AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #28

[ilovechili]

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I will say that if this was not personal, the two biggest places for someone to be connected to in this area would be the employer or the casino, if not simply a wrong house.

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[gipsypup]

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I will say that if this was not personal, the two biggest places for someone to be connected to in this area would be the employer or the casino, if not simply a wrong house.

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Yes, I agree with you again ilovechili! Unfortunately, casinos do attract some people that aren't there just to enjoy and gamble. Many times crimes are committed outside the casino and/or close to the casino property. <modsnip - off topic>

 

[ilovechili]

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/a29211ef-4666-4a1b-9add-419e8e18d00c-jpeg.157044/

AMBER ALERT - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #25

 

[ilovechili]

Whoops I posted that wrong. Is it just me or is the right side of the cabinet in this picture, right side toward the bottom a piece of black tape? Something is extending past the wood? And I vary between thinking there are more than a few pieces... Maybe it was hit?

 

[CuriousMaine]

I think your right... but Rhoden murders makes me pause.. a lot of similar items in crime...

Rural mostly area drug problems
Multiple deaths..with intent to kill.
Looked like executions

Dogs left unkilled.

Took them 2 yrs.. they had 5x the evidence.

We could have POI, Fitzgerald has to make stick, needs slip up, or something.

Sadly I think he needs body to tie with certainty to crime.. I’m guessing he’s playing coy in hopes of getting the girl / body ..and can then build case.

Good points. Agree. It does leave me conflicted/mystified too.

There are also many recent cases where the perps were known very well by the victims, but offhand, it seems the perps used a ruse to abduct them. H. Anderson and this MN abduction come to mind. Raped, held captive for 29 days, girl swims across lake to escape, police say

But this Closs case appears more of a blitz than a ruse, which may be an indication it was not someone close to the family. Possibly someone who Jayme would not have gone with willingly, even with a good sounding story. I don't know. It's definitely a mystery.

 

[Gardener1850]

Wait...but how does that mean perp wasn't a hunter? Could've hunted in the past and could've hunted after the crime. This person definitely had knowledge of firearms and how to shoot to kill. Could be a hunter, could be someone with a police or military background.

BBM. But plenty of people have that knowledge without being hunters or in the military or police. I know how to fire a handgun but I don't have any of those backgrounds. I learned for my own personal protection. Criminals might learn to fire guns well for the purpose of carrying out their crimes. I find it offensive to imply that hunters, people in the military or police officers might enjoy killing people. None of the hunters I know do it because they are blood thirsty and enjoy killing things. Most hunters I know do it to bring home meat for their family and as a bonding sport they can enjoy with others. Hunting requires a lot of patience and sitting and waiting and usually you are far away from the animal when you shoot. It's not at all the same thing as kicking in a door, shooting two people at close range and kidnapping a child. JMO.

 

[ilovechili]

Yes, I agree with you again ilovechili! Unfortunately, casinos do attract some people that aren't there just to enjoy and gamble. Many times crimes are committed outside the casino and/or close to the casino property. <modsnip - off topic>

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I joined this particular forum after some time of reading posts because I felt it was the most respectful and does not allow anyone to gossip or bash victims for the most part. Those same rules though are challenging too to explain one's theories without saying some reasons one thinks them. I like the rules though, it protects the victims and their families and that is the most important. I just need to learn how to comment without breaking them!

 

[spiderbud]

*

Whoops I posted that wrong. Is it just me or is the right side of the cabinet in this picture, right side toward the bottom a piece of black tape? Something is extending past the wood? And I vary between thinking there are more than a few pieces... Maybe it was hit?

Left cabinet door it looks like it could be broken near the handle, BUT it doesn't appear splintered... you can easily see things behind it so it's not tape...

*EDIT *Looking at the video posted it is a photograph slipped into the wood frame in front of the glass.

 

[ilovechili]

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Left cabinet door it looks like it could be broken near the handle, BUT it doesn't appear splintered... you can easily see things behind it so it's not tape...

*EDIT *Looking at the video posted it is a photograph slipped into the wood frame in front of the glass.

I think I can see what you mean, do you mean with the picture leaning forward some so that it "appears" to be over the wood edge?

 

[daisy6441]

Wait...but how does that mean perp wasn't a hunter? Could've hunted in the past and could've hunted after the crime. This person definitely had knowledge of firearms and how to shoot to kill. Could be a hunter, could be someone with a police or military background.

I've never hunted and the only thing I ever killed was a snake. Also never been in the military. I can hit a target very accurately though. I like target shooting and my husband loves to hand me a 22 and tell people to watch. Shocked the hell out of my brother-in-law when I reduced a cigarette pack floating on a pond to confetti. Its not hard to hit a person in the chest and kill them especially if its a big calibur. Shot gun or large rifle can just about cut someone in half.

 

[daisy6441]

S

Ince we don't know the exact layout James could have been on either side. He could have even been right in the front and the gun was angled in either direction... The blood splatter should follow the trajectory of the bullet... This is only speculation trying to explain why there appears to be minimal damage to the cabinet. I have to see how far I can blow up the pictures to see if I can find signs of blood splatter, but the pictures are so dark. I doubt if I can see much...

