"Who Killed JonBenet Ramsey?"

[Nehemiah]

Burke may have been involved, but the GJ did NOT come to that conclusion.

Do you know that, or is that an assumption?

 

[little1]

If the intruder was a trusted someone, enough for JBR to willingly go downstairs to have a snack of pineapple with, why would the stun gun in her bed be necessary (if you are of the stun gun belief)?

I am not leaning for the stun gun, because no one can seem to even partially agree on it. Why include evidence that I do not know was really involved?

One could also say "How did JBR eat the pineapple if she was stun gunned in the bed?

 

[BlueCrab]

Burke may have been involved, but the GJ did NOT come to that conclusion.

We don't know WHAT conclusion the GJ came to. It's all sealed.

JMO

 

[Blazeboy3]

We don't know WHAT conclusion the GJ came to. It's all sealed.
JMO

Wonder if "THE SKETCH" was discussed by the GJ(network?)? (THE SKETCH for/by the R's, but since THE R'S NO LONGER TO-DATE HAVE A (OR ANY) WEBSITE FOR INFO REGARDING WHY/WHO KILLED JONBENET)... I quess we will just have to WHAT...???

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/sh/news/stories/nat-news-20000603-195421.html

Ramseys Post Suspect Sketch Online
Likeness Based On Work Of Psychic
Molly Thompson, Staff Writer
John and Patsy Ramsey have posted a psychic's composite sketch of a suspect in their daughter's murder on their Internet site.

The sketch is based on the work of the late psychic, Dorothy Allison, who claimed to have assisted police investigations. Allison, who died last year, came up with her vision of the suspect during a 1998 appearance on a network television show.

Boulder Police Chief Mark Beckner declined to comment on the psychic's work.

The Ramsey's Web site asks: "Have you seen this man? This man may have been in the Boulder area in December 1996. ... We firmly believe that this most horrible of killers will be caught based on information provided by people who care about right and wrong. ... Please help, so another innocent child will not be a victim and another family will not suffer unbearable grief."

The Ramseys have launched a much-publicized campaign they say is aimed at finding the killer of 6-year-old JonBenet, whose body was found beaten and strangled in the basement of their Boulder home on Dec. 26, 1996.

They also say they want Boulder police to stop focusing on them as possible suspects.


http://207.36.4.219/forums/editpost.php?do=editpost&p=129006
RamseyRamseys post sketch by psychic on Web Drawing said to depict JonBenet murder suspect

Associated Press BOULDER — John and Patsy Ramsey have posted on their Internet site a psychic's composite sketch of a suspect in their daughter's strangulation.

The sketch is based on the work of the late psychic, Dorothy Allison. The Web site,

www.ramseyfamily.com, asks: "Have you seen this man? This man may have been in the Boulder area in December 1996. ... We firmly believe that this most horrible of killers will be caught based on information provided by people who care about right and wrong. ... Please help, so another innocent child will not be a victim and another family will not suffer unbearable grief."

Allison, who claimed to have assisted police investigations, came up with her vision of the suspect during an April 1998 appearance on a network television show. She died Dec. 3.

Boulder Police Chief Mark Beckner declined to comment on the psychic's work.

On Friday, a private investigator who had been working for the Ramseys announced he was quitting the case because of recent media events.

Ellis Armistead, who has quietly worked behind the scenes checking out leads, would say little Friday about his decision to resign from the case.


... WHY doesn't www.ramseyfamily.com NO LONGER EXIST??? ANSWER PLEASE? ... and don't tell me it's about the money...N/A ... OH I GET IT : "IT'S A "N E T W O R K ... THING?"...silly me :slap: :banghead: go to the above ramsey site and you get NETWORK SOLUTIONS...xxxooo

 

[BlueCrab]

BlazeBoy3,

You wondered if "Sketchman" was ever discussed by the GJ. Even though he's a product of a psychic, IMO he likely was discussed because of the resemblance of Sketchman to Mervin Pugh, the Ramsey part-time handyman and husband of housekeeper LHP.

