AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #14

[Mollyandme]

http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/barron+county+call+log.pdf
Just curious, On the dispatch log, 6th page, 8th entry down, why would they be faxing info to Ontonagon county Sheriffs Dept. That is in Michigan. Just something I didn't notice before

I don't know much about the geography up there but could someone cross into Canada from that county even if it requires crossing part of Lake Superior?

Maybe family or close associates have land there that they wanted to check out? Maybe they found paperwork or documents in the home relating to a location in Ontonagon County? Or a family member in Ontonagon county needed to be notified of what happened? I believe this info was faxed fairly early on so maybe they had info from the home or from questioning family members that made them feel it was important to notify this county?

 

[Cardinal47]

This is the link to the obituary in case anybody missed it.
Obituary for James and Denise Closs at Rausch & Steel Funeral Home

 

[Tippy Lynn]

Murder Comes To Town is stories like this and just for the record it's usually somebody they know or have connections too.

IMO the person(s) responsible will be someone they know or have a connections to.

 

[sun16]

Ok it’s getting weird in here ... checking out for the night.

 

[photographer4]

If the shoe fits, .....

If the shoe doesn’t fit you must acquit?

Sorry. Couldn’t help myself.

 

[Parks]

Interesting perspective. But we don't know that the glass slider wasn't broken as well. The only clear view I have seen of that slider door, it appears to be an open doorway. Is there one that shows the glass intact on both sides of the slider? Some have speculated there was more than one perp. I lean towards there being only one person myself, but someone kicking down the door and/or shooting whomever came to it could have been a distraction if there was more than one person.

The side doorway on the deck can be seen in this video at about .34:

Exactly. If there was more than one perp, someone could’ve knocked on the front door while someone slid in through the side glass door. We don’t know much about James except he was found dead at the door. Could’ve been *advertiser censored* in the back of the head while distracted trying to figure out what was going on at the front.

 

[DeepThinker]

Probably because I’ve seen the movie “Badlands” (with Sissy Spacek & Martin Sheen) too many times, my mind keeps going back to my #1 theory... which is basically:

Jayme may have met or been enticed by an older guy on-line and an on-line relationship began. Mom and dad found out about Jayme’s new “love interest” and told Jayme she had to stop texting/chatting with him.

Maybe arguments began between Jayme & her parents over the guy.

Jayme agrees to sneak out & meet the guy and tells him to come after her parents are in bed & asleep.

Jayme gets up, gets dressed and when the boyfriend arrives at the door, dad comes out of his bedroom, opens the door slightly, with the chain locked.

Dad tells the guy to go away. Tells Jayme she can not leave or see the guy. Jayme says she wants to go. The guy pushes on the door and breaks the door jamb.

Mom wakes up, gets dad’s hunting gun and threatens the guy to leave or else! Dad and the guy get into a physical altercation. Guy is able to get gun from mom (or maybe dad had the gun.)

The guy shoots dad and then mom with dad’s gun. Mom gets to her cell phone & calls 911 before she dies.
Jayme is crying and yelling help. The guy discovers mom called 911, tells Jayme she’s coming with him.

The guy grabs Jayme, the gun and they make a run for it.
MOO
I don’t have Jayme being as happy being on the run as Sissy Spacek was in the movie. In fact, I think she’d be very distraught and in shock. Of course, this isn’t how she expected things to happen!

MOO

I posted this theory several threads & days ago, but wanted to bring it up again for those just joining us!

This is very similar to the scenario I have been keeping in the back of my mind, that makes sense. You outlined it pretty well. I also have a feeling it was James and Denise standing up to whoever was coming to take their daughter. jmo, of course

 

[gitana1]

I was not making a judgement on LE performance in this case. I think they are doing a great job. Was just supplying current information on homicide clearance rates.

I understand. Some were, however. Which is what the conversation about percentages stemmed from.

 

[SuziQ]

FWIW. Unless you modify a sliding glass door. All you have to do is lift out the stationary section to get in.

 

[Andreee]

That seems like it would work more if the people whose child was taken from them were very politically active, so it was an obvious reason why they were being targeted, and if a statement was released to draw attention to the cause.

yes, its too much of a stretch otherwise.

 

[photographer4]

From the log transcript... wondering what a “lift assist” is? I put a red mark beside line question. Sorry it’s sideways. I couldn’t get it straight on cell copy.

 

[Sachi]

Thank you to everyone here. Grateful to those bringing us back to the facts of what we know and Occam’s Razor vs some of our wandering ponders which, who knows , could have been. We have little to go on. Hope Jayme is found very soon and want to believe that she is alive, feeling for her family. Keep at it people, in kindness of course.

