AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #13

[MassGuy]

I agree. I will go with the times that the neighbor stated however I am still open to the idea she might have read the clock wrong and that changes everything. If you try to put what we have together in one scenario I image the perp coming to the front door and touching off the shotgun (if it was a shotgun) twice and that is the 2 loud shots the neighbors heard. I don't care 2 very loud shots, say from a shotgun are going to draw attention even at 250 yards. After that I can not imagine any perp in their right mind hanging around for at least another 20 minutes. But if she misread the clock and it was 12:58 it becomes a lot more clearer. But when they said the crime scene was extremely violent, or to that effect, I'm thinking maybe there was something else going on during those 20 minutes and she did indeed read her clock correctly. Being it was violent like they say I also have to believe it was personal in nature. I think if we just got one or two more facts from LE it would clear up a lot of the muddy picture MOO

I agree. As to the crime scene being described as brutal, I don’t read too much into that.

A shotgun would produce an extremely bloody crime scene. And this department, likely doesn’t have a great deal of experience with crime scenes like this.

Perhaps you’re right, and something more horrific went on there. I’m not sold on that though.

 

[oviedo]

Yup. There’s plenty of reasons why it could have possible evidentiary value.

Blood.

Bullet impacts.

Used in a struggle.

fingerprints/dna ?? I am really hopeful it's something!

 

[BB71]

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[kelizabethp]

this has probably already been discussed but don't you think that if JC was shot and in the doorway, there would be a lot of blood in that area and whom ever took Jayme would have had to either stepped in that blood in order to leave OR have known that there was another door that would get them out to the garage so they can leave that way? footprints OR or the person is familiar with the house?

 

[whisperOFwings]

LOL Let us know how that works out for ya. If I offered to tie my hubby up he wouln't be able to get to it fast enough. He would have a different reason in mind LOL

Lol, that's hilarious!!
He's been cool with experiments all these years at WS.
When I tell/ask him about being tied to the chair, he will most likely ask, What case on WS?

 

[MassGuy]

I absolutely agree with you that the attacked started with the kicked in door and the father shot. But we don't know what time that happened. The neighbors didn't arrive home until sometime after 11:30 pm. so it is possible that they never heard the first shots because they hadn't arrived home yet. Not saying I find that likely, but it is a possiblility.

It’s definitely possible. There would still be that pesky time gap, even in that case.

It’s the thing that bothers me most.

 

[photographer4]

That time you finally pulled out a google map to see where the heck the perp could have gone, and you realize that Thunder Bay, Ontario is only a little over five hours away from where this crime took place. I sure hope border officials were wide awake that night and have been since!

 

[PommyMommy]

... but the neighbors never saw them outside doing gardening work.

Can they even see the Closs home through the trees? How often are the neighbors outside? We've seen video of the Closs home to include a mowed lawn, flower beds, yard art and we know the house was painted two years ago. There are photos of Jayme outside on the property. How do you think the neighbors missed all that?

Good thinking, there is an Old Hwy 8, but its on the MN side of the border closer to Minneapolis.

Welcome to Websleuths, brando0555! ​

 

[Get off my Lawn!]

More info on the sound heard by the neighbours from the video cited before. Husband says "“It wasn’t like a hand gun or a 22 or a 410”.

Search for missing 13-year-old Jayme Closs expands as police hunt for 2 cars seen by Wisconsin home | Daily Mail Online

 

[debirlfan]

Brilliant point.
I'm sure the neighbours can quite easily recall whether it was 5 minutes or 25 minutes between hearing the shots and having police show up.

ETA...Just read read PommyMommy's (thanks) post on the neighbours not being aware of what took place next door until they woke up next morning....so my post is moot.

Wonder why it took many hours for LE to make contact the neighbours.....probably just a lack of personnel.
Small town, small police force.

It really does seem like the police would have contacted them that night, but....? As to whether it was 5 minutes or 25 - I'm guessing that if it had only been five minutes, they probably would have still been awake and would have noticed the commotion next door. That it was longer, and that they'd gone to sleep makes more sense to me. Having gone to sleep (plus any muffling due to being inside the house, rather than outside) would also explain why they didn't hear any more gunshots, if the mother wasn't shot until approximately the time of the call to 911.

 

[photographer4]

I absolutely agree with you that the attacked started with the kicked in door and the father shot. But we don't know what time that happened. The neighbors didn't arrive home until sometime after 11:30 pm. so it is possible that they never heard the first shots because they hadn't arrived home yet. Not saying I find that likely, but it is a possiblility.

I'm inclined to think that the first rounds were fired before the neighbor got home. I'm thinking the two they heard were ones maybe intended for Jayme? Then she hid and managed to get the 911 out before someone took her away?