Mervin had his own key to the Ramsey's house and when detectives visited him at his house he had 3 rolls of black duct tape, white nylon cord wrapped around a stick, plus 3 Sharpie pens and a pad of paper taken from the Ramsey's house.

The cops dismissed him as a suspect because they didn't think he was capable of writing the ransom note.

JMO

 

[Toth]

The cops dismissed him as a suspect because they didn't think he was capable of writing the ransom note.

Not capable intellectually or not capable due to alcohol?

 

[BlueCrab]

Not capable intellectually or not capable due to alcohol?

Intellectually. I think it was somewhere in Steve Thomas' book.

JMO

 

[Maxi]

Masked Man, who knew Mervin, told us that he was not literate enough to have written the ransom note.

 

[tipper]

True. But he could have known someone who was literate enough to write the note and sober enough to enter the house that evening using a key provided by Merv.

 

[Maxi]

That could go along with my two perp theory. The crime scene seems pretty stupid, with clues pointing in all directions, but the wording of the note indicates a smart writer. It's hard for me to imagine the killer carrying in the note unfolded, tho. Could it have been dictated to someone whose handwriting hasn't been tested?

 

[BlueCrab]

That could go along with my two perp theory. The crime scene seems pretty stupid, with clues pointing in all directions, but the wording of the note indicates a smart writer. It's hard for me to imagine the killer carrying in the note unfolded, tho. Could it have been dictated to someone whose handwriting hasn't been tested?

Yes, I also think the note was dictated by one person and written by a second person, and that second person HAS been tested. IMO the first person was an unknown teen, and the second person was Burke Ramsey.

It's largely a process of elimination. For many reasons one of the three Ramseys in the house that night had to be involved somehow in this killing. John was eliminated as the writer. Patsy was on the verge of being eliminated and declared to be a very low probability as being the writer.

That leaves Burke. Nothing has ever been released, officially or unofficially, about the results of Burke's handwriting analysis.

Just my opinion.

BlueCrab

 

[Blazeboy3]

Yes, I also think the note was dictated by one person and written by a second person, and that second person HAS been tested. IMO the first person was an unknown teen, and the second person was Burke Ramsey.

It's largely a process of elimination. For many reasons one of the three Ramseys in the house that night had to be involved somehow in this killing. John was eliminated as the writer. Patsy was on the verge of being eliminated and declared to be a very low probability as being the writer.

That leaves Burke. Nothing has ever been released, officially or unofficially, about the results of Burke's handwriting analysis.

Just my opinion.

BlueCrab

NOT!...HUM>?! BlueCrab...I pray for you/your insite IMHO...IMHO your on the right CHAPTER of the Book/Game of LIFE but on the wrong page!!!... :silenced:


Reply
ezSupporter
Delmar England's letter to D.A. Keenan 05/20/2003
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
With permission from Mr. England I am very please to post this letter he wrote to Mary Keenan, Boulder District Attorney.

The letter is lengthy but well worth taking the time to read – those of you who have followed this case will see that Mr. England has left no stone unturned.

I am much honored that Mr. England has agreed to share this with C&J.

Sit back, make yourself a refreshment of your choice and read at your leisure!

Little

http://pub165.ezboard.com/fcrimeandjustice13552frm78.showMessage?topicID=154.topic

Delmar England's letter to D.A. Keenan 05/20/2003

May 20, 2003

Mary Keenan, Boulder District Attorney
Justice Center
1777 Sixth Street (Sixth St. and Canyon Blvd.)
Boulder, CO 80302

Re: Ramsey Case

Dear Ms. Keenan,

I am a very private person who seeks neither fame nor
fortune, hence the reluctance and delay in writing this
letter. I prefer to "let George do it" and not get involved
in such matters, but "George" has not materialized, so here
I am.

To begin at the beginning, at least, my beginning, more by
accident than design, I began looking into the case via
internet resources in March of 2000. It did not take long to
see the game was not being played according to Hoyle. After
viewing the politics, favoritism, dishonesty and gross
incompetence for quite some time, I departed in utter
disgust. After months of total absence, I recently looked in
to see if there had been any change. There hadn't. The Judge
Carnes' ruling and her alleged "evidence" of an intruder was
the last straw. It was either simply forget about the case
entirely, or do something to try to remedy the six years
plus of myths and misconceptions. As you can see, I chose
the latter.

