2010.04.22 NANCY GRACE:Flora Hollars and Annette Sykes Debate

[Adalena935]

Yes GMS always makes sense when she talks, is calm, does not tell what LE dosen't want told and she does not talk about other people, not a gossip. I like GMS and always have she tells it like it is but has always remained dignified as some of the "others" have not.

Not always though. Her rolling her eyes and cocking her head back when the other grandmother began to speak was childish and rude I thought. Especially when the other grandmother haden't even begun to say anything - yet.

That's not to say I don't pity the both of them. I do very much. Their position is not enviable.

 

[CathyinTexas]

Chelsea on the line!

She thinks Flo is lying- says Misty wouldn't have sat there and listened to Haleigh crying like that. Says she called and tried to get them to search a certain area after a letter from Misty implicating Joe.

Misty did point at Joe. Didn't she also cut off the relationship with Tommy by putting a restraining order on him? She implicated him in another crime. A restraining order is usually because a person feels in danger from another person. Could that have been a hint to look at Tommy? This is all so confusing, and I am shocked at the words coming out of Grandma Flo's mouth, but it her own family she is accusing, why would she do that if it wasn't what she was told by someone in the family?

 

[Pensfan]

Everything we're hearing feels like a smokescreen. I feel like theres something bigger. Drug involvement is big, but the issues with GUNS seems to be ignored. We know abt at least two guns involved with these folks. So whats with guns. What kind of crimes are left unsolved in this area? Home invasions, murders, robberys, meth labs, what else is going on Putnam county or the surrounding area? Mr Cummings sounded sure that somebody "stole" Haleigh. He had to have a good reason to jump to that conclusion. I would very much like to know why he reacted that way.

Maybe this answers your question?
The Croslins say about two weeks before Haleigh disappeared, Joe and Haleigh's dad, Ronald Cummings, had an issue over a gun. "He stole Ronald's gun. One morning, on the porch, he said, 'Ronald will get what's coming to him.' It was dropped, he left and Haleigh was gone," says Lisa Croslin.

http://www.firstcoastnews.com/video/default.aspx?bctid=49248267001

 

[Zoe Bogart]

I wasn't implying that misty wasn't responsible. I wasn't clear...sorry. Misty may have either found Haleigh deceased or caused it; then she called for help on what to do.

Ron could be the one or her brother or JO. .. don't know...but either way rc will cover his butt. Misty may even killed her but told rc she died from drugs. He winds up responsible for it either way. RC is all into how the public perceives him. He wants to be known as a good,hard working dad. He either knows who took Haleigh and disposed of her or misty herself staged the scene.

IOW, she may be responsible for the death but can't deal with it so she retreats under a cover.

BBM
I watched a clip from when R & M had just gotten married and RC was singing his own praises about what a hard-working father he was, and he hadn't worked since Haleigh vanished, so that raised my eyebrows.

Your scenario could have happened that way. So many choices, we can't pick just one. :shakehead:

 

[LancelotLink]

Does MC ever say that she discovered Hayleigh was missing or does she instead say she was gone?

 

[Wise Old Owl]

I wasn't implying that misty wasn't responsible. I wasn't clear...sorry. Misty may have either found Haleigh deceased or caused it; then she called for help on what to do.

She called her brother or JO. .. don't know...but either way rc will cover his and her butts. Misty may even killed her but told rc she died from drugs. He winds up responsible for it either way. RC is all into how the public perceives him. He wants to be known as a good,hard working dad. He either knows who took Haleigh and disposed of her or misty herself staged the scene and never told him. I do think he always knew she was gone forever when he told misty to phone 911.

IOW, she may be responsible for the death but can't deal with it so she retreats under a cover.

But see that's where I don't get it. IF Haleigh OD'd - and RC was at "werk" - then he is only responsible for negligence. Its a he said/she said on "whose" drugs there were that Haleigh got a hold of. MC was the caregiver and should have been diligent in making sure Haleigh didn't get a hold of anything.

Plus, it could have been put off on ToC or JO - THEY brought the drugs to the MH.

Would have RC lost Jr over it? Maybe / probably. But as for RC being charged with negligent homicide - nope. The negligent homicide would have fallen squarely on MC.

 

[Pensfan]

Does MC ever say that she discovered Hayleigh was missing or does she instead say she was gone?

In which of her many versions are you referring?

 

[trigger]

GGMS leaves 7:30 - 8:00 Then we have reported rumors that RC and MC got into a fight around 8:30 (that's when MC shut her phone off). But MC says she was doin' laundry around that time and that's when Haleigh went to bed "cause she has school!"

Another thing I never understood is why on the police report there is only one phone listed. The MH did not have a land line. MC supposedly had a cell and so did RC - but if you look on the report, there is only one phone listed (IIRC it is RC's).

The phone records of all involved will tell the story. Man, would I love to get my hands on those!!!!!!

LE has to have SO MUCH MORE than we could imagine - so why no arrest?

:woohoo:

If they would only release everything they have we sleuthers would have the perp in a weekend...

 

[bessie]

BBM
I watched a clip from when R & M had just gotten married and RC was singing his own praises about what a hard-working father he was, and he hadn't worked since Haleigh vanished, so that raised my eyebrows.

