2010.07.09 - Evidence List for Inspection

[sleutherontheside]

Are these the guys (husband and wife) who are featured on tv in such crime (magazine) shows as "48 hours"? Could CBS be paying?

Yep. And I always say.....anything is possible.

 

[sleutherontheside]

Something else to consider........ regarding LCN analysis.......touch DNA.....

http://www.promega.com/profiles/1301/1301_03.html



As a subset of this issue, the legal question that will need to be addressed is: Is this a novel scientific procedure, or is this simply a modification/enhancement of an already generally accepted scientific technique? The answer to that question, by a court, will determine whether a Frye or Daubert hearing will be required before such evidence is admissible in that particular jurisdiction.




Contamination

As we know, contamination can occur at various stages of a case involving forensic samples.
Contamination can occur in the lab.
Contamination can occur in the recovery and collection of the evidence at the crime scene.


Consumption of the Sample

Certainly one of the legal issues that we will see with LCN concerns the consumption of the sample.

The consumption of the sample will be likely to result in a variety of motions and legal maneuvers by defense attorneys who will claim that they are prejudiced by the consumption of the sample. The likely argument will be that because they can no longer conduct their own examination of the material they are thus prejudiced



Sooooooooooooooooo........I can't help but wonder if this is a bit of "tit for tat". The SA wants to use air samples and the defense responds by their intent to use "touch DNA" to counter / balance the evidence.

 

[ThinkTank]

It annoys me that the Inmate will be impressed with her Defense team getting these "famous" experts to come on the case. I hope that optimism is short lived however. The expert's findings can only lead to one conclusion, if the experts are honest and have integrity.

 

[LambChop]

There wasn't even Caylee's DNA on the tape because of the remains being underwater. What can they possibly test? If the victim's DNA is not present after having been placed across her face what do they hope to accomplish??? Or are these experts going by what JB is saying that the remains were placed there while KC was in jail. jmo

 

[sleutherontheside]

http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news...asey-anthony-experts-20100712,0,4716386.story

IMO ... my thoughts are ..... There is no guarantee that these experts will find anything, or come to any conclusion, that is "helpful" to the accused baby murderer.
I have to believe that when all of their inspection and later testing is done, the experts with any integrity will not get on the witness stand and make statements that are not true, or which are meant to confuse the jury (for reasonable doubt).
Just because any person is on the Defense Witness List, it does not guarantee that they will be called to testify at trial, in favor of the Defendant.

For example - Dr. Werner Spitz who actually did an autopsy of Caylee's remains - he is not included in the Defense team now. Same with Dr. Kathy Reichs. She even went on national tv and talked about her work on this case, yet she is not on the Defense team now.

My question is .... does a Defense expert have to be on the Defense witness list, in order to be allowed to inspect the evidence? It does not seem right to me, that the Defense is allowed to bring in people/experts who the State know nothing about. There are new names coming to inspect the evidence, who are NOT on the Defense witness list.
Such as:
Nicholas Petraco, an associate professor of chemistry and forensic science at John Jay College of Criminal Justice in New York City. [this is where Dr. Kobilinsky is from]

Dutch forensic scientists Richard and Selma Eikelenboom, pioneers in the field of "Touch DNA. [the DNA is also Dr. Kobilinsky's area of expertise]

BBM.....

I would imagine that this is perhaps one of the reasons that JB DIDN'T want any cameras. Recall his comments during the last hearing about filming faces and people not wanting to be identified (or something to that effect).

Perhaps JB wanted to "keep secret" the identity of "experts" he brought in so that the "general public" (like us) wouldn't speculate, theorize, or discuss their involvement.

Perhaps if he intended to bring in a plethora of "experts" he could then add only those that would "support the defense position". Perhaps video identification of "discarded experts" could have created issues for them????

Just wondering.

 

[RR0004]

There wasn't even Caylee's DNA on the tape because of the remains being underwater. What can they possibly test? If the victim's DNA is not present after having been placed across her face what do they hope to accomplish??? Or are these experts going by what JB is saying that the remains were placed there while KC was in jail. jmo

If anything, I would think he would go for contamination (he did allude to some "problem" during the hearing), but...you're right...there's nothing there. What can he possibly say...there was DNA there (that would obviously prove his client innocent), but LE destroyed it?

 

[MADJGNLAW]

I was not sure where to post this list with the names of the experts that are coming in today, mod's please move as needed.

A line of 5 all star defense experts will be rolling into the Orange County Sheriffs Office Tuesday AM
Anthony defense brings in the all stars
Updated: Monday, 12 Jul 2010, 11:04 PM EDT

"Snip" http://www.myfoxorlando.com/dpp/news/web_links/071210-Anthony-defense-brings-in-the-all-stars

By Holly Bristow FOX 35 News

ORLANDO, Fla. (WOFL FOX 35) - A line of 5 all star defense experts will be rolling into the Orange County Sheriffs Office along with Casey Anthony's defense team Tuesday morning.

