Identified! WI - Delafield, WhtMale, UP7632, car stolen, lighter, Sep'77 - John Lindberg Scott

[KLCD620]

Gerald Davis -https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/4984/

Namus has him disappearing at the age of 60, which is incorrect and probably why I never bothered to look before. I found a cyberpages ad for him from 1997 that lists his birthday as January 7, 1950.

Circumstances say Gerald was traveling from Vegas to PA, not a lot of physical information to go on to match to JD (chest hair, uncircumsized, dental partial).

I don't like Geralds eyebrows by comparison, they're a little full by comparison to JD...but I feel black and white photos are not very accurate. However there are somethings I do like...but maybe my involvement with this particular JD has me a bit too "hopeful"....

Height and weight is solid, hair and eye color is solid, timeline and age is good as well.

Thoughts?

I clicked this link by thinking it was recent post (7/6) & ended up with case access denied. The NamUs said this person, Gerald Davis, has been found. I guess Delafield UID is ruled out as G.D. I didn't see any update from DoeNetwork, Charley Project & Webslueth sites about Gerald Davis being found.

 

[Cubby]

Welcome to WS Nikon, :welcome: and thanks a million for your interest in this case! Wow. I had always presumed the dimmed headlights meant the car was being driven with just the parking lights. Not knowing much about cars, I had never even considered the scenario you presented.

If he were on the lam for something car theft related, I wonder what we might find by way of old/archived msm articles. Particularly with someone who failed to show for a future court date. I'm not convinced the UID's name is John. It's possible he picked up that lighter anywhere, or asked someone for a light and failed to return the lighter. Pens and lighters, two things people tend to pick up without thinking.


Thanks again, Nikon. Your post opens up more idea's on area's to research.

Glad to have you here.

 

[masnitram]

I clicked this link by thinking it was recent post (7/6) & ended up with case access denied. The NamUs said this person, Gerald Davis, has been found. I guess Delafield UID is ruled out as G.D. I didn't see any update from DoeNetwork, Charley Project & Webslueth sites about Gerald Davis being found.

Hey KLCD620! Good to see you my friend.

I noticed that Gerald's case was closed out as well...and you're right, I can't find anything anywhere as to how etc...

 

[Nikon]

Wow, thanks for the insight Nikon! So lets say he did push start the Catalina knowing he would only be utilizing the battery for power. I assume then "John" would know that he could only go so far before the car stalled out completely. Would it be plausible that Wisconsin...more specifically near the point of the crash...would be his probable destination? Unless his plan was to get as far away from Gurnee, IL on battery power and steal another auto wherever he ended up. I know it's just speculative....

No, it wouldn't stall. The battery ran down because he was using the lights for night driving. Headlights do produce a significant electrical draw. Imagine forgetting to turn off your headlights overnight. In those old cars, the battery was only used to start the car the normal way, lights, and tunes. Everything was mechanical then. The generator/alternator's job is to keep the battery fully charged as you drive so you had juice to start up the car the next time you drive. Cars then were like lawnmowners - all you need to drive were gas, spark, and air.

Maybe. For the sake of probability I'd agree. If he stole it in board daylight, he could go anywhere he pleased as long as there was gas in the tank as the lights wouldn't be necessary. Rarely does anyone drive a hot car without having a hiding spot planned nearby unless they were fugitives. I suspect this john had to take the exit and fly by country roads in attempt to lose the cop.

 

[Nikon]

Welcome to WS Nikon, :welcome: and thanks a million for your interest in this case! Wow. I had always presumed the dimmed headlights meant the car was being driven with just the parking lights. Not knowing much about cars, I had never even considered the scenario you presented.

If he were on the lam for something car theft related, I wonder what we might find by way of old/archived msm articles. Particularly with someone who failed to show for a future court date. I'm not convinced the UID's name is John. It's possible he picked up that lighter anywhere, or asked someone for a light and failed to return the lighter. Pens and lighters, two things people tend to pick up without thinking.


Thanks again, Nikon. Your post opens up more idea's on area's to research.

Glad to have you here.

Cars were not required to have front and back side markers (fender/quarter panel lights) until the 1968 model year when the new federal regulations went in effect.

So a '62 Catalina would only have headlights, front turn signals, and taillights. Cars then (for the most part) did not have lighted turn signals for night driving. So on a '62 Catalina at night you only see headlights and taillights lit up.

