Why did Lee flip-flop?

[cyberborg]

Well said, Devon.

In the almost 3 years they had never seen any sign (nor had any of her friends) of violence or anything but loving, protective behavior on KC's part toward Caylee. Suddenly she and Caylee have some new people around them in just the past few months, and Caylee disappears. They may or may not know that some of the friends (and possibly Casey) may be into some scams. They do know about her history of thefts and fibbing. What would parents in this situation think? Naturally at heart they must have been very frightened that Caylee could be in danger, very scared wondering who she was with, or at worst what if some accident had happened. But would they jump to the conclusion that Casey would have murdered her? They had no reason. Even about the smell in the car, I think only George consciously considered the possibility that it was from a body. I think Cindy and Lee convinced themselves it was from the pizza box. At worst, if they did ever allow themselves to think of it, and I imagine GA also considered this, they might have thought, well if it was the smell of a body, what did someone do to someone, is Casey in the middle of some gang thing or what, did someone use her car for some bad purpose, or what? I don't think they would leap to, "did Casey murder Caylee?" Knowing Casey as a nonviolent person, who loved and was protective toward the child, I would expect GA and CA and Lee to suspect, not Casey, but most likely some new person she'd come into contact with, of any violent crime.

Maybe they did not leap to the murderer was KC but they did fear the smell was one of the girls.

I respectfully disagree with your post based on the transcript from the tow yard with GA, his fears as he sat in that car, developing courage to go and open the trunk, him saying to himself that he hoped it was not KC or Caylee (although he knew he'd recently seen KC), GA's strange comments to the tow guy about Caylee being missing, and wanting the tow guy to be with him.

From the 31 day disappearance both CA and GA were escalating to a fear and realization that Caylee was more than missing and this resulted in the final 911 call.

 

[Pondering Mind]

Maybe they did not leap to the murderer was KC but they did fear the smell was one of the girls.

I respectfully disagree with your post based on the transcript from the tow yard with GA, his fears as he sat in that car, developing courage to go and open the trunk, him saying to himself that he hoped it was not KC or Caylee (although he knew he'd recently seen KC), GA's strange comments to the tow guy about Caylee being missing, and wanting the tow guy to be with him.

From the 31 day disappearance both CA and GA were escalating to a fear and realization that Caylee was more than missing and this resulted in the final 911 call.

ITA! Not to mention his interview with detectives, when he TOLD them what he feared, but didn't want to believe.

 

[cyberborg]

?? LA didn't berate KC, TL did a bit. In the sting video LA clearly assumed KC was innocent of any crime against Caylee, and assumed that TL also was innocent and was just as worried about Caylee's welfare and about her being found as he was. LA was naturally desperate for any information TL could provide. He was very concerned about TL's comments about his and his friends' drug dealer in the complex and TL's claim that Casey had said she had x amount of money saved up, Lee seemed to be concerned about the possibility that Casey could have stolen money from the drug dealer, crossed a dangerous person.
Other than the comments about his drug dealer, all TL had to say as usual throughout the conversation was a few derogatory comments about Casey, i.e. how p.o.'d he'd been about Casey needing to be picked up at the Amscot (p.o.'d about that? kind of a weird, and why make a point in the conversation that you were p.o.'d and in a hurry to be somewhere else when you picked her up there?), and then after the interview was over to say to LE "you're right, that guy never shuts up." That's what he had to say about this poor young guy who is scared to death about his niece and wanting to find her. In my opinion TL showed the same lack of compassion or concern in the sting conversation with Lee that he and his friends show in their little snide remarks and jokes in their interviews. But I guess all this is a topic for another thread, so I will stop there on the subject
Lee always admitted that KC had a problem with compulsive fibbing and minor thefts, he speaks about it when he says to her friends "we all know Casey's done bad things", even laughs about it, because he and the friends never considered it a serious thing before. He always made it clear that he didn't believe Casey would ever harm Caylee, though. (Her close friends said the same.) He's always told her friends just to tell the truth and wished them luck. I never saw flip-flopping or deception on his part.

I stand by my comment, your post characterizes LA's statements as "compulsive fibbing and minor thefts" and I view his comments more strongly as KC lying about everything and anything and significant stealing and -- to me that is LA berating KC to TL (like CA does) when there are contrasting comments of his love, support and loyalty.