For those of us, which are most, children are to be
protected, nurtured and taught. When this simple tenet of
decency is violated, it takes on a personal meaning and
personal importance no matter who the child is, or the
circumstances of abuse.

The death of JonBenet Ramsey is a tragedy of ultimate
magnitude. She had but one life and that life was ended by
some person or persons. To the tragedy is added travesty; a
travesty which is a sad commentary on the prevailing value
system of most, but in particular those who have contributed
to the travesty and continue to do so.

The crime scene consisted of an obviously bogus multi-page
"ransom note" utilizing local materials. JonBenet's body was
left in the basement of the Ramsey home with crude trappings
falling woefully short of presenting a convincing
kidnap\murder scene as it was intended to do. Even without
pointing out more of a very long list of corroborating
facts, the bogus note and inept staging is more than
sufficient to isolate the perpetrators to the Ramsey
household. Only a few minutes in examining and evaluating
the evidence is required to reach this conclusion. It is
impossible to reach any other conclusion on the facts. There
was and is no evidentiary reason to look anywhere else. The
only mystery to be solved was and is which Ramsey did what
in relation to JonBenet's death.

Although it is not possible to reach any other conclusion
from the evidence, it is possible to ignore the evidence and
mentally invent "evidence" to take the place of truth and
keep it hidden. Prompted by preconceived notions set in a
context of money and political influence in conjunction with
investigative cowardice and incompetence, this is precisely
what has been going on for over six years.

Had a crime in parallel been investigated in a run down, low
income neighborhood, the investigative actions and outcome
would have been far different. Please don't insult me with
the pretentious cliche that all are treated equally under
the law. We both know better.

In the course of events following the initial
monetary\political favoritism and inept investigation, the
only viable suspects, i.e., the Ramseys, in blatant defiance
of literally all the evidence to the contrary, took their
protest of innocence to the public at large beginning with
the unprecedented appearance on CNN just six days after the
death of their daughter. This shameful display of lying
arrogance is an insult to the intelligence of any marginally
competent person not comatose. I and many others have seen
enough and intend to end the farce. The Ramsey Show has had a long run. The time is long overdue for the final curtain
call.

"We will work cooperatively with Lou Smit, the Ramseys, and
the Boulder Police Department." (Your words )

"We are all focused on the apprehension and successful
prosecution of the killer of JonBenet." (Your words also)

The fact that you obviously don't see the horrendous
contradiction, I find more than a bit disturbing. Based on
what I have observed during the three plus years I have been
looking into the case, including your promised cooperation
with the most viable suspects, indeed, the only viable
suspects, the statement about successful prosecution of the
killer rings a bit hollow to say the least.

If the past is an indicator, the content of this letter will
be ignored; which means the truth about the death of
JonBenet Ramsey will be ignored as well as it has been for
over six years. In any event, ignored or not, it will be on
record. Govern yourself accordingly.

"I have carefully reviewed the Order of United States
District Court Judge Julie Carnes in the civil case of Wolf
v. John Ramsey and Patricia Ramsey. I agree with the Court's
conclusion that "the weight of the evidence is more
consistent with a theory that an intruder murdered JonBenet
than it is with a theory that Mrs. Ramsey did so." (Your
words)

Would you mind pointing out to me just one item you claim to
be evidence of an intruder and hold still for some questions
about the alleged evidence? Surely, you can do this with no
problem if you believe "the weight of the evidence is more
consistent with a theory that an intruder murdered JonBenet
than it is with a theory that Mrs. Ramsey did so." Indeed,
would you point out to me some evidence that it IS a murder
case.

The reason I make this request is that during my long time
looking into the matter, I have heard and read many claims
about evidence of murder and evidence of an intruder, but
been unable to find any, not a trace. I really tried. For
quite some time I posted on a forum or two. I asked that
anyone who believes there is evidence of an intruder to meet
me on line and answer some questions about the alleged
evidence of an intruder. No takers. Not one.

