Why is LE treating this case different?

[tlcya]

Emma Peel, I think I love you! ITA with your post summarizing what you think is going on with this investigation word for word. Thank you button could not convey how I appreciate you articulating exactly my thoughts about LE behavior in this case.

I hope LE is building a solid case against the perp through the use of these tactics.

 

[JustyThoughts]

Emma, your post makes me think you are on target. I've had a nagging feeling there was someone other than Terri responsible for this.

 

[Day Dreamer]

I think that if SM told LE what she did that day and where she went, then they need to verify her story and that is what they are doing. There are no witness to back up her story. So if she told them she went to Sauvie Island or the phone pinged there, then they have to search because she is the last one who saw him. It is normal to do that. That is why they want traffic video, if she said she went this route, and she's not on it in that car or truck, oh boy. If they don't find any trace of Kyron on that island, they can't arrest her for shopping. But holes in her story will bury her. So that is why, they need either a confirmation that someone saw her with him, or someone saw her at Sauvie Island and he wasn't with her. Something to back it up. I still have a hard time believing she did this, without other signs of abuse, or mental disorder, it doesn't fit for me. I will say that I do know and understand about psycho paths, that they have no remorse, or guilt about what they do to get what they want. We have seen this in many cases here. I don't know SM to say anything about her personality and that is why I don't believe it now, but if evidence comes to light that will be another story. JMO

I'm trying to get caught up here so please be gentle if this has already been addressed. I did post it on another thread; but, I do not remember which one or seeing if anyone responded.

Anyway, is there anyone on here that has a premium account w/ weatherbug (I don't or I would check this myself)? I was reading on another site that weatherbug has cameras for the purpose of seeing what the weather is in certain places. It could very well be that weatherbug could have camera footage of the questionable areas that SM could have been in or possibly even video footage of or near Skyline Elementary. I read that weatherbug archives their video footage; and, people w/ a premium account could go back and view them from June 3 and/or 4th?

I would be very interested in knowing if anyone has checked this. TIA

 

[Astrella613]

I wonder if LE is thinking that the perp will bring Kyron back alive and well and is giving them a chance to do so. They have not given out any information so they may have even gotten a ransom note. Wish we knew more.

 

[Day Dreamer]

I wonder if LE is thinking that the perp will bring Kyron back alive and well and is giving them a chance to do so. They have not given out any information so they may have even gotten a ransom note. Wish we knew more.

BBM. That is what I thought back in the beginning. I don't think anyone agreed w/ me. I am still trying to hold out hope that, in some miraculous way, Kyron will be brought home safely.

 

[niteowl1212]

Sorry that I`m not up-to-date on everything, but if this was such a big day at school with the children`s projects and all..wouldn`t there have been a number of people (students, teachers, parents,etc.) who would have seen Kyron if he had actually made it to school in the first place? Forgive me if I missed this scenario in previous comments. Also, I do think it`s significant that LE wanted flier to include Terri Horman. Just a gut feeling (and probably wrong..I hope!) but I think at least someone in LE think her story doesn`t ring true. Typically a parent would watch until their 7 yr old actually got into the school, just to make sure they got their precious project inside OK. At least I would. Kyron was very proud of it and excited to show, even more reason loving parent would want to see that no mishaps occurred. I`m probably too suspicious, but it doesn`t feel right.

 

[Day Dreamer]

Sorry that I`m not up-to-date on everything, but if this was such a big day at school with the children`s projects and all..wouldn`t there have been a number of people (students, teachers, parents,etc.) who would have seen Kyron if he had actually made it to school in the first place? Forgive me if I missed this scenario in previous comments. Also, I do think it`s significant that LE wanted flier to include Terri Horman. Just a gut feeling (and probably wrong..I hope!) but I think at least someone in LE think her story doesn`t ring true. Typically a parent would watch until their 7 yr old actually got into the school, just to make sure they got their precious project inside OK. At least I would. Kyron was very proud of it and excited to show, even more reason loving parent would want to see that no mishaps occurred. I`m probably too suspicious, but it doesn`t feel right.

From what I have gathered, SM went to the school w/ Kyron around 8am to view the science fair projects (possibly to set up Kyron's project?). Around 8:45 she waved goodbye to Kryon in the hallway as he was headed to his class.

Of course, there has been so much contradictory around that morning that I am no longer sure what is fact, what is rumor, or if Kyron was ever at the school. I wish we had more info. I just hope and pray that LE knows more than they are saying and are not back at square one. If they are, they have surely lost a lot of precious, irreplaceable time.