 

[Andreee]

That's a really good point!

Does this maybe suggest whoever did it wasn't familiar with the house/hadn't scouted it out? Or maybe that they wanted to go through the front door for another reason?

I would think a sliding door would have very strong glass, sometimes double paned.

 

[SkipperKey3]

Everyone bihas their own way of looking at cases which is one of the reasons WS posters differing points of view is so interesting.

But for me I tend to take a more simplistic approach.

I dont try to rearrange the known timeline to make things fit.

I dont discount such things as the police in this case may really not know what the vehicles are.

I believe they absolutely do and that is why they have published the stock photos of the 2 vehicles of interest.

There are many ways they know what the vehicles are from shape of taillights...headlights and windows and much more.

So I take things at face value based on what is known at the time and then apply what is more logical...to me anyway.

Since I have been following cases for so long now one of the things I have learned is most cases aren't nearly as complex as some may think or make them out to be. Usually what's the easiest route to any conclusion turns out to be correct imo.

So if I take everything that is known at this time without rearranging or omitting any of it this is still my conclusion at this time. It is subject to change if new info is released.

First I do not know the motive or who the suspect could be. None of those facts have been presented yet.

However based on what I do know I think it shows James was murdered immediately when he came to his door eliminating his biggest threat.

Imo those are the 2 shots heard by the neighbors from the outside being fired into the entrance of their home where James was located and where it all began.

Since I do believe the neighbors timeline then the suspect entered the home in order to murder Denise but there had to be more happening during that 20 minutes before the 911 call was made. The only thing that makes sense to me is the suspect first had to get full control over Denise and Jayme. He may have one tie the other one up and then either tied up Jayme or threatened to shoot her if she moved an inch.

I do not think the timeline supports Denise was shot right away. I do think the wooden chair was involved in some manner even may have been used to restrain Denise.

I also believe it is a good possibilty before Denise was murdered the killer may have had some type of heated conversation before shooting Denise. Of course I do not know what was said by the killer during this time window. But just speculating it easily could have been Denise pleading for them to not harm Jayme or it could be demanding to know where any valuables were inside of the home or other things unknown at this time.

But based on the timeline I do believe some kind of conversation was ensuing for a few minutes.

Since I have not heard anyone from LE who stated Denise was found inside one of their bathrooms I do not include that and consider it irrelevant for now just like I have never seen it verified the weapon was a shotgun either.

I dont believe Denise made the 911 call. I believe at the time both parents would have been dead or Denise was dying unable to speak and instead it was most likely Jayme who somehow was able to get her mom's phone as the killer was with Denise and distracted for a short time.

However the suspect realized the 911 call had been made throwing a kink into his plan.

Imo he would know it would only take a few minutes for police to arrive. He knew he had to leave immediately taking Jayme with him. Maybe he put her in his trunk.

Since it has been almost two weeks with no sighting of Jayme I think she has most likely been murdered by now.

In Elizabeth Smart's case no one was murdered inside their home when she was taken.

Heartbreakingly it did happen to little Jaymes parents before she was taken so it's an entirely different set of horrific circumstances for her.

Imo and nothing more..

I think that is a very methodical approach. Of course facts can be interpreted various ways, and various actions can account for the same result, so we must be careful. Fitting all the pieces together in the simplest way possible, though, is the most logical and straightforward way to begin.

And account for what evidence you know. For example, you mentioned the chair. But what about the mattress that they took? Unfortunately, the combination of the perps being there for 20 minutes or so before the 911 call, and the mattress being taken away lead my mind to thoughts that I sincerely hope aren't true... Hopefully, the 20 minutes are as has been suggested, the perps trying to get information and/or valuables.

What still seems odd to me is that first they violently forced their way, killing JC, and eventually DC, yet in the end took Jayme away with them. Those two facts just don't seem to fit together. Two different MOs in my mind. Which means taking Jayme may well have been an on-the-spot impulse move, for whatever reason.

Some unsolved cases just stick with me. Libby and Abby. Lizzie and Lyric. Michaela G. And others. This one hits just as hard, IMO. I keep checking news sources and here, hoping somehow that Jayme has been found safe and unharmed. Hoping. Hoping.

 

[Abba's Tears]

From the log transcript... wondering what a “lift assist” is? I put a red mark beside line question. Sorry it’s sideways. I couldn’t get it straight on cell copy.

Usually a situation where someone has fallen but is not injured and needs assistance getting back into their chair.