Why do you suppose this is since Smit, Carnes, you and other
Ramsey supporters have repeatedly declared that the weight
of the evidence indicates an intruder is responsible for the
crime. Perhaps the answer lies in the method of gathering
"evidence."


Little
Administrator
Posts: 2397
(6/4/03 12:45 pm)
Reply
ezSupporter
Re: Delmar England's letter to D.A. Keenan 05/20/2003
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
For every "could be", there is a "could be not", therefore,
inconclusive until cause is known. Right? No thing is
evidence until evidentiary cause is known. Right? Are we in
agreement so far? If not, please point out what you think is
my error in thinking, and why you think it is error.

A shoe print is found in the basement whose cause is
unknown. It "could be" evidence of an intruder. "Could be
not" is forgotten and "evidence" of an intruder is declared
to be fact. There is a palm print with cause unknown; a rope
with source unknown that "could be" something brought in by
an intruder; an unidentified fiber, a baseball bat that
"could have" been used by the intruder; a bit of dirt or
leaves at a window well which "could have" been disturbed by
an intruder. The list goes on and on and on.


... (and the BEAT goes on and on and on...)

for remainder/add'tl info (please select/read URL above fully,...)!@#!~ :blowkiss:

 

[Toltec]

Patsy wrote the note...no doubt in my mind. Her reference to 1997 in her last Christmas letter and the reference in the ransom note sealed it for me.

 

[Blazeboy3]

Patsy wrote the note...no doubt in my mind. Her reference to 1997 in her last Christmas letter and the reference in the ransom note sealed it for me.

I AGREE...so not what? :boohoo: :sick:

 

[Blazeboy3]

:dontknow: WHAT'S IT MEAN?: ... help ?!... ENGLISH ... please ...(I read/understood it...but not sure of meaning...!?)/...!~~~:dontknow:

I am pulled(believe) toward the head incident/injury/accident/? occurring FIRST...JMHO...and then came the rest... :behindbar
http://pub165.ezboard.com/fcrimeandjustice13552frm78.showMessage?topicID=262.topic
Chapter 10 ... The Little Things May mean a Lot
pages 229 - 231

I like the African (Ashanti) proverb you've chosen for this excellent chapter Peggy. "One Falsehood spoils a thousand truths" ... and can understand why you chose it as one reads John Ramsey's "falsehood."

The Little Things May mean a Lot

The little things might just mean a lot in this case.
When the Ramseys themselves go on national television, or one of their employees goes on the record be it TV or the print media, then it’s my opinion that it is certainly fair to ask questions of their statements.

Legitimate reasons to question

There are legitimate reasons to question the actions of the family. Often there are hollow arguments and criticisms lodged against those (well, ok – me) who may have questions, or point out, the inconsistencies in the statements and/or actions of the Ramseys. It’s just my opinion that when someone makes a statement that you would like cleared up that it deserves an answer. It’s not about overhearing a private conversation at the table next to you, it’s about people who use a public forum to get their message out.

Among those arguments are "you don't know them" or "you don't know what you would do in that situation" and possibly my favorite is "loving parents do not murder their child" (well duh!).

No, I didn't know them, but I have been just as exposed to their very public interviews as the rest of the free world who chose to watch them. You don't hire a Public Relation Consultant if you are not trying to influence the public (of which I am one).

You don't write a book about how you perceive the injustices heaped upon you if you're not trying to turn the tide of public perception that you were involved in the death of your child. That’s fair enough.