 

[AbbieNormal]

Is it just me or is LE treating this case completely diffrent from any we have seen before?

We have seen LE keep things close to the vest before,but personally I have never seen this type of investigating strategy. Why is that?
They want the public's help but will not confirm anything. Even the last time Kyron was seen. They have not called this an abduction, yet they dont think he wandered off, yet they dont think anyone else is endanger...??....??? WHAT?

They are handing out questionares to be answered and returned seeking information... When has this EVER happened?

They create a flyer with the last person seen and a truck on a missing child poster. WHEN HAS THIS EVER HAPPENED?

Nobody is making a public plea for Kyron, not even LE just stating the need tips and they will bring him home, but not asking if someone has him please dont hurt him, feed him, return him to his family.

What is LE and FBI doing in this case? What is their strategy?

Its the weirdest thing I have seen in a long time too- the questionnaire is just out in left field IMO, and the fact that they tell the public their kids are not at risk (IOW, no crazed child abductor is assumed to be on the loose there) is also very strange. How do they KNOW this, if they don't really know who did this? Its like a big, huge arrow is being pointed at one person, and one person only, but we are being told to "look away".
Also weird, parents have not retained lawyers, to our knowledge. Isn't that the first thing peeps do nowadays, even if they are innocent?
If I was guilty of this crime, I would NOT get a lawyer (cos that always raises suspicions that you are involved) AND I would keep my yap shut. And, stay out of the public eye. Oh, funny, that's exactly what "someone" has done in this case, isn't it? Jus sayin'...

 

[Aedrys]

Thanks for all of your comments. I wasn't totally sure about what I was posting, and I mostly wanted to see reactions more than anything. I think a lot of you are right and wealth may not have anything to do with this. I guess I tend to think more darkly of people than they are sometimes.

Also, thank you Emma Peel for your great post. I think you have hit the nail on the head. I hope you're right for the sake of Kyron! I still don't know for sure what's going and that is killing me, but what you said makes a lot more sense and I'm praying you're right.

 

[AbbieNormal]

Sorry if this is the wrong thread ...

Is the FBI still involved in the case? I'm wondering how much local LE is being directed by them as to the best way to handle this. I have never followed a case this closely from day one so it's very hard for me to compare.

I did read over that questionaire and the first thing that came to mind was that it had been designed by prosecutors. I didn't want to believe the SM could have any involvement but the way this is going I just don't see any other reasonable scenario. If she was out running errands that's not typically something you can do without contact with other people so it should be easy to verify. I keep wondering about the father too. If his wife was involved somehow, wouldn't he have some clue? My heart breaks for this little boy.

I would imagine she would be asked to produce receipts, if she bought anything during these "errands", and it wold be difficult to go a multitude of places w/out being caught on video at some time and place anymore these days. LE knows, they just aren't divulging any of it to the public, and understandably so, but very frustrating for armchair detectives like "us".
JMO

abbie

 

[AbbieNormal]

My fear is that LE still has no clear picture of what happened to Kyron; the flyer may be an attempt to try to rule out Terri H., and maybe they will get some responses that indicate she was seen driving away alone. What then? Is she then ruled out?

But what is their next move? Do they have any alternate scenarios at this point? I can't help feeling that they do not have any idea and two weeks is a long time in this type of situation. Already, memories will be fading and without receipts, video, etc. it will be hard to pin down events to a particular day.

I think LE is trying so hard to be careful and perfect in this investigation that they may run themselves right out of options, suspects and time...

It seems they have ruled out ALL but it being the Sm because they immediately said the risk to the public was "low". How do they know that if they have no idea who did this? It would be the height of irresponsibility to tell the public their children are not in danger when they have no idea who did this, and a nut is running around who snatches up kids, don't you think?
It feels to me like from the beginning LE has known, or strongly suspected, who their POI is, they just aren't assigning the "POI label" to that person yet. JMO.

 

[AbbieNormal]

They are treating it differently because this case is different, and, IMO it's at a different stage than many realize.

IMO LE knows who their suspect(s) are. They know what happened to Kyron. The investigation turned criminal when they realized and confirmed what happened.

They don't know where Kyron is. But they have motive, opportunity, witnesses, and circumstantial evidence. They said they "aren't discussing any POI's at this time." They've said "yes we can have an arrest in this case without a body."