Your scenario could have happened that way. So many choices, we can't pick just one. :shakehead:

In the first interview, the one where he falls on the ground crying, he makes a big point of saying he was at werk earning an honest living, or words to that effect. That interview on the heels of the very strange 911 call sent my hinky meter through the roof.

 

[Adalena935]

It was either Cobra or LP who just said on a radio show this weekend that when talking to Misty, it's like talking to three different people, all named Misty. She's a chameleon, can change with the wind.

Thanks for the links. I don't know who Cobra or LP is. I think it's common for criminals to hide what they are. The better to carry out their crimes I suppose.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

The kids not having shirts on while eating supper is not that strange I suppose. I remember when my kids were toddlers and eating something particularly messy that would stain, they got stripped down. Was just easier to let them finish up supper and then plop them right in the tub for clean up.

Were your kiddies outside, shirtless, in early FEBRUARY, in the cold? These kids were supposedly eating dinner out on the screen porch, after dark, in about 50+ degree weather. Not good.

 

[Amster]

ooops....never mind on the laundry question....had the days mixed up.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Thanks for the links. I don't know who Cobra or LP is. I think it's common for criminals to hide what they are. The better to carry out their crimes I suppose.

Bounty Hunters. Cobra (Staubs) and Padilla, the man in the cowboy hat.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

Whisp, I took what GGMS said to mean that MC put shirts on the kids...JMOOOC.

ANNETTE SYKES, HALEIGH`S GREAT-GRANDMOTHER: I stopped by about 7:30 to drop off some laundry that I had done. I always did the children`s laundry just because it`s something I`ve always done. And the children were on the front porch with Misty. They were eating supper. And when we drove up, Haleigh jumped out of her chair and come running up and gave me a hug. And Junior came out and gave me a hug, and I gave them a kiss. And Misty walked out. She helped carry some of the clothes into the house and got the children`s shirts on, and they got back up to eat supper. I gave them a kiss, told them good-bye, and I got back in the car and left.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1004/22/ng.01.html

That statement "they got back up" to me means they got back up on the porch.

I think she is still keeping herself out of the trailer.

I find it strange that Haleigh ran out in the dark to her.

 

[KeenEyes]

I think Grandmothers are colluding to keep Ron and Misty in contact with each other. How else can you account for them speaking as if they knew each other. Lindsay says she had only had contact with Hollars twice in 7 years. Misty went to TN to see her Granny. There is no mention of Granny Hollars visiting FL. Now, what if the grandmothers are talking and carrying information for Ron and Misty.

What if Hollars began this conversation as a means to keep Misty out of trouble and discovered there was no way to help her? Is Hollars working with someone inside LE? My head hurts!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

and wasn't GGS awfully diplomatic towards GGH. She completely circumnavigated NG's question to her about GGH's accusations of Ron by responding as if GGH had only implied that Ron was indirectly responsible due to his leaving the children with Misty. Also, when GGS initially discussed the dock search tonight she said GENERALLY that apparently SOMEONE had called in a tip to LE. She only admits that GGH called her directly regarding the tip and potential search site when GGH pressed her. It confirms for me that GGS can conceal info calmly and with a straight face.

ETA1: hadn't finished reading the thread when I posted this. It seems some think GGS is mindful of what LE has asked the family not to discuss, so this might account for her speaking in general terms as described in this post.
ETA2: be sure to read post #616 in regards to ETA1.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

ooops....never mind on the laundry question....had the days mixed up.

Hey it is late!!

But really why didn't they get the laundry when they went there in the morning, remember the mad dash for the outfit?

 

[Zoe Bogart]

In the first interview, the one where he falls on the ground crying, he makes a big point of saying he was at werk earning an honest living, or words to that effect. That interview on the heels of the very strange 911 call sent my hinky meter through the roof.

Between yesterday and tonight, I watched quite a few of their interviews and listened to the 911 tape and other tapes, and dang if he didn't mention being at werk in nearly every one, and most of the time, more than once.

 

[Beyond Belief]

Thats one mention of a the gun, but why do these people want these guns?
If Ron suspected Joe had "stole" Haleigh, he would have cranked up his car and headed that way immediately. You heard him on the 911 tape, he had other people to talk too rather than the 911 operator.
There is something bigger with guns. Blackmarket gun selling, trading guns for drugs, something deeper and bigger than penny ante drug selling.
Theres something that hasn't come forward to the public, but LE probably has a handle on whatever it is.

I wonder if there was a drug deal going down and Haleigh got hurt. Probably not at the MH. The threat of family harm from outsiders would cause this family group to be stuttering over what happened just like their doing. Theres a lot of not nice people out there in the world.

I am rattling but theres just something else, I do not believe Haleigh was the target of harm from any of this family. She got hurt and ended up dying, but what in the world were they doing to put her in that danger?

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Hey it is late!!

But really why didn't they get the laundry when they went there in the morning, remember the mad dash for the outfit?

Perhaps it GGS hadn't gotten the stains out of everything by that time. "No, you can't take these, they have STAINS."

Good point.

 

[Adalena935]

Does MC ever say that she discovered Hayleigh was missing or does she instead say she was gone?

Those words are interchangeable. She says so many dif stories. She said she got up & she wasn't there. She couldn't find her, etc. etc. etc. Every day the news reported a variation on her numerous stories. None of them matching the last. I mean literally every day she came up with a new and varrying story.