Quote Source:
denver.rockymountainnews....ook7.shtml
"One of the accusations that had been leveled against Patsy and me was, "If the Ramseys are innocent, why wouldn't they agree to appear before the grand jury?" The truth was that we had done everything we knew how to do to get the prosecutors to subpoena us so we could testify.
We wanted to testify. They wouldn't allow it. Throughout the process, we had been excluded from testifying by the prosecutors who were running the hearing. We were never called and are not sure why. Now we saw ourselves confronted with the prospect of a dead investigation, financial devastation, standing trial for murder as well as passing on a blighted family reputation to our children and grandchildren. During these last days, I realized how the entire process had squeezed the innocence out of Patsy and me. On the morning of Dec. 26, 1996, we were typical Americans who believed that America was a great country, and we had been blessed by its bounty. In our view, the guilty always went to jail and the innocent didn't. How naive we were! The song that JonBenet used to sing, God Bless America, was now forever tainted and overshadowed by what we had learned about the potential injustice in this land. When an innocent child is killed in her own house and the response of the justice system is as defective as it had been in JonBenet's case, hope dies as well. A killer, compounded by a defective police department, a rampant Internet gossip system and an irresponsible news industry willing to print and say anything that makes a story, had destroyed our dreams for the future. Our innocence had died." End Quote John Ramsey DOI

Sorry, but in my opinion that's just one of the most self-serving statements I have ever read. They begged to testify? How about all the times they were reportedly asked to come in to the Boulder Police Department for interviews? Where was their enthusiasm to assist in finding the truth about who was responsible for the death of the only true innocent here - their daughter JonBenet. The child who was named for John. The child he says he would have given his life for. Yet in my opinion their book seemed mostly about the alleged injustices that were
inflicted upon them. Their book, was more about them than JonBenet
So the statement "you don't know them" isn't exactly true. No, I don't personally know them, however what I have observed is quite enough to get a general idea thank you very much.
As for the statement "you don't know what you would do in that situation", well, that's not exactly true either. Just as a matter of course, if I were trying to find the killer of my child, unless I had gone completely insane from grief, or had died from the agony of, it you better believe I would move heaven, earth and everything in between to get the SOB who did it. So to make that statement it’s apparent that you don’t know me very well.

On the other hand, if I were avoiding the issue, no doubt I would still be inconsolable from grief, and if I had the resources and contacts the Ramseys have I would probably do just what they did.

 

[Toltec]

Brothermoon I find your posts interesting...Patsy suffering some type of brain disorder. But which type?

The symptoms of Schizophrenia usually occur around the time a person is in their teens to early 20's. I have not read anywhere in her history of psychotic thinking or behavior.

Borderline Personality Disorder is more common illness amongst women. Persons suffering this type of personality disorder rarely have a psychotic break but let us go to December of 1996 and where and what Patsy was going through.

Patsy was indeed stressed out the entire month of December. She went to New York with John, hosted a Christmas Party for her church with 80 members attending. She attended JonBenet's all-day one person show at her school, she had an impromptu Christmas Party 23 December, and was expected to pack for three trips...a trip she did not want to go to (Charlevoix), then a trip to Florida and then the Hawaiian Tropic Pageant.

Christmas Day: Patsy is awakened very early by Burke and JonBenet. She goes downstairs and the family opens their presents. She deliberately holds back the My Twinn Doll present until last and when JonBenet opens it, she tells Patsy she does not think the doll looks like her and then puts this extravagant gift aside in favor of the more simpler one...beaded jewelry. Patsy's already hurt feelings (John's gift of a bicycle) are further excacerbated by JonBenets rejection of the doll. So let's move on.

Patsy and John prepare their traditional Christmas breakfast consisting of pancakes, corned beef hash, etc. No mention of JonBenet eating any of it and mention of Burke stopping only to take a bite.

John decides to get out of dodge by telling Patsy that he is going to take some gifts to the plane and check on the plane itself. No mention of John helping Patsy with the kitchen cleanup.

Patsy is left with Burke and JonBenet and neighborhood children running in and out of the home. She is left to some more wrapping of gifts, packing of luggage, and dyeing of her hair. She stops for a few minutes to join JonBenet who was sitting alone (no mention of little girls present) making beaded jewelry. Big brother Burke was in his room with other little boys no doubt playing his beloved new Nintendo64.

John comes home just in time to get ready for the trip to the Whites. No mention of John helping Patsy get the kids dressed. We do know that JonBenet gave an already flustered Patsy a hard time.