That sounds like a good avenue to explore. If it was a disposable lighter, yes...but IIRC he had a Zippo. A Zippo, to most men then, was a prized (and costly) possession. It's a lighter you do not lose haphazardly.

 

[masnitram]

No, it wouldn't stall. The battery ran down because he was using the lights for night driving. Headlights do produce a significant electrical draw. Imagine forgetting to turn off your headlights overnight. In those old cars, the battery was only used to start the car the normal way, lights, and tunes. Everything was mechanical then. The generator/alternator's job is to keep the battery fully charged as you drive so you had juice to start up the car the next time you drive. Cars then were like lawnmowners - all you need to drive were gas, spark, and air.

Maybe. For the sake of probability I'd agree. If he stole it in board daylight, he could go anywhere he pleased as long as there was gas in the tank as the lights wouldn't be necessary. Rarely does anyone drive a hot car without having a hiding spot planned nearby unless they were fugitives. I suspect this john had to take the exit and fly by country roads in attempt to lose the cop.

Cars were not required to have front and back side markers (fender/quarter panel lights) until the 1968 model year when the new federal regulations went in effect.

So a '62 Catalina would only have headlights, front turn signals, and taillights. Cars then (for the most part) did not have lighted turn signals for night driving. So on a '62 Catalina at night you only see headlights and taillights lit up.

That sounds like a good avenue to explore. If it was a disposable lighter, yes...but IIRC he had a Zippo. A Zippo, to most men then, was a prized (and costly) possession. It's a lighter you do not lose haphazardly.

Thank you Nikon, I greatly appreciate the insight. I definitely learned something today and again....thanks.

Do you think perhaps the Zippo, if not his, may have been an heirloom? I read that Zippo lighters first hit the market in the 1930's. So then we're looking at World War II, The Korean War, and Vietnam etc where he may have lost his father, brother, etc...if he isn't the "John" on the lighter.

 

[Cubby]

Ditton what masnitram said.

I'm on my way out for a bit, but we need to look again at getting this UID exhumed for DNA. I keep thinking 1977 was before Gacy was caught. With appeal from Cook for families of the missing, maybe this doe's family submitted DNA thinking he might be a gacy victim. Of course that would come up no match, but maybe a match for this UID.


Giving this more thought. This seems like a case that should be solvable.

 

[Cubby]

I have found the name of someone who was providing youth and family services in Wheaton back in 1977. I am going to be putting together an email or letter (or both, hopefully with masnitram's help) to send with the hopes he might recognize our Delafield John Doe and might be able to forward the information to any one he might still be in contact with who provided services back then.

I will include the contact info for LE as well as the info on finding us here if they choose to reply here. Perhaps even with idea's of different avenues to explore having been more familiar with the happenings in Wheaton back in 1977.

It's probably a long shot, but at least it's getting his face and information in front of people who were providing services back in the 70's.

 

[masnitram]

Sounds great Cubby, I'd be very happy to help. I'll be sending you a PM with my contact information...:rocker:

I have found the name of someone who was providing youth and family services in Wheaton back in 1977. I am going to be putting together an email or letter (or both, hopefully with masnitram's help) to send with the hopes he might recognize our Delafield John Doe and might be able to forward the information to any one he might still be in contact with who provided services back then.

I will include the contact info for LE as well as the info on finding us here if they choose to reply here. Perhaps even with idea's of different avenues to explore having been more familiar with the happenings in Wheaton back in 1977.

It's probably a long shot, but at least it's getting his face and information in front of people who were providing services back in the 70's.

 

[Cubby]

Thank you, masnitram. We're going to have to tie the Wheaton aspect in with this approach. The Gaeddes (sp?) clothing and perhaps the bag of womens clothing. The zippo and why our John Doe might have been in Wheaton.

I hope everyone understands I don't want to post much about this contact for privacy reasons. If anything comes out of this avenue we will definately share it!

 

[Cubby]

Today marks the 35th anniversary of this case being unsolved.

Still praying we can find this uid's name and bring him home to his family.

 

[Cubby]

I spoke with masnitram and what we are probably going to do is put the detective handling this case in contact with the person I found who provided services in the Wheaton area back in 1977.

There are some hippa/current law privacy matters with this organization. Due to current privacy laws and the concerns which may go along with civilians making inquiry, we will probably send a letter and bullet point info to both the Detective and Wheaton contact and kind of see what happens from there.