Trace evidence expert Dr. Richard Eikelenboom from Holland is know for his expertise in touch DNA.



Dr. Nick Petraco is a criminalist who specializes in hair banding. Tennis says he'll likely be concentrating on a hair that investigators found in Casey Anthony's trunk.

Dr. Timothy Huntington is an Entomologist. Potential evidence released has said that investigators found coffin flies in Casey Anthony's car.

Crime scene expert Dr. Henry Lee already looked at Casey Anthony's car. Dr. Lee found several hairs in Casey's trunk that the Orange County Sheriffs Office overlooked.

Dr. Thelma Eikelenboom, a coroner and evidence expert. Tennis tells believes that since the Orange County coroner ruled Caylee's death 'death homicide by undetermined means" Eilelenboom may try to come up with her own theory on cause of death based on the evidence at hand.

Casey Anthony's murder trial is set to begin on May 9, 2011.

 

[Jomo]

There wasn't even Caylee's DNA on the tape because of the remains being underwater. What can they possibly test? If the victim's DNA is not present after having been placed across her face what do they hope to accomplish??? Or are these experts going by what JB is saying that the remains were placed there while KC was in jail. jmo

I thought that the VIEWING was supposed to be exactly that, a VIEWING. Don't tell me dude from the Netherlands is going to pull out his (duct) tape and try and sample for touch DNA. I hope the SA and LE have quick eyes and make sure that no one has any contaminants with them. How does JB say it?...Oh yeah...spoiliation of the evidence.

 

[LambChop]

I thought that the VIEWING was supposed to be exactly that, a VIEWING. Don't tell me dude from the Netherlands is going to pull out his (duct) tape and try and sample for touch DNA. I hope the SA and LE have quick eyes and make sure that no one has any contaminants with them. How does JB say it?...Oh yeah...spoiliation of the evidence.

It would be interesting to ask this expert if, in fact, the body was placed there AFTER KC was back in jail and there was no water if there would be DNA from Caylee on the tape. We know from testing that there was no DNA, not from Caylee, KC or anyone because her body was in water for so long. If there should have been DNA and that question is asked of the defense's experts that could hurt them big time if defense is headed down that path, which it appears they are...... jom

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

By Rebecca Kanable

You look for fingerprints at the crime scene. You look for DNA. But should you be looking for DNA from fingerprints? It's something to think about.

In the United Kingdom (UK), forensic scientists have been performing DNA typing from fingerprints for several years. Dr. Peter Gill of the UK's Forensic Science Service says analyzing DNA from fingerprints proves valuable in any investigation where there is a lack of body fluid, such as blood. This is especially helpful he says where there is a forced entry/burglary and the perpetrator may have touched a door handle, for example. Or, he adds in the case of a vehicle crime, a steering wheel usually will yield DNA from the driver.

While DNA typing from fingerprints is commonplace in the UK, don't rush your evidence to the laboratory just yet. This type of analysis is not common in the United States and standards for this analysis method have not been set by the Scientific Working Group for DNA Analysis Methods (SWGDAM). (Some of the organization's guidelines can be found by going to the FBI Web site, www.fbi.gov, and doing a search for "SWGDAM.")

more at the link:
http://www.officer.com/print/Law-Enforcement-Technology/DNA-from-Fingerprints/1$25197


What happened to JB and his "junk science" theories??? I thought he doesn't believe in junk science...JMHO

Not too sure if this will fly in the USA...seems it's not a proven method for evidence analysis...so, we shall see what the SA's have to say on this...JMHO



Justice for Caylee

 

[ThinkTank]

I wonder why these media outlets do not report WHO is present at the evidence inspection on behalf of the State/Prosecutors? I also would like to know who on the Defense team is present at the evidence inspection, and who on the Defense team is in Tennessee doing the Oak Ridge Lab depositions?

MuzikMan got the amended deposition documents and will post them to his docstoc site today.
The depositions of the Oak Ridge Lab personnel was NOT postponed - only the "location" of the depositions was changed. So, LDBurdick and Ashton must be in Tennessee today and tomorrow, while the evidence inspection is taking place.

 

[Omachka]

Just reported on the noon news on WFTV. Kathy B. says the defense is going to try and keep this list away from the news and has officially filed an objection to the release of the list. They refused to answer her questions about that and CM kind of pushed past her when she asked him. She then said that the Sheriff's Dept would be video taping this inspection and that the video would be public record so she will be requesting a copy of the videos from the Sheriff as soon as it's available. Here is a link with part of the story and a copy of the objection.