 

[debirlfan]

Exactly. I don’t have a firm theory, simply because of that time gap. If it doesn’t exist, then things simply make a lot more sense to me.

This looks like a home invasion type crime. These crimes are generally executed quickly, with a hard and fast entry and quick exit.

I can’t make sense of a home invasion with a pivot towards something more methodical.

The time gap makes sense if the perp/perps were searching the house, or trying to get information (on drugs/money/weapons?) out of the mother. I think that might be the case, but I suspect they had the wrong house, and there was nothing to find.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Can they even see the Closs home through the trees? How often are the neighbors outside? We've seen video of the Closs home to include a mowed lawn, flower beds, yard art and we know the house was painted two years ago. There are photos of Jayme outside on the property. How do you think the neighbors missed all that?

Welcome to Websleuths, brando0555! ​

That's why I don't find it relevant whether or not the neighbors ever saw the family out in the yard or not. It's not like the houses were side by side with adjoining lawns or anything. It's not like they have sidewalks they would walk on a regular basis. I live in a very rural area, it is NOT uncommon not to see your neighbors out doing things on their properties, and yet...grass still gets cut, gardens get tended, cars still get washed, etc. etc.

 

[MassGuy]

The time gap makes sense if the perp/perps were searching the house, or trying to get information (on drugs/money/weapons?) out of the mother. I think that might be the case, but I suspect they had the wrong house, and there was nothing to find.

I agree.

It would be helpful to know if anything was taken, or if the house was ransacked. It would make things look very different.

I’d still be perplexed by the kidnapping in that case, but it atleast would make a bit of sense.

 

[JCzMum]

Maybe it’s already been mentioned but Sheriff posted on FB that with the help of Jennie-O, the reward has been increased to $50k

Barron County Sheriff's Department

 

[PommyMommy]

More info on the sound heard by the neighbours from the video cited before. Husband says "“It wasn’t like a hand gun or a 22 or a 410”.

Search for missing 13-year-old Jayme Closs expands as police hunt for 2 cars seen by Wisconsin home | Daily Mail Online

Yes, but prior to that at about the 1:11 mark, he says, "I was tipping off man, she had to wake me up to say..." So, did he actually hear the shots or was it just his wife? Because it sounds like he was asleep. MOO

 

[minnphatts]

Bolded by me.
Well, I have a Windsor chair I kept from a set I bought 20-ish?? years ago.
I gave the table and chairs to my SIL a few years ago.
Anywhoo. I kept 1 chair as my computer chair but haven't used it in years.

So I will see if my hubby will let me tie him to it today when he gets home.
We will see if he can break the spindles.

If we extrapolate further on the "restraints" theory regarding the chair. We have no idea what the purpose for restraining a Closs family member would be, or how long or sturdy those restraints were intended to last. For example, perhaps there is only one PERP and he needed to temporarily restrain a family member to control an aspect of the situation. We can't make an assumption that a restraint was meant to be iron clad. It could have been used to simply stop someone from fleeing the scene over a short period of time (all speculative).

Not the simplest explanation regarding the chair, but we just don't know.

 

[Get off my Lawn!]

More info on the sound heard by the neighbours from the video cited before. Husband says "“It wasn’t like a hand gun or a 22 or a 410”.

Search for missing 13-year-old Jayme Closs expands as police hunt for 2 cars seen by Wisconsin home | Daily Mail Online

He further said:
“It was a good size calibre gun.”

 

[Get off my Lawn!]

Yes, but prior to that at about the 1:11 mark, he says, "I was tipping off man, she had to wake me up to say..." So, did he actually hear the shots or was it just his wife? MOO

Yes but notice how she cut across him to keep his story straight!

 

[Jethro4WS]

Refresh my memory about school. Did she switch from her neighborhood school to one further away but closer to the aunt? And when, just this school year in August/September (whenever school starts in WI)?

It would surprise me, and in my experience, if public school transportation would transport her to her home if she was 'open-enrolled' in a school other than her home school.

Seems likely the neighbors saw the school bus last year, but not this year. Not sure it matters regardless, as the neighbors' statements about knowing whether or not they had a child were all over the place.

Edited: my grammar sucks once again

It is the opposite.

She had been going to the middle school in the town where the caretaker lived - Cameron. When her caretaker moved to Barron, Jayme transferred to the middle school in Barron.

If you know who the caretaker is and their address history (when they moved) the transfer of schools was for this year.

What is unknown is how long the arrangement of going to the school in Cameron had been going on prior to the transfer to the Barron School District. It is possible that Jayme attended Cameron schools throughout her education until this year, but it is unknown that this was the case.