 

[LietKynes]

I'm losing hope that she's alive; but I keep remembering the 'psychic' who told Amanda Berry's mom that her daughter had passed.
That mom didn't live to see Amanda again -- but Amanda was very much alive.

I am so sorry for the relatives and friends of Denise, James, and Jayme ! How do you make sense of this ? What if Jayme is never found ? Do they just go on with life ? Probably so , but nothing will ever be the same for them.

The friends at Jayme's school must be so shaken..... the killer(s) is still out there .

 

[Andreee]

You don't break any glass. Google " How to get in patio glass sliders" or go to You Tube for same. It's so easy,and many people still lose their innocent lives this way every year.
My knowledge of how to rock the lock and slide the doors off the tracks comes from being locked out of my own house years ago ( not this house- I won't live in a house with glass sliders any longer!)

All I know is some sliding doors are very, very heavy and awkward to manouvre because of that.

 

[Gardener1850]

http://media.graytvinc.com/documents/barron+county+call+log.pdf
Just curious, On the dispatch log, 6th page, 8th entry down, why would they be faxing info to Ontonagon county Sheriffs Dept. That is in Michigan. Just something I didn't notice before

It's still a big mystery as far as I know. Some of us have speculated they were trying to get in contact with family in that area to inform them of the deaths and/or to make sure Jayme was not there. LE would go to family members in person to inform them (or investigate) instead of simply calling. But I don't think any of us know for sure why that county in Michigan was contacted. We are just guessing.

 

[gitana1]

Everyone bihas their own way of looking at cases which is one of the reasons WS posters differing points of view is so interesting.

But for me I tend to take a more simplistic approach.

I dont try to rearrange the known timeline to make things fit.

I dont discount such things as the police in this case may really not know what the vehicles are.

I believe they absolutely do and that is why they have published the stock photos of the 2 vehicles of interest.

There are many ways they know what the vehicles are from shape of taillights...headlights and windows and much more.

So I take things at face value based on what is known at the time and then apply what is more logical...to me anyway.

Since I have been following cases for so long now one of the things I have learned is most cases aren't nearly as complex as some may think or make them out to be. Usually what's the easiest route to any conclusion turns out to be correct imo.

So if I take everything that is known at this time without rearranging or omitting any of it this is still my conclusion at this time. It is subject to change if new info is released.

First I do not know the motive or who the suspect could be. None of those facts have been presented yet.

However based on what I do know I think it shows James was murdered immediately when he came to his door eliminating his biggest threat.

Imo those are the 2 shots heard by the neighbors from the outside being fired into the entrance of their home where James was located and where it all began.

Since I do believe the neighbors timeline then the suspect entered the home in order to murder Denise but there had to be more happening during that 20 minutes before the 911 call was made. The only thing that makes sense to me is the suspect first had to get full control over Denise and Jayme. He may have one tie the other one up and then either tied up Jayme or threatened to shoot her if she moved an inch.

I do not think the timeline supports Denise was shot right away. I do think the wooden chair was involved in some manner even may have been used to restrain Denise.

I also believe it is a good possibilty before Denise was murdered the killer may have had some type of heated conversation before shooting Denise. Of course I do not know what was said by the killer during this time window. But just speculating it easily could have been Denise pleading for them to not harm Jayme or it could be demanding to know where any valuables were inside of the home or other things unknown at this time.

But based on the timeline I do believe some kind of conversation was ensuing for a few minutes.

Since I have not heard anyone from LE who stated Denise was found inside one of their bathrooms I do not include that and consider it irrelevant for now just like I have never seen it verified the weapon was a shotgun either.

I dont believe Denise made the 911 call. I believe at the time both parents would have been dead or Denise was dying unable to speak and instead it was most likely Jayme who somehow was able to get her mom's phone as the killer was with Denise and distracted for a short time.

However the suspect realized the 911 call had been made throwing a kink into his plan.

Imo he would know it would only take a few minutes for police to arrive. He knew he had to leave immediately taking Jayme with him. Maybe he put her in his trunk.

Since it has been almost two weeks with no sighting of Jayme I think she has most likely been murdered by now.

In Elizabeth Smart's case no one was murdered inside their home when she was taken.

Heartbreakingly it did happen to little Jaymes parents before she was taken so it's an entirely different set of horrific circumstances for her.

Imo and nothing more..

Thank you for sharing!!! I always look forward to your opinions. Thoughtful, experienced and often right on the mark.

 

[curiousmomof4]

Reading through the latest posts, any word on the car found earlier today in the river? It certainly looks like one of the vehicles LE has been looking for.