So to use another word, LA rebuked KC in front of TL which seems inconsistent. It isn't a matter of a correction but degrees, you see it as an admission I see it as a criticism / rebuke of KC. We see the same trait but different severities. You see it from light I see it from dark. Right?

 

[sassy_texasbelle2]

Fibbing is something a child will do. These people are adults, they are out and out lying to everyone. There is no childish fibbing going on here.

 

[Searchfortruth]

Lee has joined forces with mom and dad, and I think it's that simple. At some point they decided that they were going to protect Casey at any cost, IMO.

 

[Phumi]

Well, I always assumed the "My Caylee is Missing" entry was about KC having taken Caylee from them when she left due to their falling out. That's what it seems to be about.
I think the other statement by Cindy you mention seems to mean Cindy thought at that time if Casey is pulling some scam or hiding Caylee with friends somewhere or gave Caylee to someone, someone had to have helped, she couldn't be hiding her on her own, someone has her. This was very early in the case. At this stage they thought and hoped that some friend or associate or babysitter of Casey's probably had her, or at the very wildest that maybe she had given her up for adoption or something.

The family did always say they didn't know what Casey might have gotten herself involved in or what her degree of involvement in Caylee's disappearance was. At this early date, I don't think they were letting themselves think about the possibility that someone could have murdered Caylee, except for maybe George, though I think he was very much trying to keep hope alive, too. I don't think Cindy was talking about murder in the July 23 statement...

My bold.

We are getting away from the thread topic here, but I must point out that Mrs. Anthony insists there was NO falling out before Casey left. She has also said that she had seen no red flags up until she "found" Casey at TL's. It does not follow that she would think Casey was hiding Caylee if these 2 statements are true.

 

[marla]

Well, I always assumed the "My Caylee is Missing" entry was about KC having taken Caylee from them when she left due to their falling out. That's what it seems to be about.

I think the other statement by Cindy you mention seems to mean Cindy thought at that time if Casey is pulling some scam or hiding Caylee with friends somewhere or gave Caylee to someone, someone had to have helped, she couldn't be hiding her on her own, someone has her. This was very early in the case. At this stage they thought and hoped that some friend or associate or babysitter of Casey's probably had her, or at the very wildest that maybe she had given her up for adoption or something.

The family did always say they didn't know what Casey might have gotten herself involved in or what her degree of involvement in Caylee's disappearance was. At this early date, I don't think they were letting themselves think about the possibility that someone could have murdered Caylee, except for maybe George, though I think he was very much trying to keep hope alive, too. I don't think Cindy was talking about murder in the July 23 statement...

My bold ..

Which falling-out are you talking about and why would you assume there was a falling-out?
Cindy's admitted nothing of the sort ..

 

[seagull65]

Maybe they did not leap to the murderer was KC but they did fear the smell was one of the girls.

I respectfully disagree with your post based on the transcript from the tow yard with GA, his fears as he sat in that car, developing courage to go and open the trunk, him saying to himself that he hoped it was not KC or Caylee (although he knew he'd recently seen KC), GA's strange comments to the tow guy about Caylee being missing, and wanting the tow guy to be with him.

From the 31 day disappearance both CA and GA were escalating to a fear and realization that Caylee was more than missing and this resulted in the final 911 call.

I've posted the same thing many times about GA at the tow yard, Cy. He said he initially feared that either Casey or Caylee could be in the trunk. I don't think the fear of a human body possibly having been in the trunk ever fully left him, though he probably tried to think positive and think it could have been from the garbage or a dead animal or some other cause, or that someone could have done something with the car when it was out of Casey's possession, (hopefully nothing to do with Caylee) or something.
I would have to disagree about them having escalated to any firm belief that Caylee was dead (much less murdered) at this early date! (Certainly not CA.) CA just thought Casey was not letting them see Caylee due to their disagreement, until they finally pinned her down in mid-July and she said that Caylee had been missing, that's when they called the police to get to the bottom of who had her. I certainly don't believe they thought at this early date that KC was a murderer as was being discussed here (I don't think they believe even now that she is the murderer.)

 

[seagull65]

My bold ..

Which falling-out are you talking about and why would you assume there was a falling-out?
Cindy's admitted nothing of the sort ..