It suddenly hit me. What if he kicks the door and James is coming around a sofa on the right side of the house. He is shot and Denise rushes out of the bedroom after trying to dial 911 and is shot falling behind the furniture and not immediately visible. Jayme hears this and runs out of her room in the dark to a figure that looks like her father standing there. That could be how he only came in the entrance and was able to grab her.

 

[human]

I think the cabinet placement is really strange. Has anyone ever seen such a placement right by a front door? And the snowmen right in a walking pathway. Makes no sense.

If James fell, how did he not fall on any of those items? Where would the door fall? In or out of the house?

Wouldn’t the door fall into the house?

Where were the bullet casings? In or outside?

Could LE have moved some of these things?

If the carpet was removed, they would have to move things.

Does anyone know when this door pic was taken in relationship to the carpet being removed?

I saw pictures of carpet removal, but that could have been bedroom carpet

 

[JenniD]

Here is an enhanced photo

 

[daisy6441]

I think the cabinet placement is really strange. Has anyone ever seen such a placement right by a front door? And the snowmen right in a walking pathway. Makes no sense.

If James fell, how did he not fall on any of those items? Where would the door fall? In or out of the house?

Wouldn’t the door fall into the house?

Where were the bullet casings? In or outside?

Could LE moved some of these things?

If the carpet was removed, they would have to move things.

Does anyone know when this door pic was taken in relationship to the carpet being removed?

I saw pictures of carpet removal, but that could have been bedroom carpet

A piece of the door might be dislodged but it would still be on the hinges.

 

[human]

A piece of the door might be dislodged but it would still be on the hinges.

There is no door attached to the hinges in the picture

 

[Oakland CA]

Jumping off Jax49's post for reference only....

https://www.websleuths.com/forums/attachments/a29211ef-4666-4a1b-9add-419e8e18d00c-jpeg.157044/

AMBER ALERT - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #25

Re: the front door/hutch photo.

I think it's quite clear the photo was taken from quite a few feet left of centre. You can see this from looking at the uppermost pieces of wrought iron railings.

I'm not sure if the hutch is even in the line of sight (from outside) if one was standing perpendicular to the front door.

 

[gipsypup]

I think the cabinet placement is really strange. Has anyone ever seen such a placement right by a front door? And the snowmen right in a walking pathway. Makes no sense.

If James fell, how did he not fall on any of those items? Where would the door fall? In or out of the house?

Wouldn’t the door fall into the house?

Where were the bullet casings? In or outside?

Could LE have moved some of these things?

If the carpet was removed, they would have to move things.

Does anyone know when this door pic was taken in relationship to the carpet being removed?

I saw pictures of carpet removal, but that could have been bedroom carpet

I'm leaning towards LE moving things around. But, just another fact we don't know for sure.IMO

 

[Rubiconbob]

Also, just reviewing the DM article again that says "According to the family Denise and Jayme were "inseparable" but there was a certain disconnect between James and the rest of the family." (Daily Mail Exclusive 12/6/18) In separate interviews the brother said he had a "gut feeling" and the Aunt said she thought it appeared to be "planned". Hoping for a break of some sort in this case. For all we know, LE may have some confirmed DNA and are putting this puzzle together. The days are now becoming months.

It suddenly hit me. What if he kicks the door and James is coming around a sofa on the right side of the house. He is shot and Denise rushes out of the bedroom after trying to dial 911 and is shot falling behind the furniture and not immediately visible. Jayme hears this and runs out of her room in the dark to a figure that looks like her father standing there. That could be how he only came in the entrance and was able to grab her.

That’s about what most people assumed ..

Still hard to put puzzle ftogether with only getting 40 percent the pieces and there all black..

Think your spot on ... kick door in.. James there quickly to stop intruder Denise quickly there after..

Main question is was 911 call before or after shooting... jayme tied to scene cause voice heard or footprint in aftermath carnage.

I could see any scenario with this little info jayme grabbed. , gun point into trunk, accomplice grabs her as she leaves.

What I can’t figure out who in the hell ended 911 call. Wouldn’t perp be breathing heavy as he disconnects ??

Maybe jayme dials right after shooting .. then hangs up has 2 perps sound like there walking in ... dunno...

 

[spiderbud]

I think I can see what you mean, do you mean with the picture leaning forward some so that it "appears" to be over the wood edge?

Yep, initially it looked like broken wood to me, now we can clearly see that it is indeed a photograph.

 

[JenniD]

I'm leaning towards LE moving things around. But, just another fact we don't know for sure.IMO

A few threads back someone provided a possible floor plan of the house. With it being an open floor plan it may have a stairway to the basement right behind this cabinet. I have an open floor plan and sometimes it can be a struggle with furniture placement. If the kitchen is to the right of the door the china cabinet might work well there
If James was shot to the right side of the door he could have fallen back into the kitchen area therefore leaving the stuff in the cabinet undisturbed