They are in the process of clearing Terri (the flyers) - they have to clear her so the defense (for their actual suspect(s)) can't point any fingers at her - and say "what about her?" Surveys, even lie detectors - all to clear Terri. They don't care about her truck, they just care who saw her truck when and want it on the record.

They need to establish, beyond a doubt, Terri's timeline, and Kyron's timeline. The have already determined the perp's timeline.

They have said "we are trying very hard to do everything perfectly in this case". To me, that means they are preparing their case right now. They must do things perfectly, because it's, at this time, a circumstantial case.

They will keep searching to "bring Kyron home". But they are not waiting for body recovery to move forward to an arrest. They don't have to, IMO, because they have witnesses and enough circumstantial evidence.

LE is acting "differently" and media seems willing to follow their lead. NG is not picking up this story the way one might expect her to - I have to assume she's sent her staff out to Portland and they learned what the rest of media learned. hush, hush.

Whenever opinions turn against the family, LE comes to the rescue with a presser that puts the family in a good light. This weekend, even media came to the rescue with a some human interest stories for the Horman family, which were roundly positive, even while mentioning a few negative items (DUI arrest).

It feels like Kyron's parents, LE, AND the whole community have closed ranks. They are acting like a community that has had a tragedy in one family, and is about to have another one in another family. The Hormans are in shock and mourning. And they know that another family is in shock and will be mourning soon.

Kyron's family can't go after the perps in roughshod fashion because, IMO they are too closely related and it's tragic overall. They don't need to appear and appeal, because they already have their answers.

LE is treating this case different, because, IMO, it IS different.

As usual, I reserve my right to change my opinion tomorrow.

GREAT POST,, Emma!!!

abbie

 

[AbbieNormal]

I'm trying to get caught up here so please be gentle if this has already been addressed. I did post it on another thread; but, I do not remember which one or seeing if anyone responded.

Anyway, is there anyone on here that has a premium account w/ weatherbug (I don't or I would check this myself)? I was reading on another site that weatherbug has cameras for the purpose of seeing what the weather is in certain places. It could very well be that weatherbug could have camera footage of the questionable areas that SM could have been in or possibly even video footage of or near Skyline Elementary. I read that weatherbug archives their video footage; and, people w/ a premium account could go back and view them from June 3 and/or 4th?

I would be very interested in knowing if anyone has checked this. TIA

Cool idea, hope someone does this and reports back to us what they did or did not see!!!!

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't find LE acting strangely at all. I've listened to what LE has had to say very cleary from the start. It's been very consistent. First, this was not an abduction, but an endangered missing child. Second, there was no reason to believe that other children were at risk. To say that other children are not at risk is to say that they think Kyron was targeted. Targeted by who? Well, if they had thought he had been taken by a stranger they would have called it a kidnapping. Notice we still don't use that word. Even now that we've moved on to a criminal investigation, it is still not an investigation into a kidnapping. It seems very clear to me that LE is telling us that whatever happened to Kyron, a family member is responsible. (Custodial) parents can't kidnap their own kids.

LE knew the statistics about missing children. They hoped against hope that he had wandered off and could be found. When it was clear that was not the case, we see an emotional LE grappling with their most likely alternative ...that Kyron was hurt by his own family..an evil that in many ways seems worse than that of the random predator.

If at any point they actually thought he had been taken by a stranger, they would have posted his face widely in the hopes of finding him. They've never searched more than 15 miles away for Kyron.

There are many things that seem strange about this case - LE's handling, the family's behavior, and the school's failure to notice his absence. These events seem strange until examined collectively....they all point in the same direction. The school didn't report his absence because he left with a parent, LE knows that must be the case, and the family from the beginning has been resigned to the fact that someone amongst them took him and he is likely never coming back.

Once it was declared a criminal investigation Gates did say he is not ruling out an abduction.

They may think Kyron was targeted. Often times predators size up a victim and select the specific child they want.

I did read about a case that actually happened in that area years ago where a young 7 year old child was taken from school. In fact iirc he left her for dead but she lived. That case was never solved.

They do have his face on 30 billboards across two states. WA and OR.

I am not sure what any LE means when they say isolated incident. They have certainly used that terminology before in other cases as well as saying the victim(s) were targeted yet when the true suspect was finally arrested the perpetrator was a complete stranger to the victim(s). Off the top of my head I know they did this when Sara Walker was murdered and also with the Husted family who was murdered and both suspects did not know their victim at all even though LE said they had been targeted and it was an isolated incident.