:waitasec:
The estrangement, Casey's leaving to "bond with Caylee" and not bringing Caylee around and not letting her speak to Caylee, as described by CA and the family. That's what Cindy is writing about in that passage, why are you keeping my Caylee from me when I helped you all this time? etc Someone had posted that "My Caylee is Missing" was referring at that early date to an actual disappearance or even murder of Caylee! I was just responding to that, I believe the "My Caylee is Missing" passage seems to be about Casey not letting Cindy see Caylee.

 

[seagull65]

My bold.

We are getting away from the thread topic here, but I must point out that Mrs. Anthony insists there was NO falling out before Casey left. She has also said that she had seen no red flags up until she "found" Casey at TL's. It does not follow that she would think Casey was hiding Caylee if these 2 statements are true.

Well I'm not sure what you mean, CA and all the family have described throughout this case how KC was keeping Caylee away from CA from mid-June to mid-July, how Lee had had to try to chase KC down so that Caylee could spend the 4th of July with Cindy, how CA was being given the run around continually by Casey during the month with Cindy not being allowed to get together with or even speak to Caylee, ostensibly so Casey could "bond with" Caylee and start building her own life with her child, they all have indicated there was some kind of estrangement with Casey not letting Caylee spend time with CA. Maybe by "falling out" you are referring more to the rumor about there having been a huge argument at the house and Cindy choking Casey in a rage, etc, prior to Casey leaving? I wasn't addressing that particular aspect myself, whether it's true or not, just Casey having left and keeping Caylee away from Cindy.

I think no "red flags" means that neither CA nor any of the family or friends thought Caylee was out of Casey's possession or that anything that weird was going on. None of them thought that until the day CA picked Casey up at TL's. JMO

Up until the discovery of Caylee's remains, the family (CA and Lee at least, probably GA to some extent also) were very hopeful that Caylee was alive. They didn't know who had her, was ZFG an actual person or a term for various friends, or what? Was Caylee kidnapped by a sitter whoever it is, or did Casey have someone take her for an extended period, or could Casey have gotten involved in something where someone took Caylee until a theft is repaid or whatever, what about TL's drug dealer he mentions, could Casey have stolen from him and could that be related to Caylee's disappearance? They were clearly hopeful that Caylee was alive and were trying not to think of the possibility that whoever had her could have harmed her or anything like that, that she had come to harm period, clearly they never thought Casey would have harmed her. Lee doesn't seem to have come from that mindset at all (in my opinion).

 

[Phumi]

At the bond hearing Cindy said Casey was not keeping Caylee from her. There were merely "inopportunities." :bang: Of course Cindy has said many contradictory things, flip-flopping as often as her son, Lee. This makes it convienient for anyone trying to support an argument because we can just pick and choose the info. that helps our statements. Should make for an interesting trial!:crazy: (MOO)

 

[NJ Lawyer]

Lee is perceived as having "flip flopped." But what he's really doing is uniting with his family against a common enemy -- Law Enforcement. They HATE law enforcement. They believe LE lied to them, tried to trick them, failed to follow their "leads" and also, that LE is just a bunch of ignorant Floridian hicks unlike the more educated Ohio-reared Anthony clan. Lee especially hates LE -- in Lee's mind, these are simply the people who wired up Casey's ex to try to trick Lee, released tapes of Lee's interviews with LE and he probably thinks the interviews have been broken into soundbites, like when he laughs at the smell of Caylee's dead body, to make Lee look like a jerk. Lee also believes prosecutors are enabling this whole thing. He is "getting them back" by refusing to help prosecutors or LE one bit. He'll just sit back and say "I believe everything my sister has said" and in his mind he's thinking, "Heh. See how they like them apples."

 

[Patty G]

Click on link and READ: A Time For A Reminder - With No Warning - We Are Very Serious About This Warning​

Thread will open in a little while ....

 

[Pondering Mind]

Fibbing is something a child will do. These people are adults, they are out and out lying to everyone. There is no childish fibbing going on here.

I'm serious!...Lee and the rest of the Anthony clan LIE. Not fibs, not half truths...not white lies..not mistruths....or any other Anthonyism :furious: BIg F A T LIES! JMO, but I call it like I see it.. Casey #1 :liarand murderer imo) Cindy #2 :liar: George #3 :liar: Lee #4 :liar:

You know what they say...Children live what they learn....:bang: