AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #18

[Cardinal47]

Okay.

I find it highly doubtful this murderer and kidnapper would let his biggest threat loose in the home to even make it to his front door.

Imo it is much more logical to me that the police have it right and he was killed answering the door.

Since it was late at night he being the only man in the home he would be the one to come to the door thus I think he was shot right there immediately and died instantly or very shortly afterwards.

Imo

I've always wondered about that initial contact. Was Mr Closs a man that would fling open the door if somebody knocked or would he be a cautious man! Evidently he didn't like what he saw or heard since the door wasnt opened but kicked in!

He was a big man so my next thought is what caused him to not open that door? Several men? A gun pointed at him? Threats?

All speculation but the mind does wander in cases like this.

One last thought. If this was more than one at the door wouldn't the community be in danger?

 

[BeeGirl]

My biggest concern with this case at this point is complacency. I think the sheriff will be dedicated to seeing this through. But he can’t do it without prolonged interest and help, and tips are running out. Parents typically keep these desperate searches front and center in people’s minds- for as long as it takes. I fear the community won’t fight for Jayme as persistently as Denise & James would have. I hope this town continues to rally for her, check in with LE & media, and persist relentlessly for truth & justice for the long haul. Not criticizing the community. At some point people need to move on, with or without resolution. I just hate thinking about the fact that sometimes we never get answers and that this may become one of those cases. I hope not.

You eloquently articulated the exact way I feel. I'm also afraid the loss of Denise and James may render Jayme's disappearance unsolvable; who can give insight into your habits, patterns, schedules and associates like the people you live with? I fear the only known keepers of important info are now gone.

 

[Mercedes]

Agreed! A bit too much of a coincidence! And of course the kidnapper and killer are the same person, that is a 'given', the authorities certainly don't need to even spell that out.

It occurs to me that LE is avoiding the mention of the murders so as not to antagonize the perpetrators into harming Jayme more than they have. Their comments, as you know, have pretty much been limited to bringing Jayme home or finding the cars.

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Thread 18...where is Jayme?
MOO

 

[I met murder on the way]

What is the percentage of chance that a girl kidnapped two weeks+ ago is still alive, especially as there has (evidently) been no call for ransom?

 

[I met murder on the way]

.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

I don't want to start another Smrekar debate, but they have also said that the second shot was muffled:

Dozens of volunteers help in foot search for missing Wisconsin 13-year-old

"Smrekar and her husband, Tom, had gone to bed about 12:15 a.m. Monday when minutes later she said she heard “BOOM!” Within seconds came another but more muffled bang."

Imo that was because he was then entering into the interior of the home.

The neighbors lived hundreds of yards away correct?

The further they went inside the home there would be many sound buffers where the multiple gunshots wouldnt be heard from the outside.

Also the second gunshot could have been a contact shot to James where his body would muffle the sound of that shot.

Jmo

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Yes, I was thinking maybe the phone was in someone's pocket, or even in a different room, as they could not hear any one actually speaking into it, only background noise. Jmo

Trying to catch up from last night but while looking through articles something caught my eye concerning the 911 call and our discussion. Maybe there was something heard on that call? This was probably already discussed in the earlier threads but it is sticking out to me after the Sheriffs interview yesterday.
"Investigators believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home, Fitzgerald said." 911 call traced to phone of missing Wisconsin girl's mother, authorities say - CNN
I could quote the same from other articles but there would be to many. I haven't been able to find the sheriff actually making this statement and would like to see the context. If anyone has a link please post it.

 

[Cardinal47]

What is the percentage of chance that a girl kidnapped two weeks+ ago is still alive, especially as there has (evidently) been no call for ransom?

Reference the Abigail Hernandez abduction. Mail was sent to her mother at a different address. Once it was picked up it was not disclosed for a while. Hopefully family is monitoring the mail at jayme's home because everybody's gone.

 

[Charliegizmo49]

What is the percentage of chance that a girl kidnapped two weeks+ ago is still alive, especially as there has (evidently) been no call for ransom?

Small

 

[Le Singe]

Trying to catch up from last night but while looking through articles something caught my eye concerning the 911 call and our discussion. Maybe there was something heard on that call? This was probably already discussed in the earlier threads but it is sticking out to me after the Sheriffs interview yesterday.
"Investigators believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home, Fitzgerald said." 911 call traced to phone of missing Wisconsin girl's mother, authorities say - CNN
I could quote the same from other articles but there would be to many. I haven't been able to find the sheriff actually making this statement and would like to see the context. If anyone has a link please post it.

it was in the press conference on the afternoon of the first wednesday (maybe thursday). I think it was the same one with the results of the autopsy but i'm not 100% positive about that part.

 

[Intrigued25]

Country highway. Not heavy traffic but consistent.

Would HWY 8 be the usual route for employees at Jennie O and therefore more travelled before/after shift changes?

 

[debirlfan]

The idea that the father was apparently shot while answering the door/very near the door is a bit perplexing, imo. If a perp was planning a home invasion, it seems odd they would knock on the door – past midnight, apparently – as doing so in a rural area in a gun-friendly state might likely see a resident answer the door while carrying a firearm. Perp doesn’t want that, no sir. So, under the planned home-invasion scenario, a knock at the door seems unlikely.

Still, the father, it would appear, answered or was near the door when he was shot, after -- as reports have seemed to indicate -- the door was either kicked in or shot in. So, why was the father where he was? It’s possible he heard something outside the door (not much stealth involved by the perp, if that was the case) and went to have a look. Maybe the dog barked. I’m dubious about that scenario – just seems a stretch that the kicking in/shooting in of the door would happen right when the dad was approaching.

Speculation - maybe the first kick wasn't sufficient, and dad went to investigate the noise. For that matter, that Challenger might be quite loud - if it pulled into the yard after midnight, dad might have been looking to see who drove in.

 

[PommyMommy]

Jayme Closs Investigation Scaled Back
The Emergency Operations Center will no longer be open at night, but the department says the tip line will continue to be open 24/7.

The sheriff's department says while some of the physical support, like paper signs, for Jayme may be fading that doesn't mean the community has given up. Fitzgerald says the hope that Jayme will come home is just as strong.

As of Thursday morning, Fitzgerald says there were still 25 law enforcement personnel working on the case from monitoring social media, reviewing tips and handling leads.

As we enter hunting season the department is asking hunters to watch for any items of interest on their land and to also watch their trail cameras for anything

 

[MsBetsy]

Trying to catch up from last night but while looking through articles something caught my eye concerning the 911 call and our discussion. Maybe there was something heard on that call? This was probably already discussed in the earlier threads but it is sticking out to me after the Sheriffs interview yesterday.
"Investigators believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home, Fitzgerald said." 911 call traced to phone of missing Wisconsin girl's mother, authorities say - CNN
I could quote the same from other articles but there would be to many. I haven't been able to find the sheriff actually making this statement and would like to see the context. If anyone has a link please post it.

I think her voice can be heard on the call, and that's one thing that makes them so sure she was there. Although he would not confirm the word "help" was heard later at the PC, it was still reported that Fitzgerald did say that in reports on the first or second day, according to a local news source, WAEU13. I'm thinking it was she who yelled help, if it's true that's what was really heard. Jmo

 

[Angleterre]

The double-agent confidential informant is truly bizarre, I had to sidetrack to find out more. I couldn’t even imagine something like that.

What have I missed here please?

 

[Charliegizmo49]

Trying to catch up from last night but while looking through articles something caught my eye concerning the 911 call and our discussion. Maybe there was something heard on that call? This was probably already discussed in the earlier threads but it is sticking out to me after the Sheriffs interview yesterday.
"Investigators believe Jayme was at home during the shooting based on details from the 911 call and evidence from the home, Fitzgerald said." 911 call traced to phone of missing Wisconsin girl's mother, authorities say - CNN
I could quote the same from other articles but there would be to many. I haven't been able to find the sheriff actually making this statement and would like to see the context. If anyone has a link please post it.

I don’t think it was a direct quote but a part of a reporters interpretation. Yesterday he said there was nothing in the 911 call to help. He looked exhausted.

 

[CuriousMaine]

Please excuse my naiveté regarding the sound of gunshots.
The neighbours stated they heard two however, some forums have stated that multiple rounds were shot.
If multiple rounds were shot would the neighbours only hear two as two shots were outside the home and the rest inside? (I have read somewhere that the lock on the door was shot at)
If only two shots, both inside the home, would the sound be loud enough for neighbours to hear?

That's a good question, we don't know the answer though.

IMO, shots outside would be louder sounding (from next door) than shots coming from inside the house.
It gets cold in WI. Homes both presumably are built with well-insulated exterior walls.
I can think of several plausible reasons neighbor may hear some, but not all, of the shots.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

Somebody several threads back mentioned what seemed like an abnormally high number of registered sex offenders in the area and others have mentioned quite a few drug related offenses. I hadn’t seen this though, just a good old local “police beat.” I’m getting the distinct impression that this area has a lot more problems than I initially thought.

Courthouse News

You never know. I felt that way with the DG Alaska case. It was like a deeply buried evil had been unearthed exposing one evil crime after another with all the same kids. Rape, drugs, murder. Even a prior death their "friend" ruled accidental shooting was revisited and is now being prosecuted. It was almost to much to comprehend in a small town and the ages of those involved. And to add, DG was a very good kid.

 

[thesnowflakesparkles]

Imo that was because he was then entering into the interior of the home.

The neighbors lived hundreds of yards away correct?

The further they went inside the home there would be many sound buffers where the multiple gunshots wouldnt be heard from the outside.

Jmo

I think it definitely makes more sense if the shooter was moving outdoors to inside (which given the small amount of info seems more likely). My point was mainly that everything except what Fitzgerald has said needs to be taken with a grain of salt-and even then he could be strategically misleading about details for investigative reasons.

I measured around 760 feet (I am not good at visualizing yards, but that is about 254) in the attached image.

I agree with your assessment, many different factors can change how audible sound is-insulation, background noise, hearing loss, tree cover, distance, etc. so it is very possible that were more than two.

Edit:removed confusing double negative