2010.02.09 New motion filed by defense TES search records

[Spangle]

The Judge did rule for the defense originally and allowed for the defense to look at 32 records. Since then, the defense is showing that there are other records related to the case. (jj and the lady from New Jersey). Can anyone think why the Judge wouldn't rule to allow the defense to look at any other records that are related to the case?

I can.
1.) The ladies did not search the area under the direction of TES. TES would not have a record of that search.

2.) Judge has all ready ruled that the defense can go look at ALL the records. And to bring him names/files of folks with TES files that have been overlooked. And ONLY those files that he approved would be included. So the judge has all ready ruled and made plans for what to do if more files where found.

 

[LambChop]

OMG it has just hit me.....I KNOW what they are fishing for.........ZFG must have registered as a searcher, then dropped the body there. SERIOUSLY, that would be the smoking gun. KC would go free. Then LE could get on with finding the real killer. We all must be so stupid not to see this.

I guess the name hasn't been brought forward because is it filed under "F" or "G"?

Actually, TO, it's filed under "C" so Cindy can find it easily.

 

[cyberborg]

OMG it has just hit me.....I KNOW what they are fishing for.........ZFG must have registered as a searcher, then dropped the body there. SERIOUSLY, that would be the smoking gun. KC would go free. Then LE could get on with finding the real killer. We all must be so stupid not to see this.

I guess the name hasn't been brought forward because is it filed under "F" or "G"?

It is filed under C. Zenaida Gonzalez, just like the misfiled Sawgrass registration. I seen a C.

:dance:

 

[Spangle]

I think the judge should

1.) Ask the Defense if they have went and looked the files. If not, why not.

2.) Ask the Defense if they looked at the files and reviewed the record of these 2's TES files to SEE if they should be brought before the Judge. AS per the Judge's order on this issue.

If the Defense isn't going to use what is already give them, Follow the Judges orders and advice.. what is the point of going to the Judge in the first place??? The Judge should really ask JB this question or one like it.

If JB hasn't followed through with the file search and brought this up again, against TES, with no real proof, then the Judge should hold him accountable.

 

[logicalgirl]

32 + JJ + Lady from New Jersey = 34 2 records that Tes did not turn over to the defense. Could there be more? fair question in my opinion. Moo I am sure the Judge will do the right thing. Sooner or later, Jb is going to get these records. IMO

Aside from betraying the confidential information of 4000 searchers, and causing fear among those who may volunteer in the future because of it, what do you think will happen if JB eventually does get these records?

I'm interested in hearing what you think the next step will be. Do you think JB will find another authorized TES searcher, or even an unauthorized one? Then what do you think the next step would be beyond publicity?

Are you saying you don't believe the FBI experts, the coroner's report, about the roots and plant evidence growing through Caylee's remains? Are you saying you don't believe the bug experts about the bug life development while the remains lay there? Will one searcher's testimony saying the body wasn't there at such and such a time really challenge the experts testimony in court? Their testimony will be proven established scientific fact, using evidence accepted by precedent in prior trials. This is not "junk science". So is there something else you will think will happen? Because a searcher or four won't create reasonable doubt - IMO.:waitasec:

 

[marspiter]

JS is to nice of a guy. This has already been ruled on. JB has not followed the courts direction (ie gone down and looked at the files). If I were the judge I would go ahead and have a hearing on this.

As suggested I would ask JB & co. If they in fact have followed the courts order on the last motion of this kind. If not I would then remind JB of the deadline which was missed for his evidence to back up Todd's claims as well as other times he has wasted the courts time in this case. After doing so I would turn to the bailiff and have JB and AL placed in custody and sentence them to 48 hours in county jail along with a 500 dollar fine for contempt. I would also remind JB & co that every time they waste the courts time or don't follow court orders I will once again place them in contempt for doing so.

 

[LambChop]

JS is to nice of a guy. This has already been ruled on. JB has not followed the courts direction (ie gone down and looked at the files). If I were the judge I would go ahead and have a hearing on this.

