

All pure speculation.

 

[jadejazzkayla]

I personally think it would have been much easier for Terri to get him out than anyone else...I too have to agree that we are overthinking this step and going around in circles...it is the entire premise of the term "hide in plain siight". Human beings only notice and make mental notes of things that stand out to them as strange or outside the norm... seeing a familiar face with a small child walking either in or out or around a parking lot on a busy day at a school is nothing that would scream red flag to anyone...its also very possible that as an aid or sub, Terri's arrival patterns at the school werent ever consistent. Im sure many many people saw her that day and just cant differentiate it in their minds from any other day....mornings are crazy at schools and parents are almost always rushed or have an agenda...I honestly think she could have walked out with K in plain site and no one would have been the wiser or given pause

I understand the concept of hiding in plain site - but I can't get that a person would count on that during a heinous kidnapping. And then to have it actually work - in that Terri walked out with kyron and his face plastered over the news pretty quickly and no one remembers seeing them. I just can't get past that.

o/t if Terri did hid in plain site and walked out with kyron and no one noticed - even if they had witnessed it the previous day - how likely would it be that any witnesses who saw terri or the truck on june 4th that they would be able to identify either from a flyer distributed two weeks later on june 18th. or could say they saw terri the truck or dd from a flyer distributed 9 weeks later on aug 9th. but of course everyone has different memory capabilities.