We decided masnitram will be the main contact with LE and the Wheaton contact regarding this possible avenue to explore since masnitram has been in direct contact with the detective several times in the past.

Our hope with the Wheaton contact is the ability to get John Doe's information in front of various persons who may have been providing services in Wheaton in 1977 and give us, or the detective, some idea's on additional avenues to pursue/explore.

Again, it could be a long shot, but we would be remiss to not at least try to explore this avenue.

 

[Cubby]

I'm a little too tired to do it tonight, but within the next few days I will put together a map with the places of interest in the downtown Wheaton area which we know from WI LE.

The map will include the following:

The Wheaton Court house location in 1977.
Gaedes clothing store location
Wheaton public library.
Wheaton Train Station

If there are any other area's I may have missed that should be added please let me know.

 

[Cubby]

Additionally, I am in the downtown Wheaton area at least once a week these days. It would be fairly easy for me to stop at the Wheaton Public library while in the area.

Maybe we can start a list of what I might be looking for there which might help solve the mystery of this UID's name.

We know this john doe had some library books. masnitram, do we know if LE has the title of the books, or just a notation he was found with library books? And can you ask if the file indicates if the library books were from the Wheaton public library?

tia

 

[Cubby]

Another thought..... While the FOIA route I previously pursued was a dead end, I wonder if we can find a list of judges who sat in the Wheaton court house in 1977. It would be worth it, imo, to get our Delafield John Doe's info in front of them - if we can find them and they are still living.

 

[Cubby]

Map of places of interest in Wheaton.

A = Wheaton Court House 1977 (201 Reber Street)
B = Wheaton Public Library (225 N. Cross Street)
C = Gaedes Mens clothing store (124 N. Hale Street)
D = Wheaton Metra Train Station (402 W. Front Street)


http://maps.google.com/maps?saddr=201+Reber+Street,+Wheaton,+IL&daddr=225+North+Cross+Street,+Wheaton,+IL+to:124+North+Hale+Street,+Wheaton,+IL+to:Wheaton+Metra+Station,+Wheaton+Metra+Station,+402+West+Front+Street,+Wheaton,+IL+60187&hl=en&sll=41.8655,-88.107362&sspn=0.015948,0.027423&geocode=FTDMfgIdUqK_-inp4LUEYlQOiDFhlRlelRrpbg%3BFQjWfgIdcqG_-ikbdUqAiVQOiDGWvFMHS-TtNg%3BFf7RfgIdv5G_-ikdNpTAilQOiDHWFNLxeNmwew%3BFXHRfgIdaqq_-iHZ67oww4w_RymZiUy1iVQOiDHZ67oww4w_Rw&oq=Wheaton+Metra&t=h&mra=pd&z=17


As one can see from the above map, it is a 1.4 mile or 6 min drive between all 4 places above,. or a 21 minute walk between all 4 places.

 

[masnitram]

http://m.jsonline.com/more/news/crime/165087206.htmhttp://


I confirmed that the man buried on 11/22/77 is our John Doe and is next on the list for being exhumed.

Cubby- I'm working on the information you and I discussed. Sorry for the delay, in between my masters program and my kids....my extra time is a bit slim these days

 

[masnitram]

masnitram, do we know if LE has the title of the books, or just a notation he was found with library books? And can you ask if the file indicates if the library books were from the Wheaton public library?

tia

No indication of where the books came from. It is assumed that the reason they couldn't trace them back is that the library books may have been donated. Though "Wheaton" was noted as their possible origin along with his clothing.

 

[Cubby]

Take your time masnitram. Real life comes first. All we really need to do is put together a letter which we can send to both the detective assigned to this case and the Wheaton contact and send it out to both, along with sending the picture of the UID and the link here (if they choose to participate here) via flashdrive with the letter.

In the mean time I will get the wheaton contact address and tele to you within the next few days.

 

[Cubby]

The following case appears to have been solved/ID'd as a result of the Cook County sheriff's office's request for families of males who went missing in the 1970's to submit dna.

Identified! UT - Daniel Noe, found at Olympus Cove - Male, 17-22, April 2010 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community


All the more reason to get DNA from this UID. Maybe his family submitted dna and they know he was ruled out as a Gacy victim, but no match has come up because there is not yet dna for our Delafield John Doe.