As suggested I would ask JB & co. If they in fact have followed the courts order on the last motion of this kind. If not I would then remind JB of the deadline which was missed for his evidence to back up Todd's claims as well as other times he has wasted the courts time in this case. After doing so I would turn to the bailiff and have JB and AL placed in custody and sentence them to 48 hours in county jail along with a 500 dollar fine for contempt. I would also remind JB & co that every time they waste the courts time or don't follow court orders I will once again place them in contempt for doing so.

I loovvvveeee the way you think.

 

[kaRN]

I'm just wondering why, if the defense could prove last August that someone other than KC planted the body after she was in jail, why they even need the TES search records. I guess the defense lied......again lol!
In any case, what are they hoping for? Do they think that the people who converged on Orlando to search, were motivated to help the wrongly accused lying Mother or find the neglected child?
So they get the names of 1000+ hostile witnesses and spend the next 10 years deposing them while Mommy rots in solitary. What exactly does that achieve? Can't they just interview the people living in the area? I think I'd be on top of swampy conditions in my hood in areas my children were known to frequent.

 

[Just Jayla]

I was one of the volunteers with Tim Miller helping to search for sweet Caylee. At first I was so upset because bozo wanted the info. about all the volunteers. After thinking it over for the past few months I say give it to bozo. I would love to have the chance to tell bozo how all the the volunteers was doing the best to find a baby that we knew was dead and the sorry az mother , bozo and the grandmother was trying to stop Tim Millers search. I wish we were allowed to take pictures that day but was told we could not. Let the courts and bozo see first hand how it was impossible to cover every inch even tho we tried. Let them see the swamps and snakes and bugs and old people out in the swamps looking for Caylee. Let all the searchers takethe stand and tell them how hard it was, what we saw, what we could not get to, and the tears that most of all the seachers had when we could not find her and the search was called all. Go Ahead bozo call us to court!

Thank you for your efforts and your willingness to take this all the way for Caylee.
Sure wish the state could take the jury on a filed trip to the remains site. While the brush might not be as full as it was those days (although it may be, it is an ideal climate for rubust plant growth), the area directly accross the street can still give an idea of the brush, while the lower lying areas on the side of the remains site will show the drainage patterns. I am sure volunteers like you could easily describe to the jury exactly how she would have been missed in that area by searchers....Unless, of course, you knew to look for the pavers ahead of time.

 

[Kentjbkent]

The lady from New Jersey stated she went on her own to the Suburban site.

And FYI....I believe that there are posts in this forum from JJ soliciting "searchers" to join him that day he searched Suburban.....INDEPENDENTLY, NOT with TES

 

[notthatsmart]

Aside from betraying the confidential information of 4000 searchers, and causing fear among those who may volunteer in the future because of it, what do you think will happen if JB eventually does get these records?
I'm interested in hearing what you think the next step will be. Do you think JB will find another authorized TES searcher, or even an unauthorized one? Then what do you think the next step would be beyond publicity?

Are you saying you don't believe the FBI experts, the coroner's report, about the roots and plant evidence growing through Caylee's remains? Are you saying you don't believe the bug experts about the bug life development while the remains lay there? Will one searcher's testimony saying the body wasn't there at such and such a time really challenge the experts testimony in court? Their testimony will be proven established scientific fact, using evidence accepted by precedent in prior trials. This is not "junk science". So is there something else you will think will happen? Because a searcher or four won't create reasonable doubt - IMO.:waitasec:

Bold 1:
I believe the Judge will appoint a third party special master to look at all the records. If that person sees a document that is related to the case, they will turn that over to the Judge and the Judge will turn it over to both sides. If they do find a new witness that did search the area and did not see the body, then the defense will use that to make their claim that the body was not there. The defense may find away to thank all the other searchers for a noble effort.