So who really knows. Maybe Gates is going by statistics although that is a slippery slope to me and I certainly hope it doesn't create tunnel vision.

IMO

 

[butterfly1978]

hmmmm..this makes sense to me.

After the Tori Stafford case I am VERY reluctant to point fingers at the family.

OT but I am still not convinced that a certain member wasn't involved, someone who knew the confessed perp.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

When I first saw this thread and read the earliest posts, I couldn't help thinking about all of the high-profile cases that I've followed closely over the past 15+ years. It seems like folks always say the same thing about all of these cases: "Why is LE handling this case so differently than others? Why is it taking LE so long to make an arrest? Why isn't LE looking more closely at so & so in such & such a case?" I've followed many high-profile cases and consider each one of them to be unique. jmo

 

[CarmelEyesD]

Its the weirdest thing I have seen in a long time too- the questionnaire is just out in left field IMO, and the fact that they tell the public their kids are not at risk (IOW, no crazed child abductor is assumed to be on the loose there) is also very strange. How do they KNOW this, if they don't really know who did this? Its like a big, huge arrow is being pointed at one person, and one person only, but we are being told to "look away".
Also weird, parents have not retained lawyers, to our knowledge. Isn't that the first thing peeps do nowadays, even if they are innocent?
If I was guilty of this crime, I would NOT get a lawyer (cos that always raises suspicions that you are involved) AND I would keep my yap shut. And, stay out of the public eye. Oh, funny, that's exactly what "someone" has done in this case, isn't it? Jus sayin'...

Thius may be one of the smartest things I have read here tonight. {Not that I don't think you are all smart, cause I do! The smartest!} If we are being told to look at one person (the target), then "look away..". then that is something we need to try and do. If we look at TMH, and then 'look away', what will we see? Who will we see? Interesting question...brothers, sisters, friends, in-laws, cousins... ...? Anyone following her? Any enemies she made? Any toes she stepped on? An admirer? A stalker? A disgruntled store employee or waitress? Who has similar truck? A friend who is no longer a friend? Who may have had access to or borrowed her truck? It kind of like 'Can't see the forest for the trees'...the answer IS there-but who can see it?

Also, I think the first 'clue' LE had that is causing them to treat this case different is the fact that no one saw or heard Kyron leave, which does indicate he knew his kidnapper. Whether that is family friend, uncle, or stepmom, any relative or someone in his past, he knew who it was...

 

[Wendy101]

Thius may be one of the smartest things I have read here tonight. If we are being told to look at one person (the target), then "look away..". then that is something we need to try and do. If we look at TMH, and then 'look away', what will we see? Who will we see? Interesting question...brothers, sisters, friends, in-laws, cousins... ...? Anyone following her? Any enemies she made? Any toes she stepped on? An admirer? A stalker? A disgruntled store employee or waitress? Who has similar truck? A friend who is no longer a friend? Who may have had access to or borrowed her truck? It kind of like 'Can't see the forest for the trees'...the answer IS there-but who can see it?

BBM: Maybe someone setting her up?

 

[CarmelEyesD]

That could be a possibility, along with revenge, or anger. Passion, sex and unrequited feelings are causes, along with anger and revenge..who has TH or KH made angry? Or hurt, slighted or otherwise stepped on someones emotion). A crime could have been committed with the child, and it was feared he would tell. I also have concerns with the stepdad being a criminal investigator-there has to be cases in his history where someone wants revenge...I do feel they had a strong suspicion from day 1 who took this child, and have kept this investigation quiet so as not to spook or alert the suspect. Now they want to recover him (alive or not) and apprehend the suspect. The flyer and pics of TH and the truck to 'jog' someones memory could be specific to finding out if she was followed, if someone had been 'stalking' her or Kyron, or hanging around the school... If that means 'putting TH out there', so be it. ( I wouldn't hesitate to do that to get my child back-let the world talk bad about me all they want-if it gets my child back, I don't care! Particularly if it makes the suspect a little more relaxed thinking he will get away,because all the focus is on me.).In any case, whoever took Kyron is no stranger to this family. If it isn't TH, it is someone either known to them, or tangled in the past history of one of them JMO.

 

[Mylou]

I have also wondered about TH being stalked or followed. I was just wondering now, is it the norm for LE to stay with a family 24/7 in a missing child case?
Could they have needed protection?
Then I wonder about the truck and the starter acting up.