It's 9:15pm and the Ramseys get home from the Whites. Patsy still has some packing and wrapping to do while John sits on his rear end in the living room with Burke. He puts Burke to bed and goes to bed himself. No stress there as John enjoys reading before turning off the lights. What was Patsy's state of mind as she lay there next to John?

Herein lies the clue to what happened that night.

JonBenet was already asleep when she came home. NO STRESS
Burke stayed up awhile then put to bed. NO STRESS
John stayed up awhile and even managed to read before lights out. NO STRESS.
Patsy on the otherhand could only be thinking of what she still has to do before the trip to Charlevoix and Florida....LOTS OF STRESS THERE.

 

[BrotherMoon]

Ya, tough day. But the stressors can be found in the ransom note; 1997, 118, delivery, Victory! S.B.T.C and Patsy's 40th birthday.

Actually borderlines can slip in and out of psychoses when stressed enough according to Otto Kernberg.

I give the bicycle gift a big nod though. It's a symbol of self motivation in dreams. White and snow can be a symbol of purity. John clears away purity and gives her the means for self determination. That must have grated on the unconscious of Patsy, i.e. more stars aligning. While Pats gives her a strange intuitive/symbolic gift which JB dismisses. I read a lot of separation anxiety in mom who allready shows a lot of identity transference.

As far as signs of psychosis she said she was saved from death by an interventionist superbeing. Ding! JB went to the doc many times with bladder complaints and showed signs of molestation. Ding! The pageant costuming became more and more elaborate, a clear sign of progressive fantasy. Ding!

The lack of recognition of overt evidence of progressive psychosis until the cork pops is actually common. I refer to Eric Harris.

Patsy has some type of identity disorder which is first compensated by becoming an over achiever and then with an imagined relationship with a super natural being. I also think she shows the effects of a narcissistic mother.

Patsy thinks JonBenet is in heaven awaiting her mom's arrival. That's the end result of the whole thing so you can work back from there to the motive. That's why this case is so difficult for so many people as they can't tell the difference between religion and psychotic wish fulfillment.

 

[Nedthan Johns]

BrotherMoon: excellent take on this crime. First time I have actually read something from you where you have captured my FULL attention. Would love to learn more from your analysis.

Although, I believe the cover up and use of bible phrases came after an explosive blow up. Patsy USED her religion to cover her crime, and make it alright. Searching for something in the bible that in her twisted mind would make it acceptable for what she had done. I have always thought from the first time I saw Patsy speak, there was something disturbingly wrong with the woman.

Would love to know when you think John Ramsey joined in on this crime....

 

[Nedthan Johns]

Bluecrab: Although I love your theory and always enjoy reading your posts, IMO there is NO way a 9 year old kid penned that note. Our daughter is 9 almost 10 now and she has wonderful penmenship, but for the life of me I have never seen her able to sit and write 2 1/2 pages of anything. The most would be a page, and her words run together as she gets tired. The lines are not straight. Many words, although she is one of the best spellers in her class would be mispelled. Easy words that she forgets have letters in them like Wile, forgetting the h. Most girls write neater then boys. There is NO way Burke Ramsey wrote that note, with or without help. Kids in general try to write neat. This letter was written by someone with their left hand on purpose to disguise their handwritting. It was written by a woman. It's very clear and I believe it cannot be disputed that Patsy Ramsey wrote that note.
This has always been one piece of evidence that stands on it's own and is very clear about "who" wrote it. I think anyone with a 9 year old boy should get him to sit down and dictate the ransom note. I would bet they either complain and don't want to finish it or have a hard time spelling 90% of the words in it, and I can almost be certain a 9 year old has never even heard of an attache. Much less know there is a ' in it.

 

[Nedthan Johns]

Rachel: I have not read every single thread or every reply so please forgive me for asking this but is it possible that Burke could have strangled JonBenet and when she passed out she could have fell back and hit her head on something

Ned: There is NO way JB fell and hit her head. The blow to her head was direct and deliberate. She was struck from the front and to the right, indicitive of a right handed person. This was NO fall, NO slip and NO accident IMO. Someone struck that child in anger.