Bold 2:
I do not believe Tes is the authority on searchers. All witnesses are equally important. They may find other searchers like Kw who searched that area. Also, police should have searched the area. They will be deposed.

As far as the experts go, their opinions are of 4 to 6 months or 3 to 6 months give or take. So in my opinion, it is an estimation. I have not seen cross examination of these experts. That is off topic so I appologize. Everything else is just my opinion.

 

[Kentjbkent]

32 + JJ + Lady from New Jersey = 34 2 records that Tes did not turn over to the defense. Could there be more? fair question in my opinion. Moo I am sure the Judge will do the right thing. Sooner or later, Jb is going to get these records. IMO

Um....I think your math is wrong.

32 TES searchers info TURNED OVER TO JB = 0 not turned over

One JJ searcher who did NOT represent TES on Suburban = 0

One NJ female searcher who did NOT represent TES on Suburban = 0

Searchers records turned over to Defense per JS = 0

And last I checked.....0 = 0 :dance:

 

[Intermezzo]

JS is to nice of a guy. This has already been ruled on. JB has not followed the courts direction (ie gone down and looked at the files). If I were the judge I would go ahead and have a hearing on this.

As suggested I would ask JB & co. If they in fact have followed the courts order on the last motion of this kind. If not I would then remind JB of the deadline which was missed for his evidence to back up Todd's claims as well as other times he has wasted the courts time in this case. After doing so I would turn to the bailiff and have JB and AL placed in custody and sentence them to 48 hours in county jail along with a 500 dollar fine for contempt. I would also remind JB & co that every time they waste the courts time or don't follow court orders I will once again place them in contempt for doing so.

http://itsamysterytome.wordpress.co...f-the-padillas-dick-and-mclaughlin-is-denied/
"Baez WILL have access, however, to the records of TES searchers, but it will be limited to interviewing the 32 people that were searching within 200 yards of where Caylee’s remains were eventually located. They will be able to go through the rest of TES records to try and identify more people that might have been in close proximity to Caylee’s remains, and I suppose if they turn anyone else up, they will be able to interview them as well."

BBM
Definitely looks like the Defense did not to as instructed by Judge S since they filed another Motion.

 

[notthatsmart]

JS is to nice of a guy. This has already been ruled on. JB has not followed the courts direction (ie gone down and looked at the files). If I were the judge I would go ahead and have a hearing on this.

As suggested I would ask JB & co. If they in fact have followed the courts order on the last motion of this kind. If not I would then remind JB of the deadline which was missed for his evidence to back up Todd's claims as well as other times he has wasted the courts time in this case. After doing so I would turn to the bailiff and have JB and AL placed in custody and sentence them to 48 hours in county jail along with a 500 dollar fine for contempt. I would also remind JB & co that every time they waste the courts time or don't follow court orders I will once again place them in contempt for doing so.

Why would the defense go down and look at the 32 volunteers records if Mn already gave them to him?

 

[notthatsmart]

Um....I think your math is wrong.

32 TES searchers info TURNED OVER TO JB = 0 not turned over

One JJ searcher who did NOT represent TES on Suburban = 0

One NJ female searcher who did NOT represent TES on Suburban = 0

Searchers records turned over to Defense per JS = 0

And last I checked.....0 = 0 :dance:

Bold: Do you have a link that shows JJ was not a searcher for Tes and did not search that area and did not document it? Because the Motion in November with JJ sworn statement shows he did. IMO Perhaps I am mistaken, but thats what I thought I read. Moo

 

[Just Jayla]

OK...my blood is boiling right now....first off, to quote the "seasoned defense lawyer who is respected by her peers" (referring to AL, as stated in a prior post)......"this is a witch hunt"....she's right...thats what THIS is....the defense motions to get ALL of TES records, is just that!!

First off, the defense has compared the publics opinion of KC to Sam Shepard, Osama bin Laden, probably others I've forgotten, NOW, it's a "witch hunt". It's everything else BUT a "real" defense of their client.