 

[zoey]

Just reported on the noon news on WFTV. Kathy B. says the defense is going to try and keep this list away from the news and has officially filed an objection to the release of the list. They refused to answer her questions about that and CM kind of pushed past her when she asked him. She then said that the Sheriff's Dept would be video taping this inspection and that the video would be public record so she will be requesting a copy of the videos from the Sheriff as soon as it's available. Here is a link with part of the story and a copy of the objection.

why do they always think that they need to pull something over everyone?? Is it due to their defense or lack there of?????? I get so tired of them wanting everything to be a secret of some sort yet anything else and its someone playing games with them....Lordy!!!! :waitasec:

 

[Omachka]

why do they always think that they need to pull something over everyone?? Is it due to their defense or lack there of?????? I get so tired of them wanting everything to be a secret of some sort yet anything else and its someone playing games with them....Lordy!!!! :waitasec:

I think it's smoke and mirrors. They are causing a big stink here so that the media won't be looking elsewhere... perhaps the fact that they are flying experts in from the Netherlands? Too late.. they are reporting on that too. I want to know who paid for that.

 

[Macushla]

I would imagine the defense contacted a number of different experts over the last 6 months or more. I am sure they sent them copies of the reports that were done by the State's experts and which were released in the numerous document dumps and asked their opinions. IF they received a reply saying - I disagree with these reports, then the defense probably contacted these experts and that is how they became part of the defense team.

I can't imagine the defense bringing people in if they have no idea whether or not they are going to agree with the State or disagree with the state. I am almost positive that the experts who are here have already disagreed with the experts from the State and will continue to do so. Even JB can't be foolish enough to hire someone without having a good idea of what they are going to say - or can he?

 

[Muzikman]

I noticed in Cheney's motion, he forgot to notice the Media. Oops! And cited no case law, just a bunch of crybaby gobbleygook. Jeez....

WESH's noon report, with some good video footage:

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMg61SOS-xU[/ame]

 

[Reagan]

Just reported on the noon news on WFTV. Kathy B. says the defense is going to try and keep this list away from the news and has officially filed an objection to the release of the list. They refused to answer her questions about that and CM kind of pushed past her when she asked him. She then said that the Sheriff's Dept would be video taping this inspection and that the video would be public record so she will be requesting a copy of the videos from the Sheriff as soon as it's available. Here is a link with part of the story and a copy of the objection.

The defense objecting to the release of this list is more blather that Judge Perry wasn't having the last time. He already said he cannot control what the media does.

They need new arguments. "Oh the media will take it out of context, Poor KC wont get a fair trial... waaahh".

Give me a break.

P.S Why is Luka commenting on this case (See news thread)? Is he hard up for work now that LA isn't his client anymore? Why wont these people just go away.

 

[beach]

I noticed in Cheney's motion, he forgot to notice the Media. Oops! And cited no case law, just a bunch of crybaby gobbleygook. Jeez....

*snipped video* BBM

Sheesh, AGAIN. :shakehead:

Like your sig line quoting JA, MM: "This pretense of ignorance is getting old."

 

[ThinkTank]

I noticed in Cheney's motion, he forgot to notice the Media. Oops! And cited no case law, just a bunch of crybaby gobbleygook. Jeez....

WESH's noon report, with some good video footage:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mMg61SOS-xU

This video shows Jeff Ashton at the evidence inspection.
They say nothing about LDBurdick?
Baez and Mason are also at the evidence inspection .... so, I guess LKBaden is doing the depositions of the Oak Ridge Lab people in Tennessee?

 

[marspiter]

I thought the judge seemed fully aware in the hearing the games the defense has been and is being subjected to. Well the defense will now finally have the tips from two years ago at least (pretty sad they didn't get those way back then.) Hopefully soon they'll get to examine some of the "evidence". Finally. And not in an unairconditioned garage, LOL.

There are no games being played by the SA. There was a fee attached to the records the defense was requesting. The State is allowed to assess a fee to any public records requests. IE tips given to a LE agency. This fee is usually used to cover the cost of copies and for someone to copy and compile the records being requested. Here is a link regarding fees for records.

http://www.myflsunshine.com/sun.nsf/sunmanual/8EF55371C466B09A852566F30070A187

Specifically I'd like to point out clause number 3.

"3. Does Ch. 119, F.S., exempt certain individuals (such as indigent persons or inmates) from paying statutory fees to obtain copies of public records?

Chapter 119, F.S., does not contain a provision that prohibits agencies from charging indigent persons or inmates the applicable statutory fee to obtain copies of public records. See Roesch v. State, 633 So. 2d 1, 3 (Fla. 1993) (indigent inmate not entitled to receive copies of public records free of charge nor to have original state attorney files mailed to him in prison; prisoners are "in the same position as anyone else seeking public records who cannot pay" the required costs); Potts v. State, 869 So. 2d 1223 (Fla. 2d DCA 2004) (no merit to inmate's contention that Ch. 119, F.S., entitles him to free copies of all records generated in his case); Alexis v. State, 732 So. 2d 46 (Fla. 3d DCA 1999) (indigent defendant not entitled to public records free of charge); and Yanke v. State, 588 So. 2d 4 (Fla. 2d DCA 1991), review denied, 595 So. 2d 559 (Fla. 1992), cert. denied, 112 S.Ct. 1592 (1992) (prisoner must pay copying and postage charges to have copies of public records mailed to him)."

HTH.