Respectfully snipped and BBM-Sam Shepard aside....comparing her to a terrorist who killed three people that I knew and thousands more that I did not, a man that will get access to benefit of the doubt in our courts over my dead body, that continues to kill my husbands soldier brothers-Is not even a comparison, its hyperbole.

I don't hate KC like I hate Osama Bin Laden-I could take him out and not think twice about it. KC is one of my own countrymen, so it's more personal than that-I have no desire to put a bunker buster in her hind side, but Osama, well.... I have more willingness to presume her innocent than I ever would for Bin Laden.

AL's client gets to exercise her rights. Her client could confess, or give us information that exonerates her if she had it, so that she eludes the DP. Her client is not a terrorist as we have come to know the term.
Osama gets no rights, he only gets a bounty on his filthy head. Osama has confessed to his guilt and would be a martyr upon his death.
Apples, oranges, terrorists, baby killers. I mean, if AL really wants to compare the two, I guess it could be pointed out the OBL never hurt his own children. In fact, his son Omar bailed on Osama in Afghanistan, told him he could not do jihad-OBL patted him on the head and sent him back to Saudi Arabia unscathed.

The language and tone of these motions could use a little more focus on the law (or JS's prior rulings, hellloooo!), and a little less focus on the state, TES's, MN's,. or the public's opinion of KC. There is a time and a place to address KC's character or her character assasinations, in pertinent motions. They are leaving room for the state to come back and point out that no real law is cited in these other motions, because the defense keeps getting so hung up on their poor KC tangent.

 

[marspiter]

Why would the defense go down and look at the 32 volunteers records if Mn already gave them to him?

Please refer to Intermezzo's post and the bolded part in that post. JB is asking for all of TES's records. That is the part that has been ruled on. JB has failed to comply with the court order. Failure to comply with a court order in an effort to disrupt the court is an issue that can land one in contempt if the judge so chooses.

 

[Spangle]

Bold 1:
I believe the Judge will appoint a third party special master to look at all the records. If that person sees a document that is related to the case, they will turn that over to the Judge and the Judge will turn it over to both sides. If they do find a new witness that did search the area and did not see the body, then the defense will use that to make their claim that the body was not there. The defense may find away to thank all the other searchers for a noble effort.

WHY should the court do that? When JB all ready can do that, but hasn't??

Bold 2:
I do not believe Tes is the authority on searchers. All witnesses are equally important. They may find other searchers like Kw who searched that area. Also, police should have searched the area. They will be deposed.

As far as the experts go, their opinions are of 4 to 6 months or 3 to 6 months give or take. So in my opinion, it is an estimation. I have not seen cross examination of these experts. That is off topic so I appologize. Everything else is just my opinion.

I don't think that is the issue. The issue is that TES wouldn't have the info on all those other searchers like KW, who went out their on their own. Hence, they would not have that info to keep from the defense.

No amount of looking at the files are going to drag up info on unregistered searches or searchers.

 

[Intermezzo]

http://wdbo.com/common/pdf/orlando/AnthonyMotion-8-10-3.pdf

In this Defense Motion Subpoena Decus Tecum they themselves narrow down the information they are seeking Records in the Possession of TES, relating to the search on Suburban.Drive employees, members and/or volunteers who searched the wooded area around which Caylee's remains were found

.NeJame and TES complied with that, they handed over the records of those they had assigned to search that area.

JJ and LB did both admit they searched on their own, apart from TES and in neither statement did they say they informed TES or handed records over to TES of their search.

 

[Spangle]

Why would the defense go down and look at the 32 volunteers records if Mn already gave them to him?

JB was given access to ALL the records to look through. Not just the 32.

He was given copies of the 32.

If during reviewing ALL the records, he found any that should be included in the 32, he was to report the names to the judge. Then the judge would review the file and decided if they should be included with the 32. IF the Judge agrees, then that file would be given to the Defense.